Trains I cant figure out signals and chai signals

[Serenity]

You need to distinguish between unidirectional sections like your stations and bidirectional sections like the link between stations. Only bidrectional sections get signals on both sides. Unidirectional sections have one signal. The side depends on the direction


In general there are two ways to think about chain signals:
1.) A chain signal makes sure that a train can't enter a block it can't leave. A block is a section of track between two signals. The whole system is really block based. This can help understanding intersections maybe

2.) What I personally find easier to work with is that a chain signals mirrors the next signal in line. If that signal (which can be a normal one or another chain signal) is red the chain signal will also be red. Which causes a train to wait at it and its path is clear

[factoriobiker]

why would it be red

there is space...to park for 3 trains each has its own station

https://pasteboard.co/JnZHI5B.png

my base has 3 stations station for each mine (iron, stone and oil)

So the train has space to go to its station....plenty of space....I dunno why it is red......
i think this is the time I will give up on this game.....I did not even start with building robots, enemies getting bigger etc and also processors, signal wires etc....
it is great game but I cant figure it out, I watched videos but it does not work

[robot256]

In your last screenshot, the train on the middle track is stuck because of a "No path" error, not because of a red signal. This is usually caused by a signal on the wrong side of the track farther down the line, but also could be because of disconnected track.

You're so close! Trust me, it will feel very good once it finally clicks for you and starts working.

[robot256]

this is what happened
I only use chainsignals now and both trains are stuck

https://pasteboard.co/Jo0FlH6.png

Those two trains are blocked by a third somewhere off screen. Or potentially by each other if there is a turn around off screen and they each want to go to the other mine. But from the minimap that looks unlikely.

If he replaced all the rail signals at the depot with chain, the trains on the screen could actually be blocked by themselves as the chain signals will "look ahead" all the way back to where they started.

The way I explain signals is that Rail Signals show the "beginning of a parking spot". Chain Signals are for everywhere else. As long as you have a single Rail Signal at the beginning of each station track (which you do in the last screenshot sent), then chain signals everywhere else will let you get there. Add more Rail Signals to mark other places a train can wait without causing problems, which will nearly always be on single-direction track.

[mrvn]

this is what happened
I only use chainsignals now and both trains are stuck

https://pasteboard.co/Jo0FlH6.png

Those two trains are blocked by a third somewhere off screen. Or potentially by each other if there is a turn around off screen and they each want to go to the other mine. But from the minimap that looks unlikely.

If he replaced all the rail signals at the depot with chain, the trains on the screen could actually be blocked by themselves as the chain signals will "look ahead" all the way back to where they started.

The way I explain signals is that Rail Signals show the "beginning of a parking spot". Chain Signals are for everywhere else. As long as you have a single Rail Signal at the beginning of each station track (which you do in the last screenshot sent), then chain signals everywhere else will let you get there. Add more Rail Signals to mark other places a train can wait without causing problems, which will nearly always be on single-direction track.

Trains don't block themself. If you build a small loop with a long train with all correct signals the train will happily run into itself because of that.

Yes, rail signals denoting parking spots is exactly the way to think about it.

[5thHorseman]

why would it be red

Try this:

• Drive your train manually about halfway to its destination.
• Stop, and direct the train to go to its destination.
  • If the train still doesn't path, you know the problem is in front of you. Go forward halfway and try again.
  • If it goes, then you know the problem was caused by something behind you. Back up halfway and try again.
• Repeat until you've found the block where the problem is, and then if you still can't figure it out, post a picture of that area.

[factoriobiker]

In your last screenshot, the train on the middle track is stuck because of a "No path" error, not because of a red signal. This is usually caused by a signal on the wrong side of the track farther down the line, but also could be because of disconnected track.

You're so close! Trust me, it will feel very good once it finally clicks for you and starts working.

if i remove all signals and chain signals the trains run smooth, but they crash....so the track is not the reason.....

[factoriobiker]

why would it be red

Try this:

• Drive your train manually about halfway to its destination.
• Stop, and direct the train to go to its destination.
  • If the train still doesn't path, you know the problem is in front of you. Go forward halfway and try again.
  • If it goes, then you know the problem was caused by something behind you. Back up halfway and try again.
• Repeat until you've found the block where the problem is, and then if you still can't figure it out, post a picture of that area.

i dont know how to drive train manually....you mean yu can use some keyboard key? Or jsut set it to manually?

[5thHorseman]

i dont know how to drive train manually....you mean yu can use some keyboard key? Or jsut set it to manually?

