Key combo for request group for ingredients

[mmmPI]

You can do just that with the setup i posted without need to mask the AM1.

[mrvn]

You can do just that with the setup i posted without need to mask the AM1.

Then you get AM1s in the requester chest for the AM2 plant that are not needed. Wasted resources. If you do this kind of setup for every entity that can be build in your mall then the wasted resources add up quickly.

[IsaacOscar]

For what it's worth, I generally agree with mrvn's arguments here.

In fact I have a few logistic groups specifically for requesting materials for handcrafting (yes I know I shouldn't be handcrafting, but it's often quicker and more convenient).

That being said, I've also been using the new ability to place ghost items in Assembler slots (which for some reason are delivered by construction bots, not logistic ones), and then manually counting how many I need for one ingredient, then putting tons in thw other slots. And have the bots remove any exvess once finished.
But that's annoying.

I'd also like an option for requester chests to decrease the request when items leave, so you don't have to remember to turn the request off when it's done.

[IsaacOscar]

As a side note: All items have a main recipe and altrernate recipes. You can see this in the Factoriopedia. My suggestion would just use the main recipe but it would also be easy to give a popup to select the recipe when multiple recipes are available. The alternate recipes are usually later in the game and for specialized buildings.

This is not true, see for example nutrients:

12-05-2024, 21-05-25.png (230.67 KiB) Viewed 518 times

Which causes the game to be inconsistent when choosing how to craft them (see viewtopic.php?p=646915#p646915).

[mmmPI]

Then you get AM1s in the requester chest for the AM2 plant that are not needed. Wasted resources. If you do this kind of setup for every entity that can be build in your mall then the wasted resources add up quickly.

This sound again like a user mistake to me. I would be curious to see the setup you mention, maybe my picture was not detailed enough for other user to replicate the system properly.

Considering using your suggestion for every entity that can be build in the mall is going to be very tedious, i thought it was for when you need 2 or 3 things quickly. But i clearly wouldn't recommand copy pasting and setting the multipler for each and every item of the mall, i would continue recommanding using combinators instead because you can just copy paste your setup.

In fact I have a few logistic groups specifically for requesting materials for handcrafting (yes I know I shouldn't be handcrafting, but it's often quicker and more convenient).

That's what the suggestion sounds for, because it started as " when i need 2 3 things quickly and i can't handcraft because i don't have the ingredient"

But it also seem that later recognizing that asking for incentive for manual crafting was not a good argument, it switched to something "for every entity that can be build in your mall".

I think what is important is to cap the output of the machine, the amount of ressources requested is of little importance regarding the vast majority of the item in a mall the 30 second or 1 recipe request is just fine because most material sits in chest most of the time.

This further highlight how the suggestion is in fact a request to make handcrafting easier, to me.

[IsaacOscar]

[quote=mmmPI post_id=649607 time=1733409296 user_id=22106]
That's what the suggestion sounds for, because it started as " when i need 2 3 things quickly and i can't handcraft because i don't have the ingredient"

But it also seem that later recognizing that asking for incentive for manual crafting was not a good argument, it switched to something "for every entity that can be build in your mall".

I think what is important is to cap the output of the machine, the amount of ressources requested is of little importance regarding the vast majority of the item in a mall the 30 second or 1 recipe request is just fine because most material sits in chest most of the time.

This further highlight how the suggestion is in fact a request to make handcrafting easier, to me.
[/quote]

It's not just handcrafting, it would be good in remote view when you can't handcraft.
Also, I think handcrafting should be made easier (in particular, reordering the crafting menu, and being able to type in the number of items you want to make).

I can't speek for mrvn though, their justifications seemed perfectly reasonable for non-handcrafting purposes.

(um, why is my quote block not being displayed properly?)

[IsaacOscar]

This sound again like a user mistake to me. I would be curious to see the setup you mention, maybe my picture was not detailed enough for other user to replicate the system properly.

Considering using your suggestion for every entity that can be build in the mall is going to be very tedious, i thought it was for when you need 2 or 3 things quickly. But i clearly wouldn't recommand copy pasting and setting the multipler for each and every item of the mall, i would continue recommanding using combinators instead because you can just copy paste your setup.

Hmm, I might use the trick with read ingredients and the multiplier, I don't know why I didn't think of it before.

That won't work however if you want a single machine to make something and it's intermediates.

For example, I have some foundries that make turbo belts, turbo underground belts, and turbo splitters. But I don't need a constant supply of them, just a stockpile. So I have the foundries change recipes based on whatever it is I'm low on.
But the foundries first need to make the express, fast, and transport variants.
So I have a buffer chest set up to request the appropriate amount of iron gears, iron plates, circuits, etc. But I had to manually to manually calculate how much to request.
If I had this feature, I could request a different logistic group for each of the various belts/splitters, and just delete from the requests the intermediate belts/splitters.

(As an aside, my setup was very hard to make and is stupidly slow because every time the recipes change, stuff gets moved to trash slots, that then have to be emptied before the new recipe will work; it's also annoying that I can't simultaneously read the contents of the machine and the ingredients to the recipe...)

[Koub]

[Koub] Merged several threads with the same suggestion.

