Trains I cant figure out signals and chai signals

[factoriobiker]

I watched several videos

So you put chain before the rails divide or cross and regular signal after....

I did that and my trains do not run, it says it cant reach the stop station

Here is one crossing

https://pasteboard.co/JnZF6pS.png
the train does not go firther

here is improved and still it does not work, I put chain on each side
https://pasteboard.co/JnZFIEI.png

[factoriobiker]

here is the rest where all my trains dock at main base

https://pasteboard.co/JnZHI5B.png

here is also my next crossing where two trains can collide and that is it, this is all I did

https://pasteboard.co/JnZLOMD.png

I have 3 trains each going into each mine and coming back to main base to each station.....

[boskid]

Only mistakes i noticed was this:

88533.png (393.73 KiB) Viewed 3925 times

If you have a rail signal or rail chain signal without signal on the opposite of the rail, trains in automatic will only go in single direction. Because of the pair of unpaired signals, this section can only be crossed from top to left, but trying to go from left to right or from right to left is not possible.

[Serenity]

Those aren't crossings. Those are merges and splits. A crossing is like an intersection when one track literally crosses over another.

If you run multiple trains on one track you are far better off with dual tracks. One track for each direction. For that you only need chain signals with proper crossings. Merges can use normal signals. Splits don't need anything.

A single track can't run multiple trains back and forth without bypasses

[factoriobiker]

I dont undestand

https://pasteboard.co/JnZS9IL.png

Lower tracks goes firther and the train come back on same track but middle and top track the trains just docks and comes back on top track

I rechecked and dunno why this is not working....all 3 trains do not run now...

[factoriobiker]

Those aren't crossings. Those are merges and splits. A crossing is like an intersection when one track literally crosses over another.

If you run multiple trains on one track you are far better off with dual tracks. One track for each direction. For that you only need chain signals with proper crossings. Merges can use normal signals. Splits don't need anything.

A single track can't run multiple trains back and forth without bypasses

I get it now I dont use crossing just splits....
so can I make this function? I want to share the part of the rail with other train

the problem is my trains collide in part where they all share it....

[Serenity]

Then you need to make sure that there is ever only one train in the shared section. The others need to wait before they enter. The proper use of chain signals can do that. There probably need to be chain signals entering a shared section. Chain signals stop trains until the entire path is free. A normal signals will be green even if the next block after its own one is occupied

But as said it's pretty problematic in the long run as it's just not very extensible. And doesn't work well over long distances. With short distances it's more acceptable when a train has to wait somewhere a bit away. For learning the system it can be ok though

EDIT: You don't necessarily need bypasses despite what I stated above. But it means the trains will wait in their station or at some split off. Which can fine in a small, relatively low distance network. But it reaches its limits when you have long stretches that need to be covered. That's where bypasses help so trains can pass each other. For now you'll probably be fine if you get the signals right

[Zavian]

For general rail signaling I recommend https://www.reddit.com/r/factorio/comme ... ts_23_and/

For 2 way rail try viewtopic.php?p=316644#p316644 (but if you don't understand basic rail signaling then you should also read the tutorial I linked above).

[factoriobiker]

i watched the tuts, but it is old graphics and i am confused....

so the problem is the track that is shared....
so how to fix it?

Put chain signal before and after and NO USE OF regular signals?
Because I put chain before and regular signal after and it is not working

[mrvn]

I dont undestand

https://pasteboard.co/JnZS9IL.png

Lower tracks goes firther and the train come back on same track but middle and top track the trains just docks and comes back on top track

I rechecked and dunno why this is not working....all 3 trains do not run now...

Any bi-directional part of your network must only have chain signals and they must always be paired on both sides.

You can have a normal signal (not paired) any place the bi-directional track splits into 2 uni-directional parts. But only on the path where trains leave the bi-directional track and only if there is enough space for a full train after the signal. The part where trains enter the bi-directional part must be a chain signal (not paired).


