help on Combinators

[Globetrotteur]

Hello, i'd like some help with Combinators, i made a contraption for my base and it was working fine a few weeks ago, but now it just breaks, if anyone could help me figure why and how to fix it i would gladly appriciate it, thanks.
here is the blueprint for the contraption :

Code: Select all

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

[robot256]

What is it supposed to do? What does it actually do now?

[Globetrotteur]

it is supposed to get a number into a memory cell and count down the number of item passing through the belt until the number is 0, basically it tell it to only allow a precise amount of item in the belt, but now it just keeps it open and doesn't count down anymore, i use this to feed my rocket silo with item from Volcanus, the item count is from the requested by the space platform. the first part of the contraption is to only count once the number (turn a hold into a tick) and input it into the memory cell, then it check is the memory cell is higher than 0, if it is the belt is turned on and allow the flow of item, it will count each passing items and count down on the memory cell until is goes to 0 and it locks the belt again, not allowing more item to enter, but since i came back from vacation the system doesn't count down anymore.
btw, i'm sure there are easier ways to do this/improve my contraption but this was my first time doing something like this and i tested it about 2 weeks ago and it was working, hence why i implemented it, but now it doesn't work anymore and i've noticed there has been updates lately, including one with Combinators so it might be that, but i have no idea how to fix it
(i'd like to add that there's is 12 contraptions, one for each item, so only look at one of them and not the whole thing, if one is fixed, you only need to copy it to the others)

[Tertius]

It's difficult to guess what all your combinators should do, if they don't do what you want. If I activate the constant combinator, a bunch of items will flow, then stop. Isn't that what you want?
Also, it's incomplete since I don't see any means to automatically reset and allow the next batch of items pass. The amount of combinators you use is a sign you should do a different approach - 96 combinators to just too much.

If the task is to "allow an exact given amount of items, defined in a constant combinator, pass through the output belt", I would modify your combinator setup like the picture below. The counter (the decider combinator) will reset if you deactivate the constant combinator and activate it again. However, all the splitters still make this quite inefficient and space consuming. You will notice the exact amount of items (rounded up to an even number) from the constant combinator will be added to the output chest. In your original contraption, some random amount of items will be added, it's not clear how many. The belt will somehow stop with your setup, but I wasn't able to decipher how that works and if this is the intended way and how many items exactly will be passed.

The number in my setup will be rounded up to an even number, because there are always 2 items entering the belt and you aren't able to single out single items this way. It's also required to separate belt counting from belt disabling, because if you disable the belt you just counted the last items, the last item will stick on the now deactivated belt. So the blocking belt has to be one belt upstream to the counting belt.

04-30-2025, 10-21-59.png (440.46 KiB) Viewed 180 times

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Copy blueprint

How about getting completely rid of all this and use the logistics network to move items from the station to wherever you want? Output your train to passive provider chests instead of steel chests, then you're able to define exact amounts of items in logistics requester chests and the robots will automatically take care of it.

If this is to provide items for space platforms, you need none of these. Output your train station to passive provider chests. In your rocket silo(s), activate logistic requests. That's all. As soon as a platform requests something, whatever it is, and this whatever is present in your local logistics network, the rocket silo will magically request them and robots will bring the items from the passive provider chests to the rocket silo and the rocket will automatically launch.

[Globetrotteur]

yeh i know i can use logistic network but i wanted to challenge myself to do something else as a way to learn new mechanics.
thank you so much for the blueprint, i didn't realise how easy it was to make, my method was very bulky, but i guess it's because it was my first time really messing with complex combinators, anyway, thank you again for helping me
(btw there is no need to reset as the hold signal will desapear once the space platform as the items)

[Tertius]

Don't challenge yourself with things where the game already offers an efficient solution. It's not a wise thing, because you spend time on things that already have an easy and efficient solution. Instead, find a task the game doesn't already provide a direct tool for it. By doing this, you're adding functionality to your game instead of replace something efficient with something not as efficient.

You're not supposed to create arbitrary sophisticated computer-like webs of combinators. Most complex tasks have an automation on their own. Train schedules, platform supply, logistics. Use their automation directly, it's the most efficient solution.
Instead, the circuit network is meant to fill small gaps in the automation. Dynamically building filters for the asteroid collectors is such an automation. Or balancing petroleum/light oil/heavy oil production. Usually just one combinator or even just an activation condition within a device.

I found just 2 complex things that don't already have an automation and that are worth of automation with combinators. The first is loading and unloading a supply train with a selection of different items to support outposts such as your perimeter wall. The other one is a automatic-mall with a fixed number of assembling machines that get their recipes set dynamically according to current item demand. These are the only circuit contraptions of mine that have more than 3 combinators.

For everything else, I'm keeping things simple. One or two combinators at most for one task, may be a third. If it cannot be done with these, I'm going a different approach that's more simple. Keeping things simple avoids edge cases. Dealing with edge cases wastes so much time, increases manual work or complexity of buildings, which increases the number of edge cases even more.

With at most 3 combinators, I don't mean the total number of combinators on the map. This is per task. Actually, my factories are infested with wires and combinators. But everything has its own small dedicated task, is not dependent on each other.

[Globetrotteur]

i get your point, a logistic network will be way more efficient, but i wanted some diversity aswell, it also trains me to use combinators,
also, after some thinking i though that such a system would be better than a logistic network on Aquilo due to the x5 electric usage of logistic robot, that's just a personal though tho so correct me if i'm wrong

[Tertius]

The logistics network challenge on Aquilo is this: "how can I move items from chests into the rocket silo in a way the robots don't need to recharge (too often) while they carry a just requested item?"

The first thing is to minimize the distance between the chests and the rocket silo. So I put a buffer chest (the green chest) directly next to the rocket silos to minimize the distance, requesting all items platforms might request. This buffers all items prematurely next to rocket silos.
Then put many roboports directly next to the rocket silos, so the distance for a robot to fly to recharge and back is minimized, and there are enough charging stations so robots will not wait for recharging. Surround the rocket silos with roboports.
The last thing is to provide enough logistics robots. Enough so to fill the rocket with the most items (probably the science pack) every robot will pick the item, put it into the rocket silo, and goes to recharge without having any next job. An very important: to get all these robots near the rocket silo before a platform even arrives, so they don't use up their charge simply by flying there, request all these robots into the roboports with the "robot requests" feature of the roboports. You can preload the nearest roboports with up to 350 robots each. 10 roboports can hold 3500 robots.

I wrote "rocket silos", plural. If you want it fast, build enough rocket silos so each rocket silo is use only once when a platform arrives and its items are being sent up - all items are being processed simultaneously this way.

[robot256]

You're not supposed to create arbitrary sophisticated computer-like webs of combinators.

Yup, that checks out **Glances at the 200+ combinator least-squares regression powering my Space Exploration Arcosphere recycler**