[IsaacOscar]

[Koub] Merged several threads with the same suggestion.

This is also very similar to 123287

[mmmPI]

That won't work however if you want a single machine to make something and it's intermediates.

I don't see why this more refined use case couldn't be made to work, if the assembly change receipe, it will request different material in the chest, it's up to you to tick the "trash unrequested" or not, if you tick it, then that may create extra robot work when robots change the inputs but you are sure everything will fit in the requester chest. If you don't tick the box, the request from each successive building that the assembly craft will pile up on the chest.

If you have a foundry that only does belts and its intermediates, that may be worth it to not tick the box and consider there will not be enough different intermediate to overload the chest, but if you have an electromagnetic plant that does all the different modules and quality levels, you may want to.

If you already have some combinator logic to change recipe, you don't need a way to manually add the requested ingredient imo, that kinda go against the purpose of automating the change of recipe because then any "new" recipe unlocked will need to be copy pasted in the logic to change recipe, and also calculating the ingredient and adding them "manually". It's possible currently to request always enough intermediate for 1 or 2 or 3 products, with just a wire and a combinator, which saves the need to copy the settings and avoid the risk that the requester chest request too much initially, and also is always consistent regarding the recipe choosen for the product.

So I have a buffer chest set up to request the appropriate amount of iron gears, iron plates, circuits, etc. But I had to manually to manually calculate how much to request.

Currently you can use a requester chest, (set up to "trash unrequested" or not).

With the suggestion you would still need to calculate how much to request, manually, and input the numbers manually, to make sure that doesn't exceed the buffer chest capacity.

(As an aside, my setup was very hard to make and is stupidly slow because every time the recipes change, stuff gets moved to trash slots, that then have to be emptied before the new recipe will work; it's also annoying that I can't simultaneously read the contents of the machine and the ingredients to the recipe...)

I have a "worst setup" which changed recipe for the intermediate product as soon as an intermediate product was inserted to make a finished one. It was never ending and not doing anything. It worked apart for belts, assembly machines, modules, and capsules roughly. So i tried to give it a pal, another machine with a list of intermediate that would be excluded for the first machine. It sort of work, but i tried again a single machine this time with a memory cell, and another setup that read on roboports to try and not do the intermediate it could request. I don't have a "best setup". I'm still playing the game It feels to me that designing such setups are part of the fun in it.

[IsaacOscar]

I don't see why this more refined use case couldn't be made to work, if the assembly change receipe, it will request different material in the chest, it's up to you to tick the "trash unrequested" or not, if you tick it, then that may create extra robot work when robots change the inputs but you are sure everything will fit in the requester chest. If you don't tick the box, the request from each successive building that the assembly craft will pile up on the chest.

You're probably right in that this feature would not be that helpful (except of course for handcrafting!).
Maybe if you're using a space platform to ship ingredients in from another planet to craft something would be another good use case?

I have a "worst setup" which changed recipe for the intermediate product as soon as an intermediate product was inserted to make a finished one. It was never ending and not doing anything. It worked apart for belts, assembly machines, modules, and capsules roughly. So i tried to give it a pal, another machine with a list of intermediate that would be excluded for the first machine. It sort of work, but i tried again a single machine this time with a memory cell, and another setup that read on roboports to try and not do the intermediate it could request. I don't have a "best setup". I'm still playing the game It feels to me that designing such setups are part of the fun in it.

Absolutely, which is why I don't look up other peoples circuit contraptions, but I'm probably not the average factorio player as I've also got experience with programming and logic circuits (which is kindof what factorio combinators are). At the moment my circuit system works fine, if I can be bothered I may optimise it so it doesn't insert any more into the machines than needed for a single craft (and so it won't need to empty trash slots). But it would be so much easier if you could read the contents of a foundry/assembling-machine on one colour wire, and the ingredients on the other colour.

[mrvn]

As a side note: All items have a main recipe and altrernate recipes. You can see this in the Factoriopedia. My suggestion would just use the main recipe but it would also be easy to give a popup to select the recipe when multiple recipes are available. The alternate recipes are usually later in the game and for specialized buildings.

This is not true, see for example nutrients:
12-05-2024, 21-05-25.png

Which causes the game to be inconsistent when choosing how to craft them (see viewtopic.php?p=646915#p646915).

Ok, not all items have a main recipe. Doesn't really matter for the suggestion as you would drop the alternative you actually want onto the button.

The point was that every recipe has a unique icon that can be dropped.

[mrvn]

Then you get AM1s in the requester chest for the AM2 plant that are not needed. Wasted resources. If you do this kind of setup for every entity that can be build in your mall then the wasted resources add up quickly.

This sound again like a user mistake to me. I would be curious to see the setup you mention, maybe my picture was not detailed enough for other user to replicate the system properly.

Considering using your suggestion for every entity that can be build in the mall is going to be very tedious, i thought it was for when you need 2 or 3 things quickly. But i clearly wouldn't recommand copy pasting and setting the multipler for each and every item of the mall, i would continue recommanding using combinators instead because you can just copy paste your setup.

