[0.17.x] Bob's Mods: General Discussion

[bobingabout]

If you change the priority for miners then the iron/copper/stone/... miners would also draw at that priority. Probably wouldn't matter much but worth considering.

I was thinking it would be a separate mining drill, a duplicate that has this primary priority, so it wouldn't effect all mines.

Changing the priority per script would maybe solve this. on_entity_built could check if a miner was build over coal and then bump it's priority. Then again what if you switched to nuclear? Now coal mining is irrelevant and uranium miners need the priority. Of you stick with steam engines and the uranium is just for atom bombs.

if you can do it in a script, you can have a modded GUI that lets you choose the priority on whatever entity you want, it doesn't have to be automatic, the GUI could even just have options for "automatic, primary if on coal/uranium" and "force primary" options, similar to how my inserters pre-place GUI works.

Don't forget assemblers and ore crushers for when you make coke pellets by crushing coal for the extra fuel value. Or liquifiers when making carbon because one doesn't have coke pellets yet. Or many other power options. Basically you need that priority setting everywhere. That's why I think a modded inserter or mining drill with higher priority won't be a solution. Too many mods would have to add duplicate entities with higher priority. A modded GUI to change the priority would be the way to go there. Just make sure blueprints keep the setting.

Gonna need some base game support for this. I guess I'll have to talk to the devs, and see if we can come up with something.

[orzelek]

Is anyone actually using coal for burning?
You gave it such steep pollution penalty that it might be a tad suicidal

And there are no real alternatives... and using carbon for that is pretty annoying.
Do you plan to add some coke pellets or something similar to have something less polluting to burn before solid fuel?
(Or do we need to rush hydrogen and make solid fuel that way - I have no idea if that process will produce usable net energy results)

[RocketManChronicles]

(Or do we need to rush hydrogen and make solid fuel that way - I have no idea if that process will produce usable net energy results)

Don't do it! It is a very bad loss! You consume more than you can produce!

[orzelek]

(Or do we need to rush hydrogen and make solid fuel that way - I have no idea if that process will produce usable net energy results)

Don't do it! It is a very bad loss! You consume more than you can produce!

But this leaves us only with polluting option till we get to oil and kind of requires rushing solid fuel.
Unless I'm missing some other fuel then carbon thats available earlier? (Not counting wood here really since that needs lots of greenhouses)

It might work with only bob's but once you add some other enemy mods and science multipliers that coal pollution multiplier will make it pretty bad. I'm using carbon atm but it looks silly and burner inserters need to work pretty hard even with 3 per Mk2 boiler.

[bobingabout]

Word back from the devs, being able to change electrical priority run time is effectively impossible. it would require changing too much about the way electricity works in the game to be something to consider, because at the moment it is dependant on all prototypes of a given name being the same priority.

This does make sense, because if you think back to solar optimisation, they changed it to basically just count how many solar panels there are on the grid, and multiply that by the power output of a panel, and that's how much power all solar panels on the network give you. it saves the game from calculating solar power for each panel.

With what they've told me, I imagine there is a similar optimisation game-wide for all electric energy source entities.

[BlueTemplar]

Aww...

But this leaves us only with polluting option till we get to oil and kind of requires rushing solid fuel.
Unless I'm missing some other fuel then carbon thats available earlier? (Not counting wood here really since that needs lots of greenhouses)

Bob's greenhouses are extremely powerful for their footprint - compare with solar panels (that are also available pre-oil).

It might work with only bob's but once you add some other enemy mods and science multipliers that coal pollution multiplier will make it pretty bad. I'm using carbon atm but it looks silly and burner inserters need to work pretty hard even with 3 per Mk2 boiler.

Why does it look silly ?

[bobingabout]

Carbon should be a viable option, I mean, the process is basically just coal cleaning. but then you the fuel value per item is reduced.

[Frenzier]

I really like your mods, they have extended my enjoyment of the game immensely. I have a little problem however.

