old LTN discussion thread

[Optera]

Well i'm currently migrating to smart stations but i seeno point in making mine and smelter stations smart because there is only one item to expect.

That entirely depends on the setup. Even with finish loading and Stops output expected inventory dumb stations can work if you account for trains always being filled to their capacity, which few ppl seem to do.

Orders with rail tankers aren't cleared corrctly and 0.1 of the liquid stays in the tanker.
According to this viewtopic.php?f=23&t=47626&p=278294#p278294 can there the wait until empty rule be added please .

Perhaps once the transition to Stops output expected inventory is complete and I don't require the schedule to tell trains what to unload for the old loading list output anymore.

Until then using setups with 3 pumps guarantees cleaning out fluid wagons.

[wolfram74]

The way I use logistic trains finish_loading=true just doesn't work for me, and I'd managed to turn it off previously, but the update reset it to the default value, and I've unzipped the mod and have set finish_loading = false but stations keep giving the inactivity condition. I've tried recompressing the mod, leaving it uncompressed, I'm growing kind of frustrated and don't know what I'm doing wrong with the config file.

otherwise, I love the mod and am super grateful for your work on it, Optera.

edit: wasn't aware that config files were deprecated by ingame settings

[nagapito]

Is it possible to make it so that if multiple things are sent to a requestor that it will function to pick the thing with the largest request? I have a complex set of combinators that comes close, but It'd be nice to be able to just calculate that I need 50k of Iron, 30k of copper, and 10k of coal, put them all into a single output, and then the station queue up each as it makes its way through the list.

It's certainly possible to order positions inside requests.
I'm not sure ordering by sheer volume is the best way to do it though. Low amounts of ammo or nuclear fuel cells are probably more important than a huge load of coal for berigus process.

i'm playing with smart and unsmart stations at the moment.
Smart means a combinator sets filter inserters for the loading goods and unsmart means stack inserters just put the items from chests into the train.

With this setup the global 'finish loading' setting enabled will overload the unsmart stations and with disabled the smart stations filter inserters aren't cleared because items are left behind if the train is full and a full train is scheduled.

My solution is to let finish unloading disabled and set the locked cargo slots to one at smart stations so there is everytime a bit room to clear the filter inserters.

I recommend using "finish loading" together with "Stops output expected inventory" and use only smart stations.
The setups shown in OP need only 1 combinator at provider and requester and cycle through any length of loading list automatically while only slightly overloading.

The next feature update will make "Stops output expected inventory" the default. Perhaps I'll even remove the old +/- items to load/unload output altogether.

Well i'm currently migrating to smart stations but i seeno point in making mine and smelter stations smart because there is only one item to expect.

Orders with rail tankers aren't cleared corrctly and 0.1 of the liquid stays in the tanker.
According to this viewtopic.php?f=23&t=47626&p=278294#p278294 can there the wait until empty rule be added please .

Greetings, steinio.

I thought pumps also counted for inactivity time so, besides amount = 0 there is also the 2 seconds of inactivity and if the pump is still removing the last bits, train is not inactive!
At least, I dont have any issue with mine, they only leave station when empty

[Optera]

I thought pumps also counted for inactivity time so, besides amount = 0 there is also the 2 seconds of inactivity and if the pump is still removing the last bits, train is not inactive!
At least, I dont have any issue with mine, they only leave station when empty

Pumps do count for inactivity. However it's a known issue that 1 or 2 pumps can fail to 100% empty a fluid wagon, leaving that final 0.1l residue while going inactive.

[iamwyza]

Is it possible to make it so that if multiple things are sent to a requestor that it will function to pick the thing with the largest request? I have a complex set of combinators that comes close, but It'd be nice to be able to just calculate that I need 50k of Iron, 30k of copper, and 10k of coal, put them all into a single output, and then the station queue up each as it makes its way through the list.

It's certainly possible to order positions inside requests.
I'm not sure ordering by sheer volume is the best way to do it though. Low amounts of ammo or nuclear fuel cells are probably more important than a huge load of coal for berigus process.

i'm playing with smart and unsmart stations at the moment.
Smart means a combinator sets filter inserters for the loading goods and unsmart means stack inserters just put the items from chests into the train.

