Agricultual Science Pack

[quineotio]

Will that disable achievements?

No.

[quineotio]

Will that disable achievements?

Although I should add that setting a really high spoil time might actually make Gleba harder, because you do need some spoilage. I'd recommend going for 2x4 times longer spoilage rather than an extreme amount. Otherwise you would probably need to go to fulgora first to get the recycler, and then recycle nutrients into spoilage.

[Kyralessa]

ooor u can set ag science to 99 hour spoil time by changing the spoil rate in map settings file

Holy cow, this is the first time I've heard that spoilage rate (and also asteroid spawning rate) can be changed in the new game settings.

Of course, there are implications: Your agricultural science packs might spoil slowly, but the iron and copper bacteria will also spoil extremely slowly also.

[adam_bise]

ooor u can set ag science to 99 hour spoil time by changing the spoil rate in map settings file

Holy cow, this is the first time I've heard that spoilage rate (and also asteroid spawning rate) can be changed in the new game settings.

Of course, there are implications: Your agricultural science packs might spoil slowly, but the iron and copper bacteria will also spoil extremely slowly also.

Using the GUI settings I think sets ag science to like 9 hours, but if you use the map-settings command you can get it all the way to 99 hours

I don't know what the max value is, but this number is well above it:

Code: Select all

  "difficulty_settings":
  {
    "technology_price_multiplier": 1,
    "spoil_time_modifier" : 99999999999
  },

[meganothing]

You might not have realized, but you can safely let the science packs from gleba spoil when you don't need them.

Yes I know, I do this. The problem still exists though for a few reasons:

1. Gleba science production is not high enough to equal the science I've already built on Nauvis - which is almost always the case, especially in the beginning, and even after it's probably a good idea to have higher production of other science packs so that Gleba science doesn't spoil on the belt. You want Gleba science to be used as quickly as possible, which means having a higher production of other science and excess lab capacity.

2. Gleba science comes on a rocket, which means is gets delivered in batches, and therefore consumption is spikey.

So it would be nice to be able to automate research somehow, or otherwise remove the spoiling aspect so I could build a buffer. I think the cryoplant would be good for this - it's an underutilized building at the moment, and you'd already need to have solved the initial Gleba challenge before you get it.

As it is, I hook up an alarm to the lab section that tells me when agricultural packs are there, which helps me to switch techs manually, but it's fiddly.

If this hasn't been answered already, just compare what would happen if you increased gleba science, rocket bases and rocket production 10fold:

1) Costs would be a one-time cost to increase your gleba factory to about 10 times its current size. Depending on how you create energy the only **runnung** costs would be more reactor fuel or nothing.

2) Sending the bottles to space would take the same time as you have 10 times the rockets and ramps to bring them up. Freshness would be exactly the same when the spaceship starts for nauvis

3) Dropping the bottles would be almost equally fast, but on nauvis you would have 10 times the bottles at same freshness and same costs. Now you would not be able to use all those bottles and if you had no use for them at the moment 100% of them would rot. Not a problem as there are lots of ways to get rid of them again

4) In effect you would always have enough gleba science to totally forget about it, and practically no additional running costs. I don't see any disadvantage here

The other direction you could optimise this is adding more spaceships for the gleba-nauvis route: Again only one-time costs, no running costs if you use solar ships, minimal running costs for nuclear. Result: Smaller amounts of science bottles would be sent, making them slightly fresher on average. No disadvantage either.

[quineotio]

If this hasn't been answered already, just compare what would happen if you increased gleba science, rocket bases and rocket production 10fold:

Why not increase it 1000 fold? 1,000,000 fold? Why don't you devote every waking minute of your life, for the rest of your life, to increasing the size of the factory? Can't you see that the solution to all your problems is so easy?

[meganothing]

If this hasn't been answered already, just compare what would happen if you increased gleba science, rocket bases and rocket production 10fold:

Why not increase it 1000 fold? 1,000,000 fold? Why don't you devote every waking minute of your life, for the rest of your life, to increasing the size of the factory? Can't you see that the solution to all your problems is so easy?

I should have mentioned that it was a thought experiment to show that over production of gleba does not matter.

Often when you increase something by a huge factor in your mind, problems become readily apparent that can't be seen when you only increase by say 20%. Vice versa, as in this case, it can also show that there are no problems.

[quineotio]

I should have mentioned that it was a thought experiment to show that over production of gleba does not matter.

Perhaps not, but the post you were responding to doesn't cite gleba overproduction as being a problem.

[meganothing]

I should have mentioned that it was a thought experiment to show that over production of gleba does not matter.

Perhaps not, but the post you were responding to doesn't cite gleba overproduction as being a problem.

I quote from your post: "it's probably a good idea to have higher production of other science packs so that Gleba science doesn't spoil on the belt". So you say it is not a good idea (or a worse idea) to have a higher production of gleba science as other science packs aka gleba overproduction should be avoided. Right? Or what am I missing here?

Or to rephrase the question: What exactly is the downside of gleba science spoiling on a belt if you don't need it at the moment anyway? Because I think I showed there is practically no downside.

[quineotio]

Or to rephrase the question: What exactly is the downside of gleba science spoiling on a belt if you don't need it at the moment anyway? Because I think I showed there is practically no downside.

I gave two examples of reasons why it would be nice to be able to automate the science queue. Your response was to expand 10 fold.

I don't care that it is possible to overproduce Gleba science and let it spoil. You say "there is pratically no downside" - except that there is a downside - you have to build a much larger base. I would like a way to automate the research queue so that I don't have to overproduce and waste resources. In this case the resource is my time, and also my style of play is that like to be efficient and not waste things.

Overproducing and wasting goes against what I consider to be the philosophy of Gleba - or at least what I consider to be the interesting challenge - to produce fresh goods and minimize waste. So your response is like when people say "just use bots". Yes you can do things that way, but it's not a solution to the problem I was talking about.

Hence my original point - it would be nice if there was some way to automate the research queue in this game which is about automating things. "Build a megabase" is not a valid response to this statement.

[NineNine]

There's an existing discussion about this exact same thing here: viewtopic.php?t=116005

[meganothing]

There's an existing discussion about this exact same thing here: viewtopic.php?t=116005

Thanks. I found one poster who actually mentioned why he didn't like gleba overproduction: Because to remove spoilage from science labs he would have to insert more space between every two rows of science labs which would be less aesthetically pleasing !

[NineNine]

There's an existing discussion about this exact same thing here: viewtopic.php?t=116005

Thanks. I found one poster who actually mentioned why he didn't like gleba overproduction: Because to remove spoilage from science labs he would have to insert more space between every two rows of science labs which would be less aesthetically pleasing !

I too, have those horrible spoilage removers between my biolabs, and I tell ya', it's a real aesthetic tragedy. I think Wube should just recall Space Age. Completely unplayable.