I built a factory divided by blocks interconnected by trains only, and currently the liquids are creating a bottleneck because the amount of liquid a train carries its too little for the trip, pumps can load and unload a fluid wagon almost instantly but since i use a row of loaders connected to a storage, the trains that carry solid stuff also load and unload really fast, this makes the current amount of fluid a fluid wagon carries feel underwhelming, would it be asking too much to add an option to the mod settings to set the % of storage fluid wagons can carry? For example a fluid wagon mk1 carries 25k and a mk2 37k, if i where to set that % to 200%, their carry capacity would increase to 50k and 74k respectively and same thing for mk3, or i can just manually edit if i knew where to look.

[bobingabout]

I really like your mods, they have extended my enjoyment of the game immensely. I have a little problem however.

I built a factory divided by blocks interconnected by trains only, and currently the liquids are creating a bottleneck because the amount of liquid a train carries its too little for the trip, pumps can load and unload a fluid wagon almost instantly but since i use a row of loaders connected to a storage, the trains that carry solid stuff also load and unload really fast, this makes the current amount of fluid a fluid wagon carries feel underwhelming, would it be asking too much to add an option to the mod settings to set the % of storage fluid wagons can carry? For example a fluid wagon mk1 carries 25k and a mk2 37k, if i where to set that % to 200%, their carry capacity would increase to 50k and 74k respectively and same thing for mk3, or i can just manually edit if i knew where to look.

Should be doable, fairly easily too. Should this also effect the fluid storage tanks?

Thinking about it though, given that a storage tank is 3x3 tiles, or 9 tiles in size, and a wagon is 2x2x3, or 2x6 tiles, being 12 total, the wagon should carry more than a storage tank anyway. if a storage tank held 24k of fluid, then a fluid wagon should carry 32k.

[BlueTemplar]

Well, fluid wagons used to be 3 fluid tanks (each 25kL), that you could separate :

https://www.reddit.com/r/factorio/comme ... gle_fluid/

I miss that feature...

[Frenzier]

I really like your mods, they have extended my enjoyment of the game immensely. I have a little problem however.

I built a factory divided by blocks interconnected by trains only, and currently the liquids are creating a bottleneck because the amount of liquid a train carries its too little for the trip, pumps can load and unload a fluid wagon almost instantly but since i use a row of loaders connected to a storage, the trains that carry solid stuff also load and unload really fast, this makes the current amount of fluid a fluid wagon carries feel underwhelming, would it be asking too much to add an option to the mod settings to set the % of storage fluid wagons can carry? For example a fluid wagon mk1 carries 25k and a mk2 37k, if i where to set that % to 200%, their carry capacity would increase to 50k and 74k respectively and same thing for mk3, or i can just manually edit if i knew where to look.

Should be doable, fairly easily too. Should this also effect the fluid storage tanks?

Thinking about it though, given that a storage tank is 3x3 tiles, or 9 tiles in size, and a wagon is 2x2x3, or 2x6 tiles, being 12 total, the wagon should carry more than a storage tank anyway. if a storage tank held 24k of fluid, then a fluid wagon should carry 32k.

It makes sense to increase the storage capacity of the standard storage tanks along with the fluid wagons, also the fluid wagon is indeed bigger than the storage tank from a visual perspective, even considering the height difference, i was thinking of changing storage tanks to the angels high pressure tanks that can hold 350k, but with a change like this maybe i wont need to. It bothers me however, that from a symmetrical point of view you just cant place a row of those storage tanks along the fluid wagons without using pipes, the use of pipes reduces the speed of transfer, or at least it did so a few months back.

[BlueTemplar]

How much ?

P.S.: It's a shame that smaller fluid wagons just wouldn't fit the current 6-tiles per wagon paradigm...

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[Frenzier]

Well, fluid wagons used to be 3 fluid tanks (each 25kL), that you could separate :

I miss that feature...

Thats really cool, i only played 0.16 and above so i missed it.

[orzelek]

Carbon should be a viable option, I mean, the process is basically just coal cleaning. but then you the fuel value per item is reduced.

