First, some premises, either from my own arguments or what I was able to gather during discussion:
Theikkru wrote: ↑Fri Jul 26, 2019 4:17 pm
- New players will still have to redo most if not all of the oil production chain once advanced processing hits, and there is little to no hinting or foreshadowing whatsoever to suggest that this will happen (i.e. planning ahead is not really an option). This greatly diminishes the logistical advantage of delaying the multiple outputs balancing problem that the revision is supposed to afford.
- The new player is still going to be hit with just about as large a wall of new recipes and production lines alongside the multiple outputs problem, only now it will involve more advanced recipes such as processing units and lubricant-related products rather than simpler ones such as plastic and sulfur.
- The association of oil with the multiple outputs problem is weakened (thematic problem).
- Players are still taught the "wrong" way of doing things initially, especially for solid fuel now that only the petroleum one will even be available at basic processing.
- Solid fuel got thrown under the bus. People will be even less motivated to touch it at all, now that it must use precious petroleum gas, and are far more likely to just rush rocket fuel.
V453000 wrote: ↑Tue Jul 30, 2019 4:52 pmNone of them really solved all the issues - complexity, tedium, pacing. Some of them were more interesting than others but always with some flaw. The biggest problem with the chosen solution is that it's likely the players will build straight pipes next to basic oil refining refineries, and get the "Can't mix fluids" error. We have some ideas how to fix this already, but nothing confirmed yet.
- Oil refining should not block up and jam the factory without a good solution available (and voiding resources does not qualify as "good").
- Proposals should attempt to minimize logistical complexity (and associated tedium) around the basic oil~chemical science zone of the tech tree.
- Restore an output of light oil (25~30) alongside petroleum gas for basic oil processing.
- Change the sulfur recipe to use solid fuel (~2) instead of petroleum gas.
- Increase the sulfur requirement of chemical science packs (to 3~4).
- Change rocket fuel to require heavy oil (5~10) instead of light oil.
- Change chemical science to require solid fuel instead of sulfur (at the increased cost).
- Change chemical science to require solid fuel instead of engines (and increase its cost instead of sulfur).
- Change chemical science to require plastic instead of advanced circuits.
- Increase the petroleum solid fuel recipe cost (to 25~30).
- Restore a small oil deposit near the starting area.
- sulfur no longer competes with plastic for petroleum, and oil product use cases are better balanced in general.
- solid fuel gains a purpose as an intermediate product.
- sulfur helps balance oil usage through solid fuel.
- some measure of realism is restored, in that sulfur is harvested from processed oil products, rather than petroleum gas.
- rocket fuel remains as a high-tech recipe locked behind advanced oil.
- players are no longer rushed through chemical science to advanced oil as hastily, since both solid fuel and sulfur can balance oil product consumption; output jams can only occur under situations of high plastic usage and low sulfur/fuel usage, which are rare (and effectively limited to mass module 1s, mass stack inserters, mass substations, or mass electric furnaces, while also NOT doing anything that uses fuel or sulfur in quantity).
I posit that this list of advantages outweighs the costs of implementation. If I have failed to account for some factor in my analysis, please advise.Theikkru wrote: ↑Fri Jul 26, 2019 4:17 pm
- introducing the multiple outputs problem alongside oil, allowing players to tackle it early on without too many distracting recipes involved.
- not involving a significant increase of logistical burden over petroleum only basic oil processing.
- hinting at the introduction of additional fluids with the geometry of the refinery.
- reducing the amount of renovation necessary to account for advanced processing.
- highlighting solid fuel when it is most helpful.
- providing two solid fuel recipes for comparison of efficiency.
- providing a straightforward method (chemical science pack solid fuel usage) of balancing oil product usage that works until advanced processing and cracking are available, but cannot supplant them.
- better balancing the total output of basic processing as compared to advanced processing or coal liquefaction, without making it too attractive by increasing the petroleum output.
- leaving more choice and initiative in the player's hands regarding pursuit of efficiency and planning ahead in order to save trouble down the road. (New players should be rewarded for planning ahead.)
Footnote: I present this as a differential change from 0.17.60, as I assume the devs have found sufficient justification for their decision to follow through with FFF#305. Any proposed changes must therefore prove their superiority against the current implementation, using relevant premises as I am attempting here, rather than refer to past versions as precedent.