Perhaps circuit signals could be sent that would dictate priority? (and if no priority is set then the one that has the largest request is used as a default) Then you still have the ability to do combinator logic if you want to do something complicated/deterministic, but also have a default method that will work out of the box if you don't care which one comes as long as they all are scheduled at some point or another.

[nuhll]

Your mod is broken, or im doin something wrong, but i do like always.

WHY your mod tries to LOAD MORE into the wagon as possible?

[nuhll]

Nice to see hes adding things for the 1% of users

That's because I happened to be in that 1% myself

btw, did anyone notice if you flip your blueprint with LTN stations in it... it gets deleted and just the lamp and the output is printed... (ALT + R)

You would have to talk to the author of whatever mod you use to mirror blueprints and ask them to add a special case for ltn stops.

If a provider station supplies items A and B, and a requester station is requesting 100 of A and 100 of B, is it intended that there is no delivery if minimum delivery size is set to 200?

I'm torn on this.
Summing up all items to get past min_delivery size makes sense.
However it would require a different strategy finding suitable providers as min delivery size no longer applies to each item but the whole request which can be served by multiple providers.
Min delivery size would become a pure threshold for requesters with no effect on providers. Similar to activating best effort.

I could add request threshold and provide threshold and change how providers are deemed eligible.
If I do that min delivery size, ignore min delivery size and best effort will become obsolete and removed.

I Dont us eany mods for blueprints, its built into factorio.

[Mobius1]

I think the merged delivery is not calculating the stack size of different item types accordingly. Sometimes LTN creates merged deliveries of like 80 stacks into my trains. The trains don't have 80 slots but when its items are stacking on 200 units, it works out the train gets loaded with all the work order and leave the station. But when it comes to barrels, I can't fit 80 stacks of barrels in a train, its a mixed delivery but with items that stacks on 10, so water barrels, waste barrels, oil barrels all stacks of 10. When the train arrives at the provider, it starts loading up barrels but gets full long before finishing loading, then it waits the timeout condition to leave the station but meanwhile the stacker gets full, the mainline starts to get jammed and everything shuts down in the meantime.

What can I do to fix that?

[TheTom]

Is there any guide how to set up a station that is only loading and unloading specific amounts? I am more concerned with loading than unloading

Problem I have is that while I can see how much to load, I seem t obe unable to come up with an idea how to cound what I have loaded. The result is extremely inefficient when talking about bulk goods (like iron plates) but totally unusable for more delicate elements (where you really want ROUGHLY x elements transported).

Any tutorials out? And guides how to set up the combinators?

Similar problem on depots - all named smilar, but the trains pile up on ONE stop, not using the second one "right besides" it (with the same name) ;(

[steinio]

I thought pumps also counted for inactivity time so, besides amount = 0 there is also the 2 seconds of inactivity and if the pump is still removing the last bits, train is not inactive!
At least, I dont have any issue with mine, they only leave station when empty

Pumps do count for inactivity. However it's a known issue that 1 or 2 pumps can fail to 100% empty a fluid wagon, leaving that final 0.1l residue while going inactive.

Hi,

i've three pumps at all my stations but this train got back with 01 again.
I watched it for a while and all works fine but sometimes it don't.

Could you please make a 2 seconds waiting for liquids? Otherwise it's useless for rail tankers.

Greetings, steinio.

[realm174]

Greetings,

I've watched Nilaus tutorial, and with that, was succesful in setting up all my stations fairly quickly. They all seem to work, as far as I can tell. (ie, I've seen my trains being dispatched to more than one of them). The issue I am encountering is that when the base runs low on, say, copper ores, multiple trains get dispatched to the same mining area, creating a major traffic jam. I am really not sure how I can fix that, as I don't know what the logic is for the job creations.

So as I start this, I have about 16-18 trains (1-4-1) waiting at the depot.
A need for Copper comes in, And I see "Creating delivery from xxx to yyy: 8000 Copper ore (As I type this, 5 requests just went through, back to back, 4 are from one mine, and 1 from another mine. So now, I know I will have a traffic jam on the first mine, which will in turn block the main railway (I have room for 2 trains at each mine), which in turn will block any other traffic attempting to go that route.

