Version 2.1.7

[coffee-factorio]

The one that really flummoxes me is people talking like asteroid collectors are worthless without being higher quality. I mean, sure I can see that the arms would give them a lot more throughput, and maybe that would be important in specialized industrial platforms, but my platforms are drowning in asteroids with just the common variety collectors and I'd gain almost nothing by making them higher quality.

I... don't actually get that either. I'm usually pretty good at figuring out at least a story for someone's odd ideas.

Like for the quality parts, I have a real adverse reaction to upgrading from more than 2 grades of quality because at that point, you free up so much space that what you're looking at no longer seems fit for purpose. And you can end up in a situation where you have a lot of foundation in orbit, looking pretty.

The only place where collectors are truly valuable is in promethium operations, because you can usually overwhelm crushers everywhere else. Crushers also cover more space at higher quality but that's a situation where, that shouldn't be worth it.

[mmmPI]

I don't consider fluid voiding an exploit that needs a fix. This is complicated enough that 98% of factorio players need to copy a solution and once they do that I would say "let them do it, who cares?".

lol
https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=1157&v= ... e=youtu.be

Which is not what I am arguing. Space casino seems easy enough to build that you don't need to copy a blueprint or watch a video to do it.

It's quite the subjective appreciation of what is difficult, are you saying that using the single combinator connected to the foundy is too complicated for 98 % of the player and at the same time space casino seem easy enough to build that you don't need to copy a blueprint ?

Space Casino are similar to recycling loops in difficulty imo albeit there was a lot of back and forth with player insisting about the difficulty label, it doesn't really matter in the end, you can just compare, you have to deal with the same puzzle/ math and risk of clogging, it's little moroe constraint because you have to do it on a space platform imo. You can throw away stuff in space like in Lava in Vulcanus, but you can't use robots. You can surely use blueprints for anything, and although some are more difficult to use than others if you don't read the description in the end you can blueprint anything, so this is missing the point.

What was mentionned in the FFF was the yield, it gives "too much" for a single puzzle. If the difficulty was the problem i imagine it's easy enough to add byproducts or make it harder. But the "yield" was increasing with research, so it was changed much more severly, no more scaling with research on top of the removal of the productivity modules. At least that's how i understand it. If you consider the difficulty and not the yield, then currently you can make easy legendary material from space, the yield is just very bad and the scaling just give you more iron and copper ...

I feel the options that are "optimal" currently for quality are "less challenging" than a space casino, it's LDS shuffle, and sometimes fluid voiding , and recycling iron chest or underground pipes. and i'm saying that beyond my personnal preferences, i'm seeing what is being now proposed on tutorial and guides. You don't have to follow them, like you didn't have to do a space casino. I feel they are also "exploitish" even if the yield is lower, to me it still feels like there is something left to do.

[SerhiiS]

You guys are bringing up some conspiracy theories and YouTubers here. Actually, the removal of Space Casino and LDS Shuffle was discussed over a year ago on Reddit, and the developer made their final decision that both options would be removed in 2.1. YouTubers have nothing to do with it. This was a final and irrevocable decision over a year ago.
Removing Space Casino is just a single line of code. Balancing it requires thought and time...
It's unclear how to remove the LDS Shuffle from the game. Quality modules aren't used in the recipe. It uses legendary plastic. Therefore, even if LDS productivity were removed from the game, it would still give a +150% bonus with productivity modules, which wouldn't solve the problem. It would simply consume more plastic. And we won't get away from the fact that copper and steel are crafted from plastic, which sounds rather illogical. Therefore, the only way to ban the LDS Shuffle is to ban crafting LDS from legendary plastic. Apparently, the developers didn't have time to think about how to do this...

Regarding fluid voiding, it hasn't been discussed as a problem anywhere before. Personally, I see a problem here. It's solved in the same way as canceling a crafting item: if the factory can't empty the items inside, it doesn't change the recipe. For some reason, this only works with items. I don't see a problem with doing the same with liquids. Naturally, we're talking about automatic recipe changes. In a manual version, the items from the assembler will fall into your inventary, and the liquid will be destroyed. We're focusing on automatic fluid voiding here.
Also, if a game designer believes that automatic fluid voiding should be implemented, they should simply add a special building, for example, one that can be placed like an offshore pump, but instead of produces fluids, it draining it back in. Such buildings have long been available in the Bob Angel and Pianadon mods.

[Hurkyl]

You guys are bringing up some conspiracy theories and YouTubers here. Actually, the removal of Space Casino and LDS Shuffle was discussed over a year ago on Reddit, and the developer made their final decision that both options would be removed in 2.1. YouTubers have nothing to do with it. This was a final and irrevocable decision over a year ago.

Citation needed.

I mean this unironically; I heard this rumor ages ago and spent some time trying to track down where it came from to know what was actually said, but I couldn't find anyone who actually knew anything. I would like to know what the devs have actually said on the issue, if anything.

[coffee-factorio]

You guys are bringing up some conspiracy theories and YouTubers here. Actually, the removal of Space Casino and LDS Shuffle was discussed over a year ago on Reddit, and the developer made their final decision that both options would be removed in 2.1. YouTubers have nothing to do with it. This was a final and irrevocable decision over a year ago.

Citation needed.

I mean this unironically; I heard this rumor ages ago and spent some time trying to track down where it came from to know what was actually said, but I couldn't find anyone who actually knew anything. I would like to know what the devs have actually said on the issue, if anything.

https://www.reddit.com/r/factorio/comme ... erf_in_21/
I saved the thread. The only thing that's much different from what I can tell from reality is that "It was discussed sometime after this leak".