Version 2.0.45

[Panzerknacker]

Strongly agree with the achievement change, I always believed that only Default or harder settings should grant achievements. The speedrun community will adapt, new categories will be born.

Glad to see the captain back on board making important decissions for the better future of the game.

[Quadehar]

You guys take things way too seriously for a game... Speedrunners are a way more friendly and welcoming community than your superior intellect burdened by the ultimate knowledge of how the game should or shouldn't be played... You're just planting a strawman no one cared about in the middle on the field, and now we have to make a detour to avoid it. Sure, it's not that bad, sure we can adapt, but that's not the point.

You are on the same level of all those guys despising people who like pineapple on pizza for the so called reason that it's not real pizza. Factorio used to be able to make a tons of different kind of pizza for everyone. And now the hawaian is gone from the menu. Sure maybe not a lot of people loved it. Sure it's not the end of the world. Sure we won't die of hunger. Sure we'll certainly find another one that will approach it. But it won't be the same, and never will be anymore. We really liked it and never asked you to love it too. We were just happy to eat it in our little corner. And all it took for us to continue to be happy was for Wube to literally do nothing. And if the only thing you can say about it is "serves you right for not liking the pizza the way I like them", sir, you're not a good person.

[AntiElitz]

Yea, this was a mistake, I fixed it for the next release.

Since words and reasoning have clearly failed to move hearts or minds… there is only one course of action left. It is time for war!

I hereby officially challenge kovarex to a 1v1 Go match.
If he loses, the recent achievement-related changes must be rolled back.
If he wins, I will personally donate 100€ to a charity of his choice.

Yes, this is real. The challenge stands. Let the fate of the 100% community be decided on the goban.

[Panzerknacker]

100% community simply needs make a mod that allows achievements with the old settings. i can't believe it was ever intended you would be able to get achievements on a map with basically idle biters.

[Usul]

Hi! I am looking for a simple answer to this question:

I have an ongoing run of vanilla Space Age with the "Deathworld Marathon" unmodified preset. Will any achievement be disabled in that run with this update?

[DerekMac]

Yea, this was a mistake, I fixed it for the next release.

Since words and reasoning have clearly failed to move hearts or minds… there is only one course of action left. It is time for war!

I hereby officially challenge kovarex to a 1v1 Go match.
If he loses, the recent achievement-related changes must be rolled back.
If he wins, I will personally donate 100€ to a charity of his choice.

Yes, this is real. The challenge stands. Let the fate of the 100% community be decided on the goban.

I'll add $100 CAD to the charity

[mmmPI]

You guys take things way too seriously for a game
[...]
sir, you're not a good person.

[CaitSith2]

100% community simply needs make a mod that allows achievements with the old settings. i can't believe it was ever intended you would be able to get achievements on a map with basically idle biters.

The mod approach is dead simple. The mod just has to remove the "allowed_without_fight = false" from each of the achievements, then the old settings will work just fine. As a result, no need for WUBE to do anything. Just have a community accepted mod that allows the legacy 100% category to stick, needing the mod for 2.0.45 forward, so that all the other bug fixes can still be applied as normal, and the bug-fixed mode can deal with the biters as normal.

[Chindraba]

Hi! I am looking for a simple answer to this question:

I have an ongoing run of vanilla Space Age with the "Deathworld Marathon" unmodified preset. Will any achievement be disabled in that run with this update?

Yes.

Screenshot_20250417_102408.png (1.97 MiB) Viewed 1464 times

It stinks and they don't like it
It stinks and they do like it
Get off my lawn
Keeping your hands clean
Steam all the way
Raining bullets
No time for chitchat
There is no spoon
Work around the clock
Express delivery

Disabled.

Caveat: The change they make for Deathworld may preserve Deathworld Marathon as well.

Done

Deathworld also disables achievements. I can't imagine that's an intended effect?

Done (related to the absorbtion modifier bug

That can't be tested until it's released.

[Chindraba]

100% community simply needs make a mod that allows achievements with the old settings. i can't believe it was ever intended you would be able to get achievements on a map with basically idle biters.

The mod approach is dead simple. The mod just has to remove the "allowed_without_fight = false" from each of the achievements, then the old settings will work just fine. As a result, no need for WUBE to do anything. Just have a community accepted mod that allows the legacy 100% category to stick, needing the mod for 2.0.45 forward, so that all the other bug fixes can still be applied as normal, and the bug-fixed mode can deal with the biters as normal.

This plan could, if acceptable to the speedrunner community, 'solve', or circumvent, the problem there. All the achievements earned in said runs, however, will be non-Steam achievements unless some other so-called 'cheat' is also allowed.

I'm neither for or against the proposal. It's something interested parties - which excludes me - will have to work out. It does have knock-on effects, however, which also need to be acknowledged, and addressed.