Anyone can point me to my error?

Edit:
Another thing I just noticed, my trains are being sent to pick up more ore even though there's plenty in stock. My "requesting area" looks like this:

Row of passive provider chests, linked with red wire, the red wire goes to a constant combinator configured to -80000 ores, 5k minimum delivery size. linked to the light on the station with red wire as well.

Edit2: I rewatched the video from Nilaus and he mentioned using the green wire specifically to hook up to the lamp, so I just went and did that to all my mine station, clearing up traffic jams as I go. Now all my trains are at the depot not going anywhere, and I get messages saying "No station supplying xxx" for each of Copper/Iron/Stones, which is what my mines are supplying. I'm confused...

[Mobius1]

Greetings,

I've watched Nilaus tutorial, and with that, was succesful in setting up all my stations fairly quickly. They all seem to work, as far as I can tell. (ie, I've seen my trains being dispatched to more than one of them). The issue I am encountering is that when the base runs low on, say, copper ores, multiple trains get dispatched to the same mining area, creating a major traffic jam. I am really not sure how I can fix that, as I don't know what the logic is for the job creations.

So as I start this, I have about 16-18 trains (1-4-1) waiting at the depot.
A need for Copper comes in, And I see "Creating delivery from xxx to yyy: 8000 Copper ore (As I type this, 5 requests just went through, back to back, 4 are from one mine, and 1 from another mine. So now, I know I will have a traffic jam on the first mine, which will in turn block the main railway (I have room for 2 trains at each mine), which in turn will block any other traffic attempting to go that route.

Anyone can point me to my error?

Edit:
Another thing I just noticed, my trains are being sent to pick up more ore even though there's plenty in stock. My "requesting area" looks like this:

Row of passive provider chests, linked with red wire, the red wire goes to a constant combinator configured to -80000 ores, 5k minimum delivery size. linked to the light on the station with red wire as well.

Edit2: I rewatched the video from Nilaus and he mentioned using the green wire specifically to hook up to the lamp, so I just went and did that to all my mine station, clearing up traffic jams as I go. Now all my trains are at the depot not going anywhere, and I get messages saying "No station supplying xxx" for each of Copper/Iron/Stones, which is what my mines are supplying. I'm confused...

Put a maximum trains signal on your mine and LTN shouldn't send more than that number to the mine.

[Optera]

Is there any guide how to set up a station that is only loading and unloading specific amounts? I am more concerned with loading than unloading

Problem I have is that while I can see how much to load, I seem t obe unable to come up with an idea how to cound what I have loaded. The result is extremely inefficient when talking about bulk goods (like iron plates) but totally unusable for more delicate elements (where you really want ROUGHLY x elements transported).

Any tutorials out? And guides how to set up the combinators?

Similar problem on depots - all named smilar, but the trains pile up on ONE stop, not using the second one "right besides" it (with the same name) ;(

Greetings,

I've watched Nilaus tutorial, and with that, was succesful in setting up all my stations fairly quickly. They all seem to work, as far as I can tell. (ie, I've seen my trains being dispatched to more than one of them). The issue I am encountering is that when the base runs low on, say, copper ores, multiple trains get dispatched to the same mining area, creating a major traffic jam. I am really not sure how I can fix that, as I don't know what the logic is for the job creations.

So as I start this, I have about 16-18 trains (1-4-1) waiting at the depot.
A need for Copper comes in, And I see "Creating delivery from xxx to yyy: 8000 Copper ore (As I type this, 5 requests just went through, back to back, 4 are from one mine, and 1 from another mine. So now, I know I will have a traffic jam on the first mine, which will in turn block the main railway (I have room for 2 trains at each mine), which in turn will block any other traffic attempting to go that route.

Anyone can point me to my error?

Edit:
Another thing I just noticed, my trains are being sent to pick up more ore even though there's plenty in stock. My "requesting area" looks like this:

Row of passive provider chests, linked with red wire, the red wire goes to a constant combinator configured to -80000 ores, 5k minimum delivery size. linked to the light on the station with red wire as well.