Just because it is something that isn't your play style doesn't make it a user mistake. It's just one example of how the suggestion could be used because you asked for it. Don't like it then don't use it that way.

In fact I have a few logistic groups specifically for requesting materials for handcrafting (yes I know I shouldn't be handcrafting, but it's often quicker and more convenient).

That's what the suggestion sounds for, because it started as " when i need 2 3 things quickly and i can't handcraft because i don't have the ingredient"

But it also seem that later recognizing that asking for incentive for manual crafting was not a good argument, it switched to something "for every entity that can be build in your mall".

I think what is important is to cap the output of the machine, the amount of ressources requested is of little importance regarding the vast majority of the item in a mall the 30 second or 1 recipe request is just fine because most material sits in chest most of the time.

This further highlight how the suggestion is in fact a request to make handcrafting easier, to me.

It really amazes me what dream world you live in. If you would just scroll up you would see it started with:

TL;DR

Droping an item on "add section" to add a request for ingredients.

The suggestion doesn't mention hand crafting at all and at no point did I want to use it for hand crafting later in the thread. That is something you imagined.

In fact the first metion of hand crafting is something you made up in the 6th post in this thread:

sorry i didn't realize the aim of the suggestion was to request the ingredient of a recipe for manual crating. I thought it was meant for platform hub.

Such request for an item that contain fluid in its ingredients makes no sense in the first place since those can't be handcrafted.

I don't think it's positive to add incentive for handfcrafting but i understand better the suggestion ( which still is inconsistent imo due to item having multiple recipes ).

And now you've got everyone else so confused the whole suggestion is basically ruined with your fever dreams because all it does is discuss play styles instead of the suggestion.

Please mmmPI use the ignore feature and stop replying to any of my posts.

[mmmPI]

Just because it is something that isn't your play style doesn't make it a user mistake. It's just one example of how the suggestion could be used because you asked for it. Don't like it then don't use it that way.

It clearly is a user mistake when you claim ressources are wasted using the showed setup.

I can't count the number of times I've wanted to request the ingredients for some recipe.

That's the original use case as you mentionned, i posted a setup that remove the need to do this for everyone to use. You don't like it is your problem but i'm posting it here to illustrate my argument of how there are already tools in game that adress this use case. Which you seemed unaware of in your first post describing your experience.

It's only later you claimed you were aware of the setup. Yet wrongfully claim you can't use it to build AM2 and AM3 next to each other, and that ressources are wasted both claim are wrong.

Please mmmPI use the ignore feature and stop replying to any of my posts.

That doesn't work if you quote me lol

[mmmPI]

You're probably right in that this feature would not be that helpful (except of course for handcrafting!).
Maybe if you're using a space platform to ship ingredients in from another planet to craft something would be another good use case?

I think that would not work well, because that would create many duplicate request due to item being in multiple groups , placing AM1 would request a set of gears, but placing AM2 would request more gears, adding belts would then request even more gears, all in different group so the amount add up which seem a undesirable behavior be it for assembling machine request or handcrafting or platform request.

That would cause the need to manualy set the amout of "iron gears" for group created when placing the AM1, but also the AM2, and the belts.

[Koub]

This is also very similar to 123287

Thanks mate

[Koub] Merged a couple threads with the same suggestion.

[mrvn]

For what it's worth, I generally agree with mrvn's arguments here.

In fact I have a few logistic groups specifically for requesting materials for handcrafting (yes I know I shouldn't be handcrafting, but it's often quicker and more convenient).

That being said, I've also been using the new ability to place ghost items in Assembler slots (which for some reason are delivered by construction bots, not logistic ones), and then manually counting how many I need for one ingredient, then putting tons in thw other slots. And have the bots remove any exvess once finished.
But that's annoying.

I'd also like an option for requester chests to decrease the request when items leave, so you don't have to remember to turn the request off when it's done.

You can ghost place items in chests too same as with assemblers. It create a construction request that will count down separate from any logistic requests the chest has. It's a basic function of every inventory now. You can do it with a wooden chest too for example.

So you really only need requester chests for permanent, repeating requests. Which means you can kind of cheese the "no requester chests" achievement my manually renewing ghost placements every so often (blueprint all your pseudo requester chests so it's one click to refresh them).

[IsaacOscar]

I think that would not work well, because that would create many duplicate request due to item being in multiple groups , placing AM1 would request a set of gears, but placing AM2 would request more gears, adding belts would then request even more gears, all in different group so the amount add up which seem a undesirable behavior be it for assembling machine request or handcrafting or platform request.

But that's exactly what I would want: enough iron gears to make an AM1, an AM2, and some belts, without having to go back at get more materials.

[IsaacOscar]

You can ghost place items in chests too same as with assemblers. It create a construction request that will count down separate from any logistic requests the chest has. It's a basic function of every inventory now. You can do it with a wooden chest too for example.

Yes I know, I often waste bot time by requesting way more ingredients than I need by using this method. And usually, by the time I tell the bots to put the extra ingredients back, my machines have made more of them, so there's no space for them!

[Hares]

+1 on that. So many times I've set up requests group those are exactly crafting recipies, especially for delivering rocket silo materials to other planets.