To debug your setup select a train that is stuck. Press ctrl and with the mouse follow the path the train should take. The path up to the mouse will be highlighted up to the point where your signal is broken and the train can't continue.

Note: if you click right before there a temporary stop is added to the schedule and the train drives there. So if you enter the train before this it will deliver you right where the problem is.

[Zavian]

We can't see your whole rail setup, so we can't see where all the problems are. Hence we can't tell you what all the problems are.

But seriously take the time to read the tutorials I linked above. If bits of them are unclear and you still don't understand them, then ask specific questions about specific parts of the tutorials. (Yes, some of the graphics have been updated, but the signalling mechanics are still the same).

[factoriobiker]

I dont undestand

Please explain it in easy terms
I have no crossing so only splits and merges

the shared track is bidirectional and should have chain signal at the start of the track and at the end?
And I should put chain signal on both side of the track

Like here I tried but it does not work
https://pasteboard.co/Jo0cbjH.png

I disabled other 2 trains so they do not collide and I use only one but my lights get red

And when to use non chain signal?
I thought it was simple

chain signal before splt or merge and non chain after merge split
I want to share track for now and not build track for each mine...cause the train unload and loads for long time so they are not running all the time

[Zavian]

Like here I tried but it does not work
https://pasteboard.co/Jo0cbjH.png

That section of track looks fine. The red chain signal on the outgoing section of track means that there is a train somewhere down that route. But that isn't visible in the screenshot. (It also isn't visible in the minimap, but the red signal mean that there must be a train somewhere.

Please explain it in easy terms

I linked 2 tutorials that explains things in easy terms, and that do a much better job explaining concepts than I can.

For general rail signaling I recommend https://www.reddit.com/r/factorio/comme ... ts_23_and/

For 2 way rail try viewtopic.php?p=316644#p316644 (but if you don't understand basic rail signaling then you should also read the tutorial I linked above).

[factoriobiker]

yes the 2 trains are down the road but they are parked in each station....

[Zavian]

https://imgur.com/a/a8Hz0

[Nosferatu]

Your main problem at the moment are your chain signals. A chain signal gets red when the signal after it is red. And your parked trains trigger that effect.
Step 1: Remove all signals in bidirectional area. Step 2 : Replace all chains by normal signals
This should get your trains rolling again. If that is working:

Step 3: Put the chainsignals back where your trains leave the unidirectional area. That makes sure that trains only enter the bidirectional area when they can leave it.

Edit: Changed order of steps to avoid a big mess...

[factoriobiker]

this is what happened
I only use chainsignals now and both trains are stuck

https://pasteboard.co/Jo0FlH6.png

[Nosferatu]

DON'T use chains. Use only normal ones.
Edit: But also delete all signals in bidirectional areas.

[mrvn]

I dont undestand

Please explain it in easy terms
I have no crossing so only splits and merges

the shared track is bidirectional and should have chain signal at the start of the track and at the end?
And I should put chain signal on both side of the track

Like here I tried but it does not work
https://pasteboard.co/Jo0cbjH.png

I disabled other 2 trains so they do not collide and I use only one but my lights get red

And when to use non chain signal?
I thought it was simple

chain signal before splt or merge and non chain after merge split
I want to share track for now and not build track for each mine...cause the train unload and loads for long time so they are not running all the time

1) The loop at the train station is uni-directional. The branch where trains enter should have a normal signal and the other a chain signal. No signal on the opposite site.
2) Put a normal signal at the train stop itself so the next train can enter while the last train is waiting to leave.
3) Disable the station when a train is at the station. Otherwise a second train can choose the same station and block your train network because all the signals towards the mine will be blue or red.

[mrvn]

this is what happened
I only use chainsignals now and both trains are stuck

https://pasteboard.co/Jo0FlH6.png

Those two trains are blocked by a third somewhere off screen. Or potentially by each other if there is a turn around off screen and they each want to go to the other mine. But from the minimap that looks unlikely.