Edit2: I rewatched the video from Nilaus and he mentioned using the green wire specifically to hook up to the lamp, so I just went and did that to all my mine station, clearing up traffic jams as I go. Now all my trains are at the depot not going anywhere, and I get messages saying "No station supplying xxx" for each of Copper/Iron/Stones, which is what my mines are supplying. I'm confused...

Nilaus video tutorial is outdated. Accepting only green wire as input never was a thing. No idea where he got it from.
Edit: Removed link to the video from OP. Most things covered changed in 1.2.x.

For current versions refer to the written description in the OP or the demo map to see all in action.

Could you please make a 2 seconds waiting for liquids? Otherwise it's useless for rail tankers.

Greetings, steinio.

Already done, the setting is called "finish loading" and is enabled by default.

[nagapito]

Nilaus video tutorial is outdated. Accepting only green wire as input never was a thing. No idea where he got it from.
Edit: Removed link to the video from OP. Most things covered changed in 1.2.x.

For current versions refer to the written description in the OP or the demo map to see all in action.

I know the 'green wire' thing is damn weird and almost comical but... When I started using your mod (0.14), I couldnt config my depots with a green wire. If I used a green wire, they would just stay with duplicate name state or error state, cant remember which now.
Then I remembered Nilaus green wire issue and tried using a red wire and all started working. So, I thought it was actually a thing and I made all my station blueprints using a green wire connecting to the input combinator and never changed it since then

[Optera]

Nilaus video tutorial is outdated. Accepting only green wire as input never was a thing. No idea where he got it from.
Edit: Removed link to the video from OP. Most things covered changed in 1.2.x.

For current versions refer to the written description in the OP or the demo map to see all in action.

I know the 'green wire' thing is damn weird and almost comical but... When I started using your mod (0.14), I couldnt config my depots with a green wire. If I used a green wire, they would just stay with duplicate name state or error state, cant remember which now.
Then I remembered Nilaus green wire issue and tried using a red wire and all started working. So, I thought it was actually a thing and I made all my station blueprints using a green wire connecting to the input combinator and never changed it since then

Well due to how implemented merging signals has to be implemented one signal will always be slightly faster than the other.
What you do for merging is iterate all signals on one color then iterate over all signals of the other summing identical and creating new signals. In my implementation I first take all green and merge red into green.

Perhaps he misread when i explained this in one of the first pages.

[steinio]

Is there any guide how to set up a station that is only loading and unloading specific amounts? I am more concerned with loading than unloading

Problem I have is that while I can see how much to load, I seem t obe unable to come up with an idea how to cound what I have loaded. The result is extremely inefficient when talking about bulk goods (like iron plates) but totally unusable for more delicate elements (where you really want ROUGHLY x elements transported).

Any tutorials out? And guides how to set up the combinators?

Similar problem on depots - all named smilar, but the trains pile up on ONE stop, not using the second one "right besides" it (with the same name) ;(

Greetings,

I've watched Nilaus tutorial, and with that, was succesful in setting up all my stations fairly quickly. They all seem to work, as far as I can tell. (ie, I've seen my trains being dispatched to more than one of them). The issue I am encountering is that when the base runs low on, say, copper ores, multiple trains get dispatched to the same mining area, creating a major traffic jam. I am really not sure how I can fix that, as I don't know what the logic is for the job creations.

So as I start this, I have about 16-18 trains (1-4-1) waiting at the depot.
A need for Copper comes in, And I see "Creating delivery from xxx to yyy: 8000 Copper ore (As I type this, 5 requests just went through, back to back, 4 are from one mine, and 1 from another mine. So now, I know I will have a traffic jam on the first mine, which will in turn block the main railway (I have room for 2 trains at each mine), which in turn will block any other traffic attempting to go that route.

Anyone can point me to my error?

Edit:
Another thing I just noticed, my trains are being sent to pick up more ore even though there's plenty in stock. My "requesting area" looks like this:

Row of passive provider chests, linked with red wire, the red wire goes to a constant combinator configured to -80000 ores, 5k minimum delivery size. linked to the light on the station with red wire as well.

