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bobingabout
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Re: Teleporters

Post by bobingabout » Wed Jul 19, 2017 8:53 am

PacifyerGrey wrote:Please lock this necropost.
There is no rule against necroposting on this forum (In fact Ssilk, one of the moderators does it occasionally)
If the topic is still relevant, it's fine.

Do we have teleporters yet? No.
Is it still a good idea? Yes.

Therefore, necroing the topic is fine.
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Re: Teleporters

Post by Koub » Wed Jul 19, 2017 10:53 am

bobingabout wrote:
PacifyerGrey wrote:Please lock this necropost.
There is no rule against necroposting on this forum (In fact Ssilk, one of the moderators does it occasionally)
If the topic is still relevant, it's fine.
I concur. NEcroposting is OK if the topic is still revelant.

Back on topic : I'm not fond of the idea of teleportation in vanilla, but I clearly see it suitable for a mod.
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Re: Teleporters

Post by Factory Lobster » Wed Jul 19, 2017 1:07 pm

I necroposted for the reasons stated above, and because it's actually a suggestion with a Kovarex response (rare).

Anyway.

Do people feel that it is too powerful, even if severely restricted? As in, being able to even use it once every 5 minutes for player transportation only is too much?

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Re: Teleporters

Post by d3x0r » Thu Jul 20, 2017 3:06 am


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Re: Teleporters

Post by bobingabout » Thu Jul 20, 2017 7:54 am

Factory Lobster wrote:I necroposted for the reasons stated above, and because it's actually a suggestion with a Kovarex response (rare).

Anyway.

Do people feel that it is too powerful, even if severely restricted? As in, being able to even use it once every 5 minutes for player transportation only is too much?

Well, we have cars (and tanks) and trains already, so getting from one side of the base to another isn't impossible, but when you have some really damn big maps, it can take a while even traveling straight there on your fastest train.

So... I'm not against teleporters at all, I think they can bring things to the game, even if they're an endgame technology. Player transporters more so than resource transporters.

However, I can easily see how people would think instantly transporting items across the map is overpowered and cheaty, many people think that using logistic robots is cheating.
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Re: Teleporters

Post by Factory Lobster » Fri Jul 21, 2017 1:07 pm

bobingabout wrote:Well, we have cars (and tanks) and trains already, so getting from one side of the base to another isn't impossible, but when you have some really damn big maps, it can take a while even traveling straight there on your fastest train.
6 exoskeletons makes cars and tanks obsolete for character transportation. And really damn big maps are the primary driver behind the need for teleportation. The way resource generation works in this game, players are incentivized to stretch out in one direction as far as they possibly can. This can make it miserable to physically move the character back and forth even with the fastest train. Rail world and other such settings can result in significant sprawl that may end up feeling grindy to simply get around.
bobingabout wrote:So... I'm not against teleporters at all, I think they can bring things to the game, even if they're an endgame technology. Player transporters more so than resource transporters.

However, I can easily see how people would think instantly transporting items across the map is overpowered and cheaty, many people think that using logistic robots is cheating.
I agree! Player transporter (with inventory) only. I think if polled, the majority would not want resources able to be shuttled via teleportation. I haven't seen a good argument for why being able to move the character around the map quickly (in end game) is cheaty, when at that stage the majority of the game progress is automated and has nothing to do with where the player is located. It's merely a QoL thing.

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Teleportation pads

Post by mathguru » Sat Feb 17, 2018 8:07 pm

So I've finally got what I consider to be a megafactory... and I have built transportation networks (trains, highways for cars, transport belts, exoskeleton, concrete, etc)... but I find that I'm spending more time I like getting from part of the base to the other. Have you considered adding a teleportation technology to the game for the player? Like step on a pad that's a "wormhole" connected to another part of the base and POOF you're there? Would be pretty sweet. Thanks for reading my suggestion.

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Re: Teleportation pads

Post by Cobaltur » Sat Feb 17, 2018 10:31 pm

May be you should have a look into the mod portal - look for "teleport" ... there were 2 with 10000+ downloads

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Re: Teleportation pads

Post by impetus maximus » Sun Feb 18, 2018 12:03 am

Last edited by impetus maximus on Sun Feb 18, 2018 1:04 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Teleportation pads

Post by mathguru » Sun Feb 18, 2018 12:38 am

Yes I'm aware of the mods. I play Vanilla only, though. Was using this as a forum to suggest that the devs consider adding it. Thanks.

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Re: Teleportation pads

Post by impetus maximus » Sun Feb 18, 2018 1:04 am

mathguru wrote:Yes I'm aware of the mods. I play Vanilla only, though. Was using this as a forum to suggest that the devs consider adding it. Thanks.
oh, sorry.

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Re: Teleportation pads

Post by bobucles » Sun Feb 18, 2018 1:10 am

A vanilla game never gets so huge that a train struggles to get across the map. Teleportation isn't necessary. It also ruins some of the achivement of building a huge base. A player who teleports from space to space will skip past half the stuff that they built and may never see it again. That's sad.

Teleportation isn't very important because we have bots. Once a bot network is set up, the player never needs to physically visit an area again. Everything can be cleared out, set up, and remotely managed with construction bots. There are only a few things it struggles with:

- Shift - click and adjusting settings won't work. You have to dismantle and rebuild with blueprints.
- long distance wiring won't work. You have to dismantle and build with blueprints.
- Building the initial roboport+storage can't be done remotely. An existing roboport network is required. The only way to place a roboport is to either build it by hand, or chain a huge logistics network to the destination.

