[0.15.x] Bob's Mods: General Discussion

[Recon777]

I'm just thinking of moving away from condensing steam in the first place, and performing some sort of descrete Water to Pure water conversion recipe directly.

That might be for the best. Because the process of purifying the water is actually more expensive than the electrolysis itself. Like... a LOT more.
For 50% efficiency boilers, I spend 750MJ on making the steam and only 281MJ to power the electrolysers.

[Draconomial]

An issue I have is that a lot of bob's mods don't have descriptions on their mod pages or pinned in the forum or on the first post of this general discussion. I have no idea what the contents of several of bob's mods are, what features they add to the game. And my computer is so slow that testing them all out to find out myself would be very tedious. A cursory search for guides to bob's mods does not bring up satisfactory results. The closest I can find is questions people ask about how certain things within the mods work, and the changelog in the first post of this discussion. Which is still a very no-context way of learning what the mods do. /endrant

[bobingabout]

On a more serious note, I even think that not being able to barrel steam is a dumb thing.

This was actually made for a very good reason. Basically: Steam has a temperature that changes, and in the current implementation, temperature isn't stored.
you might have been able to add in a steam barrelling recipe, but then all steam you removed from the barrel would have to be the same temperature, probably whatever the default temperature is, maybe 100C?

An issue I have is that a lot of bob's mods don't have descriptions on their mod pages or pinned in the forum or on the first post of this general discussion. I have no idea what the contents of several of bob's mods are, what features they add to the game. And my computer is so slow that testing them all out to find out myself would be very tedious. A cursory search for guides to bob's mods does not bring up satisfactory results. The closest I can find is questions people ask about how certain things within the mods work, and the changelog in the first post of this discussion. Which is still a very no-context way of learning what the mods do. /endrant

I think it is something that I need to do at some point. Even if it isn't an item by item break down, a general description saying "It adds 3 more assembling machines, and reworks the recipes of the existing ones" would be a reasonable 1 liner of the assembly mod (repeated about 5 times for the other machines too).

Keep in mind though that the reason why I unpinned all those topics for each mod is because I want to mvoe away from having those. I'd rather have a 1 page topic that breaks down all the mods.

[Arch666Angel]

For angels/CMH players the good news is that the new update doesnt break it.

The bad news is that CMH still overwriting the rocket fuel recipe so nothing changes


Edit: Scratch that. Fertilizer broke with the new ingredients, now it has 3 and requires Angels chemical plant since it has nitric acid, ammonia and urea
And since Angel overwrites nitrogen processing technology, is not even possible to research bobs ammonia

Revert...

The override shouldnt be a problem since the fluid is also replaced in every recipe, except if bob adds the new recipes to the nitrogen processing tech.

Ammonia:Gas, Hydrazane:fluid, hydrogen peroxide:fluid, Nitric-oxide:gas. But what about dinitrogen-tetroxide? Boiling point is 21C, should that be a fluid or a gas? I'm thinking fluid, so barrels.

Well... During day maybe a gas and at night a liquid? On deserts always a gas and... if alien biomes are installed, snowy biomes its a liquid?

It's hard to decide because water has a default temperature of 15C, but all other fluids (Except steam, which defaults to 100C), have a default temperature of 25C.

I'm tempted to go Barrels anyway.

As for the the Hydrazine, I was considering adding a new fuel item instead of a barrel, which would put it on par with steam, as being one of very few fluids not barrellable. I'm thinking I should add the tag to stop barrelling to nitroglycerin too.

In the world of universal barrelling, that does seem strange, but consider that nitroglycerin is explosive, and potentially too dangerous for transport, Hydrazine would purely be because I would want a fuel item instead of a barrel, rather than making a barrel with a fuel value. I'm also considering removing the fuel status from liquid fuel barrel (But keeping the barrel) and adding a new fuel item from liquid fuel.

Can only tell how I did it: Hydrazine is going into the rocket fuel anyway and therefore has an increased fuel value because of extended processing. In petrochem you can also make fuel blocks out of hydrazine directly. That's what I would do in your stead with other stuff, let barreling be a method for logistics only, have extra recipes to make fuel blocks and maybe an upgraded version of fuel blocks to get rid of certain chemicals. So you can have a few unified fuel items from several chemicals.
For the barreling: I was considering to go a similar way and add different kinds of barrels, but decided against it, because it would be realistic, but does add to the barrel/unbarrel mechanic, just replaces one requirement by another, so everything goes into barrels except molten metal

[lieblingsbesuch]

Hi Bob,

I just forgot to mention the most important:

We're 4 german friends playing always the newest Version of your Mods/The Game (w/ everything on very....much/big except for the starting area, that's on very small and everything of your mods enabled) and we're all studying chemistry on Masters/PhD-Degree. We're no gamers at all, but your mods made us sitting for hours and hours in front of our notebooks.