Edit2: I rewatched the video from Nilaus and he mentioned using the green wire specifically to hook up to the lamp, so I just went and did that to all my mine station, clearing up traffic jams as I go. Now all my trains are at the depot not going anywhere, and I get messages saying "No station supplying xxx" for each of Copper/Iron/Stones, which is what my mines are supplying. I'm confused...

Nilaus video tutorial is outdated. Accepting only green wire as input never was a thing. No idea where he got it from.
Edit: Removed link to the video from OP. Most things covered changed in 1.2.x.

For current versions refer to the written description in the OP or the demo map to see all in action.

Could you please make a 2 seconds waiting for liquids? Otherwise it's useless for rail tankers.

Greetings, steinio.

Already done, the setting is called "finish loading" and is enabled by default.

That works for all goods not only for unloading liquids.
Why do youmake your mod these uneccessary complicated?
It worked super fine in 0.14 with Rail tanker and without finish loading.
Can't follow your thoughts anymore.

Greetings, steinio.

[realm174]

Alright, so I decided to start over and actually use (and study, to the best of my abilities) the blueprints provided. So the depot works great, the requester stations appear to request the proper number of items, based on what's already in the chest, my issue is with the provider. I used the blueprint on the original page, and the only change I've done is change the max train length to 6 instead of 4. As well, I typically have 4 chests on each side of the track, for each wagon, for loading.

Trains get requested, they show up, and sit there waiting to be loaded, but no action from the inserters. But what I'm seeing is that the stack filter inserters are "blank". Am I supposed to manually set those? I was under the impression that they get "told" what to do by the station (in case of loading multiple types of items).

Here's 2 screenshots, one with the train waiting, and one without (so you can see the wiring better)

[Optera]

Already done, the setting is called "finish loading" and is enabled by default.

That works for all goods not only for unloading liquids.
Why do youmake your mod these uneccessary complicated?
It worked super fine in 0.14 with Rail tanker and without finish loading.
Can't follow your thoughts anymore.

Greetings, steinio.

Unnecessarily complicated would be to make fluids and items behave differently. Rail Tanker too behaved exactly like items (as it was in fact using the fake items for train control), so i fail to see the point.

Alright, so I decided to start over and actually use (and study, to the best of my abilities) the blueprints provided. So the depot works great, the requester stations appear to request the proper number of items, based on what's already in the chest, my issue is with the provider. I used the blueprint on the original page, and the only change I've done is change the max train length to 6 instead of 4. As well, I typically have 4 chests on each side of the track, for each wagon, for loading.

Trains get requested, they show up, and sit there waiting to be loaded, but no action from the inserters. But what I'm seeing is that the stack filter inserters are "blank". Am I supposed to manually set those? I was under the impression that they get "told" what to do by the station (in case of loading multiple types of items).

You probably have to manually set provider and requester stops to read train content as shown in the screenshots.
Blueprints don't seem to contain train stop settings.

[realm174]

Alright, so I decided to start over and actually use (and study, to the best of my abilities) the blueprints provided. So the depot works great, the requester stations appear to request the proper number of items, based on what's already in the chest, my issue is with the provider. I used the blueprint on the original page, and the only change I've done is change the max train length to 6 instead of 4. As well, I typically have 4 chests on each side of the track, for each wagon, for loading.

Trains get requested, they show up, and sit there waiting to be loaded, but no action from the inserters. But what I'm seeing is that the stack filter inserters are "blank". Am I supposed to manually set those? I was under the impression that they get "told" what to do by the station (in case of loading multiple types of items).

You probably have to manually set provider and requester stops to read train content as shown in the screenshots.
Blueprints don't seem to contain train stop settings.

Already set to read train contents. I'm not very familiar with the whole circuitry thing, but what part tells the filter inserters what to filter?

Edit: FIgured it out. I have to enable "Set filters" on the filter inserter

[Optera]

The blueprint does contain inserters set to "set filter" and train stops set to "read inventory".
Sadly they don't copy over such settings when placing them over existing entities. Which is why I thought I forgot to properly set the stop.