Total raw in recipes and order in recipes

[FatMcK]

Hi,

the 'total raw' entries in the wiki are very inconsequent at the moment. Some pages shows them, some doesn't. Some show the ingame values if avaivable, some seems to be calculated, some don't have any ingame, some ingame values are wrong (and therefor wrong in the wiki too). Some show intermediate products as raw (like steel) and depending on point of view even copper and iron plates are not really raw items and should be broken down to copper and iron ores. Oil products are not broken down to Crude oil, etc.

So I am currently gathering informations for all items and brake their total raw costs down to iron ore, copper ore, crude oil, coal, raw wood, stone and alien artifacts (and maybe water, not sure about this at the moment.). I want to create an alternate list to the 'Items' page including this informations. But now I wonder if all the total raws in all item pages should be updated too!? Would it be ok to overwrite the ingame values (which are sometimes wrong)? Is it ok to use the real raw materials instead of the currently used?


Another thing I wonder about is the order which is used in the recipes. Ingame time is always the first shown value, while I think it is better to have them as the last in the wiki. Currently most recipes have them already as last value. Is it ok to change them all to the same order?

[ssilk]

Hi,

the 'total raw' entries in the wiki are very inconsequent at the moment. Some pages shows them, some doesn't. Some show the ingame values if avaivable, some seems to be calculated, some don't have any ingame, some ingame values are wrong (and therefor wrong in the wiki too). Some show intermediate products as raw (like steel) and depending on point of view even copper and iron plates are not really raw items and should be broken down to copper and iron ores. Oil products are not broken down to Crude oil, etc.

So I am currently gathering informations for all items and brake their total raw costs down to iron ore, copper ore, crude oil, coal, raw wood, stone and alien artifacts (and maybe water, not sure about this at the moment.). I want to create an alternate list to the 'Items' page including this informations. But now I wonder if all the total raws in all item pages should be updated too!? Would it be ok to overwrite the ingame values (which are sometimes wrong)? Is it ok to use the real raw materials instead of the currently used?

Well, the brutto/netto values have been always reason for a lot of discussions:
https://forums.factorio.com/forum/vie ... f=6&t=4397

My opinion to this is, that we need both values, to see the difference between brutto and netto. And that the wiki shouldn't store that information, instead it should link to some tool, which makes the correct values, or that the pages, that include that information are autogenerated. (I'm working on that, but I don't know how long it will take, https://github.com/alexaulbach/Factorio ... iGenerator)

Another thing I wonder about is the order which is used in the recipes. Ingame time is always the first shown value, while I think it is better to have them as the last in the wiki. Currently most recipes have them already as last value. Is it ok to change them all to the same order?

Just do it as you think it is useful.

I'll point to two more problems:
- difference between item, entity and technology: We currently get into naming conflicts. For example Speed module 1 is currently the tech-page. But that clushes with the item Speed module 1. We have there some examples like so.
- ... the other I forgot now, I will add it, when I've time...

[n9103]

Why not merge the same named pages, and have them use major subheadings for each section? (i.e. ==Item==, ==Entity==, ==Technology==)

[ssilk]

Hm, good point. I should make a page, that shows, how this can work, but I'm a bit skeptical. Cause I think it will become a mess.

I would like to use namespaces. Pagenames will then look like so:

Category:Module (every page about modules)
Main:Module (like now, Main ist the default namespace)
Item:Speed module 1 (This is the item - no entity in this case)
Recipe:Speed module 1 (This is the recipe, which can be included in the item).
Technology:Speed module 1 (This is the needed research, can be also included).

But I think this is too complicated and nobody will use it.

A bit helpless now...

[FatMcK]

I'm really unsure about merging same named pages. For https://forums.factorio.com/wiki/inde ... Explosives for example there is explosives merged as item and research. But actually this is more information on one page thats needed and is somewhat confusing.

On the left side in the recipe it sais its requiered technology is explosive, which is on the same page right in the tech template. And there it sais that explosives are an effect of that tech. This is some sort of loop on a page.

If all items would have a tech with the same name, it would be somewhat reasonable. But there are items without same named tech and there are techs without same named items. So it is hard to create a standard which really feels like one.

When I want to find something out about technologies I would like to see tech relevant infos only. And vica versa I wand item related infos only when looking for item things.

[TheWombatGuru]

I don't think this is a good idea, people who are searching for the technology aren't searching for the item or other thing.