Increase U238 rocket capacity

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Thremtopod
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Increase U238 rocket capacity

Post by Thremtopod »

TL;DR
Increase the rocket capacity of U238 (but not other uranium items)

What?
The current rocket capacity for U238 and U235 is 20, for uranium ore is 200, for uranium fuel cells and nuclear fuel is 10, and for various uranium ammos is 25. (Atomic bombs cannot be flown on rockets). These balance out so that for whatever final product you want, you'll need approximately the same number of shipments whether you're sending intermediate or final products. I suggest increasing the rocket capacity of U238 (to at least 100) so that it's much more efficient to ship U238 than any other options.
Why?
Uranium can only be sourced from Nauvis, so it or its derivatives have to be shipped to any platform or other planet to use it. The relatively expensive cost of launching all uranium products disincentivizes using uranium products off of Nauvis. This is especially true of uranium ammo and atomic bombs, which are potentially very useful on surfaces besides Nauvis (nuclear fuel cells last so long that being expensive to ship matters less). Also every planet can make rocket fuel, but the expense of shipping uranium means nuclear fuel is underutilized. Lastly, there's hardly a use-case for centrifuges off Nauvis, which is a shame because they're Nauvis's unique building (and they're just great)!

Making U238 cheaper to ship off-world would open up more viable usages of uranium products, but require building infrastructure for it. The simplest case is uranium ammo, which would be easy to produce anywhere that makes red ammo; this could make it viable to use uranium ammo on space platforms, without sacrificing the need to produce the ammo on-site (it could even require much more production on the platform, if switching from yellow ammo).

The other usages of U238 also require U235. If U238 is much cheaper to send to space, it would make Kovarex enrichment in space (or on other planets) the optimal way to get U235 off of Nauvis. To go even further, the rocket capacity of U235 could be decreased to 10 or even 5 for balance. I'd love to have a nuclear fuel cell space platform, covered in centrifuges, supplying my bases with power. Or a promethium science ship that receives shipments of blue circuits and U238 along with its biter eggs, and blasts its way toward the shattered planet with nuclear fire.

As far as believability/lore, it's easy to justify U235 having a much smaller rocket capacity: packing too much into the tight space inside a rocket would cause it to go critical!
Tertius
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Re: Increase U238 rocket capacity

Post by Tertius »

I guess the reason for all uranium having such a small rocket capacity is that it's not feasible this way to use uranium ammo against asteroids on a larger scale, so you have to research and build one of the new turrets. You're able to use it on a small scale for exploration, but not on regularly travelling platforms.

Similar with the atomic bomb: it encourages and motivates you to research the most powerful turrets for fighting big demolishers instead of just blowing them away with a bomb. You can do it, but it's a stretch.
Thremtopod
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Re: Increase U238 rocket capacity

Post by Thremtopod »

Yeah, I think making uranium ammo on platforms too easy would be the biggest risk. It'd still require making red ammo in-situ though. Maybe I should make a mod and try it out!

Atomic bombs I think would actually be more of a challenge, due to the higher up-front cost. It would require off-Nauvis Kovarex enrichment, meaning (at minimum) shipping up 40 U235 plus some centrifuges, and lots of waiting; or else shipping up lots more U235 and waiting less. Setting up the infrastructure for enrichment is also more interesting than just shipping lots of raw materials, even if they're similarly difficult.
Loup&Snoop
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Re: Increase U238 rocket capacity

Post by Loup&Snoop »

-1

By the time you are shipping nuclear fuel, the cost of sending up a ton of uranium rockets becomes negligible. More U238 rocket capacity mostly impacts the early exploration phase when initially going to multiple planets. In this stage of the game, it should be very expensive to blow uranium rounds.

More U238 rocket capacity only really impacts uranium ammo. Everything fission related is needed in such small quantities that moving more U238 at once doesn’t really make a big difference for the items where it really matters.
Factoruser
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Re: Increase U238 rocket capacity

Post by Factoruser »

It makes no sense that you shouldn't kill demolishers with atomic bombs, also the limitation for rockets at all, although you need over 500 to reach Aquilo. So I increased especially the load maximum for ammunition in my Asimov mod. - And for uranium. Primarly to make uranium rounds in space. It has no big advantage against big asteroids, so it's just a senseless limitation.
Muche
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Re: Increase U238 rocket capacity

Post by Muche »

As I see it, the purpose of low rocket capacity of ammo is to encourage crafting it directly on the platform from asteroids.
This works with regular and piercing ammo, as regular ammo is free, and piercing ammo is 4x cheaper to craft than launch (after Gleba free as well).

This is not true with uranium ammo. If one wants to use it on the platform, it is currently cheaper to launch finished ammo than to craft it on the platform.
Also applies to uranium cannon shells.

Uranium fuel cells have currently the same price when launching finished cells vs. launching ingredients.
This is thanks to cheap Uranium-235 (in that it is cheaper to launch it than Kovarex-enrich it). Making it more expensive leads to crafting fuel cell in-situ being more expensive, confirming the current practice of throwing depleted fuel cells overboard.

My suggestion would be to decrease rocket capacity of Uranium-235 to 5 or 10, and increase it of Uranium-238 to 40 or 50.
Factoruser
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Re: Increase U238 rocket capacity

Post by Factoruser »

I prefer to have things reasonable rather than following a game balance logic.
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