Essence of Games, Factorio game enrichment.

[SunWolf]

Hello Fellos.


1. After many hours of gameplay, I found what can make game more engaging.
I found that if you play Factorio in peaceful mode as base builder, there's many repetetive
Craft schemes, for example on contrary [heavy oil] and [light oil] production chains are one of most
interesting game craft schemes. because if player want that these chains exist effectively, he must think out a very coherent
chain system, wich very exististence is based on each other, like in true life. Of course game is crafted to best with war element.
So does reducing game to peaceful builder is also price for less rich gameplay ? good question.

Despite this question, correct formula of good PC game is to give player most logical crafting freedom, which cyber framework can provide.
More possibilites game have, more unique gameplays can occur, and this is how best game is can be definated. Chess&Go is ultimate of current
know games in planet, because they have most of possibilites in logical , harmonical game framework.


So My Vision is to give game ability to rule electrical energy more freely.

* electrical energy current can be manualy reigned to game transporting&constructing elements.
* Increasing electrical current increases efficiency of game dynamical elements.
* Increased efficiancy due e.current increases Temperature.
* Integrate Real Time Thermodynamics in game , which will allow to lay down water flow systems around elements in order to absorb and allocate heat.
* Make water flow system more rich, integrating pipe elements wich can hold water in heat until it can transfrom to steams. this is how you can make
more efficiant systems, wich will allow player to use output of thermol energy back to system ( Like Formula - 1).
* This is also gonna make player more cautions due the possibility of overheating consequences.

--- SO because if such integrations, Game will have not only possibilty to build multiply core schematic system base ( due limitations of belts) , but also you can make infinitly smart huge crafting cores, with devoloping heat >water > steam > energy system around such huge cores.


So if you lover of Objective Reasoning , you will agree that his power&thermo gameplay enrichment will be not game changing, not game imbalancing,
but just very enriching and giving more possibilites to build your base. And i Hope that Dear Factorio Dev Team, will integrated analogical game
dynamics in Upcoming Expansion Pack.

[ssilk]

I read this several times and I don’t understand it.

In this current form this cannot be discussed, because the ideas are quite too vague.

Questions:
- what do you understand by “energy current”?
- what do you mean by “can be manualy reigned to game transporting&constructing elements.”?
- WHAT is changed compared to the current power system? What entities/items/other game elements are added/removed to achieve this?
- You want to add an energy current: HOW is it calculated?
- I didn’t quite understand WHY you want to add that. Why do you think this will improve gameplay?
- integrate real thermodynamics: will overwhelm the CPU strongly. This is even more pulling than viewtopic.php?f=80&t=15546 Cable Resistance / Non-looseless Power Transmission
Please have a look into that thread!

See also viewtopic.php?f=6&t=47316 Suggestion Template - please use it!

[SunWolf]

I read this several times and I don’t understand it.

In this current form this cannot be discussed, because the ideas are quite too vague.

Questions:
- what do you understand by “energy current”?
- what do you mean by “can be manualy reigned to game transporting&constructing elements.”?
- WHAT is changed compared to the current power system? What entities/items/other game elements are added/removed to achieve this?
- You want to add an energy current: HOW is it calculated?
- I didn’t quite understand WHY you want to add that. Why do you think this will improve gameplay?
- integrate real thermodynamics: will overwhelm the CPU strongly. This is even more pulling than viewtopic.php?f=80&t=15546 Cable Resistance / Non-looseless Power Transmission
Please have a look into that thread!

See also viewtopic.php?f=6&t=47316 Suggestion Template - please use it!

1.These Ideas It's not vague in itself, but this vague exist deep in your mind, so actualy what is writtten very clearly, logicaly , objectively, appears to your understanding as vague, because trough not clean glass everything looks not clean, even if its actually clean. ( No Offence, just cold objective observation)

2. I will try simplify this idea- "manualy adjustable power system" - it means that you can increase efficiancy of constructing game elements ( Like factorys, or belts ) trough increasing electrical current directly to them and only to them, not entirely system if you want, and of course, because of balance, it must increase heat, which will be require player to use space to construct water cooling system.

3. Purpose of this integration: Conrete Example: in some cases, belts cannot provide enough resources to even average size of factory set-ups. due this integration, player will have possiblity to increase belt efficiancy by for example 400% to increase speed of belt to 200 items per second or whatever he needs. this allow to construct more solid, less divided to separated factor setups base. Just more possibilites to build your base, without ruining game istelf.

4. Well if thermodynamics will overload nowadays CPU, than Respectable Factorio Dev Team, shoud find out how to deal to this obstacle, because if game will not gonna have such big game enrichment due engine, game will die in upcoming years. Other games will arrive wich will provide much more possibilites and majority of players definently gonna switch to them.

