[0.12]Ideas, suggestions & discussion

[Choumiko]

Post your ideas and all other stuff here.

Working on:

• Maintenance mode: remove old poles, signals, etc and place a new layout
• Bulldoze mode: remove tracks, poles etc behind FARL
• Allow modded poles in blueprints

Planned

• Better/nicer looking landfill usage
• Copy settings from other players in the same team/force
• Create a junction when starting in the middle of straight tracks
• Snake
• Pathfinding and automated driving to location

Ideas and suggestions

• use up pickaxe/ammo when removing trees/stone rocks

[Undermind]

I'll just leave this here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02pWbr9bgbA

[Choumiko]

I'll just leave this here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02pWbr9bgbA

I really would love FARL to look like this, but unless someone else is willing to give it a shot, i doubt it's going to happen, since i can't do graphics

[ssilk]

This is a vague idea: You can look, if FARL is available (post loading) and if yes, you can replace your graphics with that and overwrite all functionality of FARL. But I doubt it works that easy.

[cpy]

Why isn't FARL using graphics from cool old rail laying machine mod?

[Choumiko]

Why isn't FARL using graphics from cool old rail laying machine mod?

As strange as it may sound: Would feel wrong, since the original author seems to be inactive (ssilk already sent him a pm i think) and i have no way of knowing the license. Using recolored vanilla graphics seems to be tolerated/allowed by the devs, so that is what i choose. If you want the old graphics, just rename/copy some .png graphics and done.

This is a vague idea: You can look, if FARL is available (post loading) and if yes, you can replace your graphics with that and overwrite all functionality of FARL. But I doubt it works that easy.

I don't get what you're trying to say. If i were able to create sprites that look like in the video i'd do it in a heartbeat and they would become the one and only graphic that FARL uses

[cpy]

Cool, so if size fits i'm doing just that.

[ssilk]

ssilk already sent him a pm i think

Yes. Unread since 4 month or so... Using the old graphics is FARL away.

This is a vague idea: You can look, if FARL is available (post loading) and if yes, you can replace your graphics with that and overwrite all functionality of FARL. But I doubt it works that easy.

I don't get what you're trying to say. If i were able to create sprites that look like in the video i'd do it in a heartbeat and they would become the one and only graphic that FARL uses

Uhm... I'm not sure, if this works. But if a mod can use the original graphics (base-mod), then it can use also the graphics from another mod. In this case the FARL-locomotive-graphics.
Turn then all the functions of FARL also off (overrinding?). Voilla.

But, yes, much easier would be just to take the graphics, pimp it up a bit, modify it, and then use it. I'm as a mod-owner would say it's okay, they tried to reach me, they didn't just take my graphics and before they make such a stupid idea like loading my mod only to get the graphics...

... the worst case would be that the graphics it needs to be taken out again... so, yes, in this very special case I support ripping the graphics, because it feels right.

[SirRichie]

... the worst case would be that the graphics it needs to be taken out again... so, yes, in this very special case I support ripping the graphics, because it feels right.

I'm not sure I agree. There are definitely good reasons why side-loading the graphics from another mod is a sub-ideal solution. And while I believe mods should be published in a free-to-use-but-give-credit license, I also think that it is the very right of any developer to specify what you can do with their stuff. And as long as we do not know for sure, we cannot just assume that the original author is ok with the graphics being used.

[Choumiko]

So since Factorio 0.12 is out, FARL can place rails over water if it has concrete in its cargo-wagons.
Right now the cost is 4 or 8 concrete per straight rail when placed on water (light blue in game) or deep water (darker blue). Curves are very much WIP now, with a maximum of 40 concrete per rail.

I've an idea how to limit it in some way:
Main goal is to limit the length of the rails over water (let's call it bridge) to a certain number, so you just can't shortcut over huge lakes/oceans.
Curves wouldn't be allowed on water, so before the first rail is placed on water, FARL would check if there's land close enough in the direction to build the bridge, else it would stop. The cost for the whole bridge could then be calculated depending on the distance (as simple as cost/tile * length or fancier assuming a slope below the water down to a deepest point, so short bridges would be cheaper than long ones, as long ones cross more tiles with deeper altitudes).
Main reason for disallowing curves is simply it should make coding sooo much easier.

I'd also like sugestions how the -root mode should be called, current ideas are: Exploration mode, Car mode, Car+ mode, Tour mode

[jockeril]

So since Factorio 0.12 is out, FARL can place rails over water if it has concrete in its cargo-wagons.
Right now the cost is 4 or 8 concrete per straight rail when placed on water (light blue in game) or deep water (darker blue). Curves are very much WIP now, with a maximum of 40 concrete per rail.

I've an idea how to limit it in some way:
Main goal is to limit the length of the rails over water (let's call it bridge) to a certain number, so you just can't shortcut over huge lakes/oceans.
Curves wouldn't be allowed on water, so before the first rail is placed on water, FARL would check if there's land close enough in the direction to build the bridge, else it would stop. The cost for the whole bridge could then be calculated depending on the distance (as simple as cost/tile * length or fancier assuming a slope below the water down to a deepest point, so short bridges would be cheaper than long ones, as long ones cross more tiles with deeper altitudes).
Main reason for disallowing curves is simply it should make coding sooo much easier.