We all agree that you're doing a tremendous, outstanding job with these mods and want to thank you for the effort you put in this. Your mods are a like a little diamond in the ocean of the internet.

Especially the Petrochemical/Electrolysis part makes us laugh sometimes, not because it's bad but because it's so much detailled that some may barely call it "game" anymore. But for us it's very satistfying.

Again, thank you for your work. If you may have any questions or decisions to make considering the chemistry part, we would be happy to help, btw.

[Sokitas]

Hello fellows,

For a few days now, I and, according to the comments in the mod portal, a few other people have trouble getting the Core plugin of 5dim to work with Bob's Mods.

The specific mods causing the incompatibility are Bob's Warfare and Bob's Metals, Chemicals and Intermediates.

Please note, that I am not refering to the healing_per_tick - a nil value conflict, that has popped up a few days ago.

None of the fixes suggested have worked for me.

The error message now popping up on load is:

Failed to load mods: 5dim_core/data-updates.lua:2:5dim_core/prototypes/item-group-changes.lua:237:attempt to index field '?' (a nil value)

I realise, that this is probably more a problem on 5dim's side, but I thought, I'd let you know about this in detail. Just in case.

And thank you for your work on this mod.

[Myrianne]

Hi Bob,

I'm having an issue in my game where "Unsorted gem ore" was not selected at the game start (and thus I do not have the ability to sort gems), but I'm getting large quantities of unsorted gemstone ore anyway, mixed in with my various other gemstone ores that are working properly. Since there's nothing I can do with the unsorted ones, they're clogging up my system.

Just some additional info: "What is it for?" shows the unsorted gemstone has no associated recipes. Also, I'm not playing with Angel's Refining or any other mods that affect my mining/smelting process. I am using Angel's Infinite Ores and RSO, however.


For the meantime I've created a work-around by force-enabling the recipes in my own .lua, but I'm probably not the only person that will have this issue.

[Engimage]

I was thinking about pure water again.
And about all recipes using water as well.
For example we have a recipe creating Salt from water (obviously not pure)
Then we have recipe creating salt water back from water and salt (wut?)
Then we need a recipe for creating pure (distilled) water from common water.
Then I thought about byproduct of distilling water - Salt or Salt Water comes to my mind first.
I think you can see my drift here.

But in this case we would need some way to balance output products like voiding.
However if we get both distilled water and salt water into electrolysers we can vent out unneeded gases...

[Zyrconia]

I think Galena is near impossible to see on the map.

Especially with default map generation options, there is a single tiny patch on your maps you need a lot of time to find. This is like 90's pixel hunt adventure game. 0.15 map popup helps a bit, but still...

Does anyone else think this is a problem?

[bobingabout]

The override shouldnt be a problem since the fluid is also replaced in every recipe, except if bob adds the new recipes to the nitrogen processing tech.

Which I do. Ammonia and Nitric oxide are unlocked via the nitrogen processing technology.

In petrochem you can also make fuel blocks out of hydrazine directly. That's what I would do in your stead with other stuff, let barreling be a method for logistics only, have extra recipes to make fuel blocks and maybe an upgraded version of fuel blocks to get rid of certain chemicals.

I think that's what I'm going to do. Either make a single item (Fuel block+ giving 150MJ), or make a unique item per fuel type (Liquid fuel and Hydrazine in my case)

Hi Bob,

I just forgot to mention the most important:

We're 4 german friends playing always the newest Version of your Mods/The Game (w/ everything on very....much/big except for the starting area, that's on very small and everything of your mods enabled) and we're all studying chemistry on Masters/PhD-Degree. We're no gamers at all, but your mods made us sitting for hours and hours in front of our notebooks.

We all agree that you're doing a tremendous, outstanding job with these mods and want to thank you for the effort you put in this. Your mods are a like a little diamond in the ocean of the internet.

Especially the Petrochemical/Electrolysis part makes us laugh sometimes, not because it's bad but because it's so much detailled that some may barely call it "game" anymore. But for us it's very satistfying.

Again, thank you for your work. If you may have any questions or decisions to make considering the chemistry part, we would be happy to help, btw.

I'm glad you're enjoying it.

Hello fellows,

For a few days now, I and, according to the comments in the mod portal, a few other people have trouble getting the Core plugin of 5dim to work with Bob's Mods.

The specific mods causing the incompatibility are Bob's Warfare and Bob's Metals, Chemicals and Intermediates.

Unfortunately I am too busy working on my own stuff to look into why it would fail with someone elses mods.
Default response: 5dim is an overbob's type mod, if mine exists it changes things within my mod (or in this case at least changes itself based on my mods) and because of this nature, all I can really do is recoment you contact 5dim about the issue.

Hi Bob,

I'm having an issue in my game where "Unsorted gem ore" was not selected at the game start (and thus I do not have the ability to sort gems), but I'm getting large quantities of unsorted gemstone ore anyway, mixed in with my various other gemstone ores that are working properly. Since there's nothing I can do with the unsorted ones, they're clogging up my system.