Yep - the density is the problem especially with burner inserters.
Maybe add some packed/compressed version of it or coke pellets made from coal for cleaner burning.
(I'm cheating atm with deadlock's stacking and fact that stacks are also burnable with value equal to loose items in one item)

[bobingabout]

Carbon actually has the same fuel density as wood, which is half that of coal, so if you'd consider wood as a viable option, carbon is viable too.
Carbon has a pollution multiplier of 0.9, wood doesn't have one, and coal is 2, so of those starting resources, Coal is the best for fuel density, and carbon is best for least pollution.

[mrvn]

Carbon actually has the same fuel density as wood, which is half that of coal, so if you'd consider wood as a viable option, carbon is viable too.
Carbon has a pollution multiplier of 0.9, wood doesn't have one, and coal is 2, so of those starting resources, Coal is the best for fuel density, and carbon is best for least pollution.

With twice the fuel value for coal doesn't that cancel out the pollution factor so it's the same as wood?

[BlueTemplar]

No, direct pollution from boilers depends only on boiler's power output.

[bobingabout]

Carbon actually has the same fuel density as wood, which is half that of coal, so if you'd consider wood as a viable option, carbon is viable too.
Carbon has a pollution multiplier of 0.9, wood doesn't have one, and coal is 2, so of those starting resources, Coal is the best for fuel density, and carbon is best for least pollution.

With twice the fuel value for coal doesn't that cancel out the pollution factor so it's the same as wood?

It burns for twice as long, and while burning produces twice the pollution, so a piece of coal will produce double that of the same fuel value worth of wood, or since it has double the fuel value will produce 4 times as much as a single piece of wood.

[Frenzier]

Couldn't find a suggestions topic so will post here, there is this old mod https://mods.factorio.com/mod/Macromanaged_Turrets it connects your turrets to the logistics network so that robots can directly supply ammo to them, it was even compatible with your Bob's Warfare, but it has not been updated since 0.14, if you find it interesting you could update & integrate it into your mods since the license allows it i think

[Recon777]

So are you saying basically that you don't bring turrets along when attacking a nest? Even to create a safe run-to spot? My tactic was usually to put down a small line of turrets and then rush in to see if I could at least take one spawner down before having to retreat to the turret line and then try again. But without even that to run to, success seems doubtful.

That is correct.

As others have also shared, there's often not a need for a safe spot if you're well equipped for the task at hand. The rockets for nests/worms and flamethrower for hordes handles most of the work. Other weapons can assist when biters slip through the flames at low HP, but always prioritize hitting nests with rockets so the horde continues to shrink. Worms are a lower priority since their projectiles can be dodged and they can't chase you, unless they're directly in the way to the next nest.

The car is also very handy for hit and run assaults. Hop out and rocket what you can, then hop back in the car and shoot down whatever is chasing you. Once the followers are dead, return for another round of nest sniping while remaining careful about getting too close to the worms. Avoid being stationary or driving a straight line so their projectiles won't have a chance to hit you. Bring repair packs should the biters hit the car so you can keep up the harassment.

Also, don't neglect getting the cobalt armour. It's very robust and will increase your survival better than power armour (without shields) due to its high resistances. It's also very easy to obtain well before power armour, so it will likely be your primary protection for a long time.

Best of luck to you in your fight. Just avoid falling back into old habits and keep trying different ideas should you be overwhelmed. You'll get the hang of it eventually.

Just wanted to give you an update on how things are going with the war vs the biters. I noticed that rockets are fairly late on the tech tree. There are also Bob's rockets which are even later on the tree. Still, rockets are not an option at all until ater you get oil. Likewise, Landmines are out of our reach at the moment, but we've got to clear some decent sized nests parked near our perimeter. I really don't see any way of doing this other than sniper turret creep. We actually got the whole base munched and overrun and had to load from an autosave 20 minute prior to focus entirely on turret and bullet construction. Our starter iron is running low, so it is starting to look pretty desperate as we try hard to push for a nearby rich iron patch that will need a train to tap into.

So while the arsenal you suggest may be useful, I think it's too little too late due to the position on the tech tree. What do you suggest?