I'd also like suggestions how the -root mode should be called, current ideas are: Exploration mode, Car mode, Car+ mode, Tour mode

I've only seen this now...

I think there shouldn't be a limit to bridging lakes and even seas as long as there is a land mass at the other end, since human-kind has made long bridges and keeps breaking the record of their length all the time. So, assuming we are playing a human, or other intelligent race, there should be a technological ability to create big and long bridges over bodies of water of any length... as for turns - that could be skipped, since that is rarely done in RL too...

As for -root mode: I'd like to point out that "Tour mode" is my suggestion after "Exploration mode" because I think those better explain what that mode does then "Car+ mode" or "-root mode"

[Vin]

Awesome work as usual Choumiko. 0.3.3 almost makes me want to restart a new world just so all my rail signals will be perfectly symmetrical with the new dual/quad simultaneous track laying. Been waiting for this update for a while.

[Boogieman14]

Okay, just have to say, I'm suitably impressed with this Been playing around a bit in the demo save (great work on presenting that too, btw!) and it looks awesome. I think using that I can figure out how to make the blueprints myself, but I'll probably just end up nicking some of your examples and use those. Think there's one or two setups that perfectly match my ideas

[Choumiko]

Awesome work as usual Choumiko. 0.3.3 almost makes me want to restart a new world just so all my rail signals will be perfectly symmetrical with the new dual/quad simultaneous track laying. Been waiting for this update for a while.

Thanks
Eventually there will/should be a maintenace/redesign/bulldoze mode, for now you'll have to use the personal roboport to tear it down i guess.

Okay, just have to say, I'm suitably impressed with this Been playing around a bit in the demo save (great work on presenting that too, btw!) and it looks awesome. I think using that I can figure out how to make the blueprints myself, but I'll probably just end up nicking some of your examples and use those. Think there's one or two setups that perfectly match my ideas

Did you notice that godmode is on? You can use FARL without any cargo-wagons in the save
You can modify the blueprints in the save, shift tracks/signals one tile, place the pole somewhere else etc. As long as the chainsignal stays at the same direction it doesn't matter.

Yep, that's 1 blueprint I think there's no real limit, it slows down Factorio though when going really fast

I think there shouldn't be a limit to bridging lakes and even seas as long as there is a land mass at the other end, since human-kind has made long bridges and keeps breaking the record of their length all the time. So, assuming we are playing a human, or other intelligent race, there should be a technological ability to create big and long bridges over bodies of water of any length... as for turns - that could be skipped, since that is rarely done in RL too...

As for -root mode: I'd like to point out that "Tour mode" is my suggestion after "Exploration mode" because I think those better explain what that mode does then "Car+ mode" or "-root mode"

Bridges: I think it will be: No curves and increased cost per track the longer the bridge is.

[Boogieman14]

Did you notice that godmode is on? You can use FARL without any cargo-wagons in the save

LOL! No, I hadn't noticed that. I had noticed that single lone FARL without any cargo wagons, and figured you had forgotten about the poor thing

Yep, that's 1 blueprint I think there's no real limit, it slows down Factorio though when going really fast

I suppose that is well beyond what's sensible for any kind of game

[Vin]

Bridges: I think it will be: No curves and increased cost per track the longer the bridge is.

This sounds reasonable, and easily balanced. Random tiny ponds won't disrupt the network but sizable lakes require a cost assessment to decide whether it's worth bridging or going around.

[jockeril]

Bridges: I think it will be: No curves and increased cost per track the longer the bridge is

I can live with cost increase. Can it be pre- calculated and asked for approval ? that can eliminate half-bridges being left behind...

[Choumiko]

I can live with cost increase. Can it be pre- calculated and asked for approval ? that can eliminate half-bridges being left behind...

Should be possible, at least by a button, not sure if i can/want to make it ask automaticly when FARL detects water.

Random tiny ponds won't disrupt the network but sizable lakes require a cost assessment to decide whether it's worth bridging or going around.

Yeah, sounds good. Also concrete and rails are more or less made from the same raw materials, stone and iron ore (ignoring water), so there should be a pretty good estimate when it's cheaper to build around the lake.
Maybe i start playing with some formulas this weekend.

[Boogieman14]

So trying out maintenance mode, but it's deactivating as soon as I enable it. I'm on a bit of track that the biters took some pieces out of, so I figured I'd just drive over it in maintenance mode to fix that and then continue where I left off. Looks like that's not possible right now?

[Choumiko]

Looks like that's not possible right now?

That's right and is more or less intended. I have no reliable way to decide whether a "dead end" is intentional and maintenance should stop or if FARL should keep laying tracks. Same reason for FARL deactivating in normal mode when it tries to place a track and finds one at that position.
I could make it so that it also looks for ghosts of tracks, and if it finds one it will place it? Should help when you get there before the ghosts disappear.