World record for 100% achievement speedrun and zero Steam achievements does seem like it would feel 'fishy', and not European Perchy either.

[Biometrix]

10 dollar for the developer that reverts the change to the achievement behaviour.

So almost 1/3rd of the price of a game copy, and maybe 15/20 minutes of pay? Lmfao. Never gonna happen.

[pantabo1]

10 dollar for the developer that reverts the change to the achievement behaviour.

So almost 1/3rd of the price of a game copy, and maybe 15/20 minutes of pay? Lmfao. Never gonna happen.

please do not derail the discussion.

[GlassBricks]

As a note, a potential mod to revert to pre-.45 behavior won't be simple.
Removing allowed_without_fight allows you to set map generation to anything including more favorable map settings than before (e.g. biter nest size <100%).
So such a mod may be possible, but would require re-implementing the map gen settings check in the mod.

[Jap2.0]

[Kovarex says that] train world preset would still have achievements

Where did you see this?

[GlassBricks]

Adding to the "fix it with a mod" idea, speaking as a speedrun.com admin and one of the main contributes to 1.1 100% blueprints: I'm not sure that people would want to do runs with a mod. Having to run with that feels quite contrived. The same can be said of an "88%" category that excludes the biter-related achievements.
Just from reading the posts 100% runners here have already spoken, and also from talking to those who were considering running 100% in the future, even with a mod people may not be motivated to do run this version of 100%.

And if it becomes a new category, to reiterate what people have already said, it just wouldn't be the same. It would make 100% into just a longer, more tedious Default Settings, with less to distinguishing it from other categories.

[GlassBricks]

I see one main reason for the disapproval of the achievement is how sudden and arbitrary it feels: the biter achievement behavior has previously existed for nearly 10 years now, all through 1.0 and 1.1, and 6 months into space age; this behavior is even listed on the wiki. Then, it's suddenly overhauled without any warning, listed as just a "bug fix". A lot of us have a hard time seeing this as "fixing" any bug, and more like a complete change in behavior in its implications.

As such, I suggest that if this achievment behavior persists, it should be changed to be listed on the Changelog as a "Change" or even "Major change" instead of a bugfix. This way people at least know that this was an intentional change that the devs have put thought into.

[mmmPI]

the "hot fix" is kovarex announcing deathworld and train world preset would still have achievements

Where did you see this?

I'm basing this on those and from what i see in game :

viewtopic.php?p=669063#p669063
viewtopic.php?p=669124#p669124

The train world preset isn't explictly mentionned, so i may have spoke too soon here. I was explicitly mentionning the "hotfix" to explain that the complaints about "deathworld cancel achievement" were adressed already, and as such people continuing to post rant about that were unhelpful to me, as if they didn't understand the difference between 2.0.45 and what was already announced for later.

Testing in game currently the train world preset shows that most achievements are still available, and even ALL if you keep biters settings unchanged, trainworld would then just apply to ressource generation and allow for 100% run.

[mmmPI]

Adding to the "fix it with a mod" idea, speaking as a speedrun.com admin and one of the main contributes to 1.1 100% blueprints: I'm not sure that people would want to do runs with a mod. Having to run with that feels quite contrived. The same can be said of an "88%" category that excludes the biter-related achievements.

I talked about a 98% run that exclude the biter-related achievement ( for which i'd still have 100% respect), it's unfortunate to hear it would feel contrived, but i appreciate the feedback, i wanted to point that others also have mentionned the idea of making runs on a certain patch version, (2.0.44 ?) and i wonder if that would feel the same.

As such, I suggest that if this achievment behavior persists, it should be changed to be listed on the Changelog as a "Change" or even "Major change" instead of a bugfix. This way people at least know that this was an intentional change that the devs have put thought into.

this seems like it would very simple for devs to do, i have no idea how many internal consistency rules it would break but from the outside , it has been mentionned several times, it's probably "not good enough" for those that'd prefer a total revert, but apart from that their seem to be no down-side for anyone ?

[Jap2.0]

Thanks. My opinions on the change vary a bit depending on whether railworld is included or not.

[mmmPI]

Thanks. My opinions on the change vary a bit depending on whether railworld is included or not.

To be extra precise on the trainworld railworld, i tested in 2.0.45 , you need to modify the preset by allowing biters to expand again, ( a tickbox) and change back the time factor from 20 to 40 (the first slider in "evolution") and then the "railworld[modified]" has no achievement locked at start.

I would like to hear your opinion if you don't mind explaining how the inclusion changes things for you.

for me, i like rail worlds for 1) they are almost peaceful, 2) the scale correspond more to the timespan of my games ; And as i don't care about achievements so i don't have a strong opinion on this, but i understand the change as making railworld much more difficult IF you want to also get all the achievements as the 1) is removed.