So if I had to make a suggestion, I'd like a way to set up remote roboport networks. Ideally I want to do this with trains, but I can think of several reasons that won't be possible or it might be imbalanced in some way. Instead, I think it would be FAR more fun to do long distance construction using artillery! Just grab a mining drill, stuff it in an artillery shell, and use "long distance blueprints" for construction. Now consider your options between instant teleportation, or building a remote outpost entirely with artillery. Which would you rather do? :lol:

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Re: Teleportation pads

Post by Tekky » Sun Feb 18, 2018 4:08 am

I am against adding teleportation in vanilla.

According to Factorio Friday Facts #212, a new feature is planned that will allow the player to "borrow" or temporarily "hijack" an existing train to transport the player. This will allow the player to more easily travel longer distances, if his base is so big that walking is too far.

However, I believe that the suggestion for speed limits for trains should also be implemented, so that trains no longer travel at maximum speed through the middle of a player's base. That way, the player could lay more railroad track in his base, without having to fear for his safety.

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Re: Teleportation pads

Post by Atlas » Sun Feb 18, 2018 12:06 pm

I understand the need for faster transportation and I can even imagine a huge central teleport junction (this needs signs to work), but it it doesn't seem very Factorio-like. Perhaps if it is implemented differently, such as bot carrying you between pads, hyperloop-like underground tunnels or personal trebuchet.

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Re: Teleportation pads

Post by steinio » Sun Feb 18, 2018 12:10 pm

Futurama like vacuum tubes
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Re: Teleportation pads

Post by Atlas » Mon Feb 19, 2018 7:48 pm

steinio wrote:Futurama like vacuum tubes
Exactly that, just underground.

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Re: Teleportation pads

Post by vanatteveldt » Mon Feb 19, 2018 8:50 pm

I like some good solution for skipping boring parts, and travelling (even with a personal shuttle powered by nuclear) can get boring. Also, there is no way to give your personal rail priority over existing rail, so even if you add a "third rail" for personal transport it can stop sometimes at intersections, which can be quite frequent in a train-heavy base.

However, I don't like teleportation since (1) as bob said, you skip parts of the factory, but especially (2) it doesn't offer an engineering challenge, it's just magic (TM).

Suggestion: add a new class of transportation network (e.g.: monorail) which is very fast and elevated so it can cross trains, belts, and pipes. This could just be for personal transport (enter a vehicle, choose a destination), or for high-speed, low-throughput transport (e.g. blue circuits, rocket parts) but I think I would prefer the former as I don't really see a use case, and not allowing automated transport sets it clearly apart from rail and makes it easier to build the interface.

[I think gameplay-wise it would make sense to power it with fluids, as we already have the other modes (no power: belts; solid fuel: trains, cars; electricity: bots). Maybe it needs lube, or operates on hydrogen, derived from PG+steam?]

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Re: Teleportation pads

Post by Tekky » Mon Feb 19, 2018 11:27 pm

vanatteveldt wrote: Also, there is no way to give your personal rail priority over existing rail, so even if you add a "third rail" for personal transport it can stop sometimes at intersections, which can be quite frequent in a train-heavy base.
[...]
Suggestion: add a new class of transportation network
Instead of adding a new class of transportation network, I believe it would be more meaningful if it were possible to give personal transport priority over all other trains.

This could be accomplished using the circuit network if my suggestion of track signals reading Train-IDs and sending them to the circuit network were implemented. If it were also possible to read the number of players on a train, the circuit network could prioritize trains with players on them, by forcing the signals of other trains to red.

Related thread:
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=57742 Express/Priority Trains

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Re: Teleportation pads

Post by 5thHorseman » Tue Feb 20, 2018 1:27 am

I think if you have bots, a personal roboport, and power in your suit you should be able to fly anywhere, maybe by right clicking the map and saying "go here" or by hitting a key to activate "flight" mode.

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Re: Teleportation pads

Post by SiC » Sun Apr 01, 2018 10:25 am

I definitely thought of this as well, and I like the idea of teleportation pads. They can be late game, maybe require space science packs, and plenty of them, as well as enormous amounts of resources to build, but I definitely DO want something in the game that allows me to quickly get from one end of the factory to the other end.

The fact is, huge parts of your factory simply don't need to be revisited once it's done. If you want to you can still walk through it to have a look, but usually I don't even do that and rather zoom in and move around using the map to have looks at the factory quickly. Actually getting around on foot, even with robolegs and pavement everywhere simply takes time, and it's not an interesting use of your time at that point. Especially if you're a tad forgetful, end up on one side of your base, remember you needed something else, or simply need to be on the other side for more maintenance or whatever the reason is, and you have to do another 4 minute hike through the factory to do a simple thing somewhere. It gets old. It gets really, really old.
Walking through a late game factory to me gets just as old as manually hammering away at ore patches.

Trains help, but walking to them and waiting for them is still NOT an interesting use of your time. In a game that is all about automation to improve your overall quality of life, personal transportation is sadly forgotten beyond the use of cars (which are often hard to drive through factories) and trains, which still often require a lot of walking and waiting. Mods may help, but I don't want to have to rely on them. Besides, it would be much nicer to have something like this supported officially with the 'proper' graphics, or style of the game, than something fan-made that might look off in the base.

In terms of teleportation pad mechanics, you can still do interesting things with it, like using a teleporter pad might use tremendous amounts of energy and might only be viable with enormous amounts of left-over power, which means you would need enormous amounts of steam engines, capacitors or a proper nuclear power facility with plenty of horse power to spare, or risk draining so much power that for the duration of the teleport your laser turrets might not function.
You can have a build-up period for the actual teleport to happen that draws such huge quantities you might actually depower your entire factory for the duration.
On top of that, as I said earlier, you can make it extremely late-game tech, requiring space science, which means essentially you've already 'won' the game, and there is nothing new left to build, only more expansions and whatnot.

Only thing I do know is, something needs to get into the game to allow much faster travel in the late game.

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