Friday Facts #269 - Roadmap update & Transport belt perspective

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Re: Friday Facts #269 - Roadmap update & Transport belt perspective

Post by <NO_NAME> » Fri Nov 16, 2018 5:18 pm

WIZ4 wrote:
Fri Nov 16, 2018 5:11 pm
This belt is not enough engine
sf-K5LmHvlc.jpg
OMG, I want that mod now!
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Re: Friday Facts #269 - Roadmap update & Transport belt perspective

Post by tobsimon » Fri Nov 16, 2018 5:19 pm

Regarding the roadmap, why would that be "probably not something you wanted to hear"? Sure I'm exicited about new features and cant wait to get them, but I'm in no rush either. I've been playing this game now since April 2015 (0.11). It's still fun and I don't foresee that changing, as it is getting better with every version, which is just awesome, thank you. I'm more anxious of what might come, when the development on factorio is finished. Will factorio last forever and/or what will be the next game?

The new belts are really nice, the rollers underneath is add so much to the look and feel.

Still I have stuff to nag about. Most already suggested by others as I wrote this.
  • Now that belts are elevated above ground, belt ends, where items just stop and jam, instead of spilling over, aren't very plausible judging from the graphics. I suggest drawing a barrier over belt ends.
  • For side-loading, the part below the furnaces, where a downwards facing belt is side-loaded from left and right, both sides a drawn over the downwards facing belt as if the items will be dropped and I think this might look weird when more side-loading happens in close proximity. Also side-loading to underground belts is drawn like the belts are level, which is inconsistent. I'm conflicted which variant whould be better, but tend to the classic, even-level side-loading.
  • The underground belts shouldn't use conditional graphics depending on whether there is side-laoding or not. Instead they should only use the version fit for side loading, to suggest this mechanic to new players. Also, if the hood were a little shorter and the edge of the wall a little slanted (like in the version without side-loading, but backwards), then there won't be no clipping anymore and it would look better overall, I think.

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Re: Friday Facts #269 - Roadmap update & Transport belt perspective

Post by Speadge » Fri Nov 16, 2018 5:24 pm

since the belts will have an "height" now - can i still walk over them without problems?

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Re: Friday Facts #269 - Roadmap update & Transport belt perspective

Post by rcp27 » Fri Nov 16, 2018 5:32 pm

I really like these graphical ideas. This offers an opportunity to fix one of the problems with belt graphics. If a belt is fully loaded with certain types of item it can be very hard to see the colour of the arrows on it and see what speed of belt it is. The extra graphics could be used to offer an additional differentiator between yellow red and blue belts. Also, it might be a cool feature to modify the ground texture along the path of underground belts (perhaps underground pipes too) to give an indicator that there is a belt under there somewhere.

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Re: Friday Facts #269 - Roadmap update & Transport belt perspective

Post by Charidan » Fri Nov 16, 2018 5:43 pm

Am I the only one who feels weird about the angle on belts? I immediately looked at them and said "I can see too much of the side". I think the belt housing is supposed to be going straight down, but it feels like it comes way too far out from the belt for a 45 degree camera angle. I think the core issue though is actually that the surface of the belt is still "flat" and isn't angled by the perspective. We're seeing the belt surface from directly above even though we're seeing the belt housing from the side, making a huge feeling of incongruity.

(This is still a good visual direction, but this part is already driving me crazy and it's been five minutes.)

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Re: Friday Facts #269 - Roadmap update & Transport belt perspective

Post by Drury » Fri Nov 16, 2018 5:46 pm

1.gif
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Image

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Re: Friday Facts #269 - Roadmap update & Transport belt perspective

Post by Gobbel2000 » Fri Nov 16, 2018 5:55 pm

When you are already remodeling belts maybe it would be nice if the textures of multiple belts next to each other (which is very common in most factories) would connect to one wider belt. The colored arrows should still be on every single belt but especially with the 3D belts this might look really amazing. The only problem I see is that it could be a bit weird when routing a belt away from the wider belt or when using splitters.

EDIT: I added a picture of how it would look on 4 horizontal belts. It is just a bit of copy-pasting but it already gives a good idea. Just imagine a bunch of items flowing along.
wide_belt_draft.png
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Last edited by Gobbel2000 on Fri Nov 16, 2018 7:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Friday Facts #269 - Roadmap update & Transport belt perspective

Post by DustFireSky » Fri Nov 16, 2018 6:08 pm

Looks great :D

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Re: Friday Facts #269 - Roadmap update & Transport belt perspective

Post by ManaUser » Fri Nov 16, 2018 6:19 pm

I never knew I wanted this. But the new belt graphics look amazing!

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Re: Friday Facts #269 - Roadmap update & Transport belt perspective

Post by 5thHorseman » Fri Nov 16, 2018 6:25 pm

ske wrote:
Fri Nov 16, 2018 3:15 pm
The result was, that if it all goes well, we could be done in 6-9 months. This is probably not something you wanted to hear.
Actually this is much better than expected. Thanks for sharing your roadmap. I now expect 1.0 to be released on christmas 2019 :D
You mean 0.19, with 0.20 the announced precursor to 1.0 ;)

And I won't mind one bit.
Drury wrote:
Fri Nov 16, 2018 3:52 pm
Although maybe the hole in the side of an undeground belt cover should be visible always, maybe even somehow made visually important? So that, as a new player, even if you don't attach a belt to it, you can look at it and think "hmm, does this mean that if I attach a belt to the side of this, only one half of the items will go through?" and then feel like a genius when that's exactly what happens.
Agreed. Though I'm just happy it's there at all :D

And very good FFF this week. I'm ever more excited about playing the new version!
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Re: Friday Facts #269 - Roadmap update & Transport belt perspective

Post by eradicator » Fri Nov 16, 2018 6:33 pm

V453000 wrote:
Fri Nov 16, 2018 4:04 pm
eradicator wrote:
Fri Nov 16, 2018 3:58 pm
I never knew how "ugly" the old belts were until i saw these new magic pictures. Great job! I especially like the new "cute" underground entries.