Yes. When you first put a train down it's in manual mode. Hit enter to get into it just like a car and push "up" to drive forward. and "down" to drive backward. You can't turn off the track, but when you get to a Y intersection you can use left-right to make the train go on that track. WATCH OUT, you can easily plow through other trains, destroying one or both trains in the process. And yourself

In the screen where you pick stations there's a "manual/automatic" switch at the top. When it's on "automatic" you can't drive it manually. It automatically (hah) goes to "automatic" when you click the > button to go to a station, but you can always toggle it back to manual at any time to drive with your arrow keys.

[factoriobiker]

i dont know how to drive train manually....you mean yu can use some keyboard key? Or jsut set it to manually?

Yes. When you first put a train down it's in manual mode. Hit enter to get into it just like a car and push "up" to drive forward. and "down" to drive backward. You can't turn off the track, but when you get to a Y intersection you can use left-right to make the train go on that track. WATCH OUT, you can easily plow through other trains, destroying one or both trains in the process. And yourself

In the screen where you pick stations there's a "manual/automatic" switch at the top. When it's on "automatic" you can't drive it manually. It automatically (hah) goes to "automatic" when you click the > button to go to a station, but you can always toggle it back to manual at any time to drive with your arrow keys.

i did not know you can do that...i will try, can you back up with the train, what if I am stuck somewhere and cant get back with train? and have to walk back very far

[Nosferatu]

Yes you can drive backwards in manual mode

[5thHorseman]

i did not know you can do that...i will try, can you back up with the train, what if I am stuck somewhere and cant get back with train? and have to walk back very far

You can drive backwards, yes. Also, you can hop out and as long as there are no cars connected, hit "r" while hovering over the train to make it instantly change direction. I do this for long drives with turns because my brain has trouble figuring out quickly which way to turn when going backwards.

Also, you could always hop out, make a quick turnaround with track, and hop back in and drive around it.

[the_potty_1]

First thing I would do is place a second engine on the back of the train so it can reverse. This may fix the no path problem, or possibly not. I'm not sure if the reverse engine makes the train go faster, but you still have some wiggle room there by switching them from coal to solid or rocket fuel.

I mostly lay down rail signals, but use chain signals when entering a complex intersection. I also always place a pair of signals down at a single point of track, one on each side. This might turn out to be more signals than required, or occasionally inefficient, or it might be optimal, I don't know, but it's good enough.

[disentius]

[EDIT] made signalling error in the loop: and the merge point(see post below by mergele. Uploaded a correct image


Made a signal example for you, based on your screenshot.
If you use one track railways, you need to build a "train pass" like in the picture, to make sure the trains can pass each other when needed. you need one or more on each stretch between stations, or between junctions.
Your station is at the right side of the track in the loop, so you only have to signal the right side of the track there.

Tran signal config corrected.png (1.32 MiB) Viewed 4318 times

The more trains you have, the more "train passes" ot loops at the endyou need per stretch of track:
2 trains - 1 bypass
3 trains -> 2 bypasses
4 trains -> 3 bypasses
......
This is usually the point where you have to switch to a switch to a two-lane tracksystem.
(the train bypasses are right hand drive, because I am used to that)

[Serenity]

First thing I would do is place a second engine on the back of the train so it can reverse. This may fix the no path problem, or possibly not. I'm not sure if the reverse engine makes the train go faster, but you still have some wiggle room there by switching them from coal to solid or rocket fuel.

It doesn't affect the top speed, but it lowers the acceleration. Only the locomotive in the driving direction provides power. The other one is dragged behind

[the_potty_1]

It doesn't affect the top speed, but it lowers the acceleration. Only the locomotive in the driving direction provides power. The other one is dragged behind

Cheers, good to know.

[mergele]

@disentius Here is an alternate signaling version for one-track systems which does not require bpasses but can use them for increased throughput.

[disentius]

@mergele: You are right. For the station loop the signalling i made is nod needed. I wanted to show the OP how to signal a junction on a two way track.
However, if you have more than one train on a single track (the OP mentions three trains), you need at least two bypasses between the stations. that is why i included them

[factoriobiker]

@disentius Here is an alternate signaling version for one-track systems which does not require bpasses but can use them for increased throughput.

here are only 2 trains, the 3rd train has its mine way before

so the top one turns in the loop the bottom one continues further away but is using the track alone, so I dont think I need the offtrack?

[disentius]

Probably not. (but now you know how to solve this:))