[Impatient]

I think you mean that the game should use voltage, resistance and current for power and different levels of temperature, dissipation, etc for heat. You suggest, the game being modelled closer to real physics in regards to power and heat. Entities having different characteristics when it comes to power and heat production and consumption, so the player would need to think of and build all sorts of infrastructure to be able to produce, transfer and store different sorts of energy and power entities.

But I don't know for sure.

[SunWolf]

I think you mean that the game should use voltage, resistance and current for power and different levels of temperature, dissipation, etc for heat. You suggest, the game being modelled closer to real physics in regards to power and heat. Entities having different characteristics when it comes to power and heat production and consumption, so the player would need to think of and build all sorts of infrastructure to be able to produce, transfer and store different sorts of energy and power entities.

But I don't know for sure.

Yes, but Not entirely, purpose of this to give player possibilty to increase efficiancy of constructing&moving elements of game with electrical current ( voltage, ampere ) without limit. practicaly, player will have ability to build big solid factory setups with cost of space for cooling system around bases. it can be very effective choice among players for example in harsh death world settings, when player can't aim to big base, at least for half of game.

[ssilk]

1.These Ideas It's not vague in itself, but this vague exist deep in your mind, so actualy what is writtten very clearly, logicaly , objectively, appears to your understanding as vague, because trough not clean glass everything looks not clean, even if its actually clean. ( No Offence, just cold objective observation)

Sorry, that’s bullshit.

I have of course a vague idea of what you want, but I’m asking as moderator to let the ideas flow out of your great brain, so that the rest of the community - except you and me of course (the other poor creatures) - are able to discuss this wonderful suggestion.

Because currently this is still quite hard to be honest.

it means that you can increase efficiancy of constructing game elements ( Like factorys, or belts ) trough increasing electrical current directly to them and only to them, not entirely system if you want, and of course, because of balance, it must increase heat, which will be require player to use space to construct water cooling system.

Ok, because you seem to have problems to explain it I will try in other words (and more dealing with existing Factorio slang):

You want to select an entity and have an option in it to increase “electric current”, which is nothing else than increasing the power usage. Factorio-physically spoken it increases the amount of power taken per tick.
For that increase this entities “heat”-production is also increased, which needs to be cooled down to prevent damage.

Is that correct?

belts cannot provide enough resources to even average size of factory set-ups. due this integration, player will have possiblity to increase belt efficiancy by for example 400% to increase speed of belt to 200 items per second or whatever he needs.

Hm. Ok, let’s point out those things, that are “in the way” to implement this.

Increasing needed power to have faster production: this system already exists with the different modules. Just insert speed modules and the entity works faster by needing more power.
It is of course possible to have only one type of module (or rename it to “extra charge” if you like it) that does this effect.

Belts that need energy: that’s an own subject. See viewtopic.php?f=80&t=21921 Poll: Should belts use energy (and Offshore Pumps etc...)
and there is also a mod:
https://mods.factorio.com/mod/PoweredBelt
So in principle it might be possible to have belts with kind of “modules” inserted, that needs more power.

Entities produce heat: well, this is also possible with the current game, but of course more effort, because you need to overlap the original entity with some heat producing device (a boiler-type).

I explained it with existing mechanisms, because that would enable a modder to rebuild your idea as mod first and see, how useful it really is.

this allow to construct more solid, less divided to separated factor setups base. Just more possibilites to build your base, without ruining game istelf.

I have my doubts. Im still not quite understanding what all of this should bring in gameplay at the end. What do you mean with “more solid”? And what is missing to the current modules, that it isn’t obviously used by you?

if thermodynamics will overload nowadays CPU, than Respectable Factorio Dev Team, shoud find out how to deal to this obstacle, because if game will not gonna have such big game enrichment due engine, game will die in upcoming years. Other games will arrive wich will provide much more possibilites and majority of players definently gonna switch to them.

Yeah, of course. I don’t know if I should care of them, because “such games” can - with the current computer power - only behave like if they do simulate thermodynamics.

To explain this: there are hard physical limits in simulating these type of things. Simulating thermodynamics in closed systems belongs to these types of problems. It’s nothing else than weather forecasting. It would be great - no, absolutely fantastic - if a game manages to compute similar numbers of fluid systems as normally in Factorio used as completely thermodynamic systems.

[jodokus31]

[Moderated by Koub : Off topic.]

[aka13]

[Moderated by Koub : Off topic.]

[Kyralessa]

[Moderated by Koub : Off topic.]

[Koub]

[Koub] Please stay on topic. Post if you find the topic of interest, and refrain solely criticising the form. If the OP is of no interest or only understandable by its author, it will quickly vanish in the depths of the forum.

[Edit] Also removing all the off topicness above on a second thought.

[SunWolf]

[Moderated by Koub : Off topic.]