There's still a few things i'd like to say:
  • The side-loading underground opening is just a tad too narrow and still looks like the items go through the walls a bit.
  • The "black bar" below splitters doesn't fit the higher belts and should probably be replaced with the same scaffolding style the belts have.
  • Inserters behind belt ends suddenly look a bit odd because their "legs" are obviously higher than the lower side of the belts.
  • Circular belts have a belt under-side flowing backwards for no reason! *shocking* :p
  • The belt-sideloading from "above" (near the furnaces) looks great, but i can already see it turning into penrose stairs :D
  • The bar for modding new belt graphics has been raised from it's previous position on Mt. Everest to lower earth orbit.
Very good obesrvations. :)
Thank you. Though now i feel a bit like you already saw it all yourself :D.
ratchetfreak wrote:
Fri Nov 16, 2018 4:40 pm
Yeah a barrier of some kind would make it immediately obvious that there is a stop there. It would make the belt end with items look more natural as well.
Maybe some sort of subtle wire-mesh baked into the end-cap?
Speadge wrote:
Fri Nov 16, 2018 5:24 pm
since the belts will have an "height" now - can i still walk over them without problems?
Not being able to walk on belts would make playing the game almost impossible so... maybe we get a new "vaulting" animation?
Gobbel2000 wrote:
Fri Nov 16, 2018 5:55 pm
When you are already remodeling belts maybe it would be nice if the textures of multiple belts next to each other (which is very common in most factories) would connect to one wider belt.
Megabelts. Oh yea :D.
Would add some pretty awesome variety to the factory.
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Re: Friday Facts #269 - Roadmap update & Transport belt perspective

Post by Dialog » Fri Nov 16, 2018 6:42 pm

Yeah, we need to able to reverse belt with logic system

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Re: Friday Facts #269 - Roadmap update & Transport belt perspective

Post by Khaim » Fri Nov 16, 2018 6:54 pm

As a bonus, the underground belt structure has a variant which shows a hole when you side-load into the underground belt.
No! The underground belt structure should always have the side-load hole. Otherwise how are new players ever going to figure it out?

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Re: Friday Facts #269 - Roadmap update & Transport belt perspective

Post by V453000 » Fri Nov 16, 2018 7:07 pm

Khaim wrote:
Fri Nov 16, 2018 6:54 pm
As a bonus, the underground belt structure has a variant which shows a hole when you side-load into the underground belt.
No! The underground belt structure should always have the side-load hole. Otherwise how are new players ever going to figure it out?
The hole is quite an edge case that you rarely use, and the design without hole looks much better. If you accidentally build it, you discover it. Not everything needs to be fed to you from the beginning. :)

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Re: Friday Facts #269 - Roadmap update & Transport belt perspective

Post by EnerJi » Fri Nov 16, 2018 7:09 pm

Good news that 0.17 will be released as an interim patch in January, 2019.

I just wanted to confirm that the digital signing of the Mac (and Windows) binaries that was planned for 0.17 is still planned for the January release? @HanziQ and @posila indicated in this thread that this was planned for 0.17, but that was before 0.17 was split into two patches.

I think I would love this game but I'm not willing to try it until the macOS version is signed, so I'm keeping my fingers crossed that this makes it into the newly slimmed down 0.17.

Thanks!

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Re: Friday Facts #269 - Roadmap update & Transport belt perspective

Post by Tekky » Fri Nov 16, 2018 7:23 pm

Dialog wrote:
Fri Nov 16, 2018 6:42 pm
Yeah, we need to able to reverse belt with logic system
Related suggestion thread:
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=62086 Bi-Directional Belts

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Re: Friday Facts #269 - Roadmap update & Transport belt perspective

Post by kovarex » Fri Nov 16, 2018 7:40 pm

Sander_Bouwhuis wrote:
Fri Nov 16, 2018 4:21 pm
Is there any way you could release a beta right before Christmas?
I have very little time to play, but will have some times between Christmas and New Year.
Since we expect to spend some time with bugfixing right after the release (as usual), we had to avoid releasing before christmas, as it is expected that people don't work that much at that time usually.

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Re: Friday Facts #269 - Roadmap update & Transport belt perspective

Post by kovarex » Fri Nov 16, 2018 7:41 pm

Tekky wrote:
Fri Nov 16, 2018 4:24 pm
Will the temporary train stop (i.e. train hijacking) feature mentioned in Factorio Friday Facts #212 be available in 0.17 or 0.18?
Yes, it is still part of the plan.

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Re: Friday Facts #269 - Roadmap update & Transport belt perspective

Post by sparr » Fri Nov 16, 2018 7:44 pm

I guess I need to update Belt Overflow mod now that the endings of belts really do look like items should fall off...

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Re: Friday Facts #269 - Roadmap update & Transport belt perspective

Post by bobingabout » Fri Nov 16, 2018 7:47 pm

oh great, something else I have to re-write for 0.17
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