Just some additional info: "What is it for?" shows the unsorted gemstone has no associated recipes. Also, I'm not playing with Angel's Refining or any other mods that affect my mining/smelting process. I am using Angel's Infinite Ores and RSO, however.


For the meantime I've created a work-around by force-enabling the recipes in my own .lua, but I'm probably not the only person that will have this issue.

I've not noticed this issue myself, but I'll have a look at it.

I was thinking about pure water again.
And about all recipes using water as well.
For example we have a recipe creating Salt from water (obviously not pure)
Then we have recipe creating salt water back from water and salt (wut?)
Then we need a recipe for creating pure (distilled) water from common water.
Then I thought about byproduct of distilling water - Salt or Salt Water comes to my mind first.
I think you can see my drift here.

But in this case we would need some way to balance output products like voiding.
However if we get both distilled water and salt water into electrolysers we can vent out unneeded gases...

I'm confused now. there is no creating salt water from salt and water as far as I know. There is however a salt water electrolysis recipe, and although intuition would say "Oh, that means you electrolyse salt water", this is wrong, you're actually electrolysing brine, which is REALLY SALTY WATER, basically you're electrolysing wet salt, rather than salt water, that's how much salt is in it!
but yes, most of your points are things I've already considered. The method I've currently used for getting pure water doesn't really allow for the creation of salt, or other impurities, but if I change the way you purify water, giving salt as a byproduct is viable.

[Engimage]

I'm confused now. there is no creating salt water from salt and water as far as I know. There is however a salt water electrolysis recipe, and although intuition would say "Oh, that means you electrolyse salt water", this is wrong, you're actually electrolysing brine, which is REALLY SALTY WATER, basically you're electrolysing wet salt, rather than salt water, that's how much salt is in it!
but yes, most of your points are things I've already considered. The method I've currently used for getting pure water doesn't really allow for the creation of salt, or other impurities, but if I change the way you purify water, giving salt as a byproduct is viable.

Ok brine it is.
So you can possibly create a recipe for chemical plant (which fits the most here I suppose as we are talking only fluids here) which will produce two fluids - distilled water and brine - which will be valid inputs for respective electrolyser recipes.
As an alternative you can alter chemical furnace to have output and add distilled water as a byproduct of salt extraction.

[bobingabout]

I'm confused now. there is no creating salt water from salt and water as far as I know. There is however a salt water electrolysis recipe, and although intuition would say "Oh, that means you electrolyse salt water", this is wrong, you're actually electrolysing brine, which is REALLY SALTY WATER, basically you're electrolysing wet salt, rather than salt water, that's how much salt is in it!
but yes, most of your points are things I've already considered. The method I've currently used for getting pure water doesn't really allow for the creation of salt, or other impurities, but if I change the way you purify water, giving salt as a byproduct is viable.

Ok brine it is.
So you can possibly create a recipe for chemical plant (which fits the most here I suppose as we are talking only fluids here) which will produce two fluids - distilled water and brine - which will be valid inputs for respective electrolyser recipes.
As an alternative you can alter chemical furnace to have output and add distilled water as a byproduct of salt extraction.

Although this makes sense.... Chemical plant by default is unlocked via Chemical Processing 2, which requires Electrolysis 2, so you can't have Electrolysis depend on Chemical processing 2 for the Chemical plant to purify water.

Basically, we have 3 options.
1. Clean it in an electrolyser.... which is dumb.
2. Clean it in an assembling machine... which is only slightly less dumb.
3. Make a new building for cleaning water!... except, graphics. I could make it look like a pipe though.

There are other options, yes, like a chemical furnace, but currently it has no fluid outputs, so is invalid and comes under the make something new category. I'd also rather stick to solid salt than add a new brine fluid.
Also, if you did have both pure water and brine from the same recipe, you then have issues on how to balance the two fluids.

My current thoughts is to use assembling machine (Like condensing steam does now) and have it take water to produce pure water, with a chance of getting salt each cycle. And then keep the boiling recipe to get salt.

[nagapito]

Basically, we have 3 options.
1. Clean it in an electrolyser.... which is dumb.
2. Clean it in an assembling machine... which is only even dumber.
3. Make a new building for cleaning water!... except, graphics. Anyone want to do it? Anyone?

Fixed for you!

While a couple years ago graphics were a problem, I think that now, if you ask or even make the request a little more public like outside your forum section/reddit/... you might find a lot of people willing to help.
Sadly, my graphic expertise only goes as far as doing some tinting in Gimp

[Engimage]

Chemical plant by default is unlocked via Chemical Processing 2, which requires Electrolysis 2, so you can't have Electrolysis depend on Chemical processing 2 for the Chemical plant to purify water.

The power is in your hands. You can unlock Chemical Plant by Electrolysis and water distillation recipe as well.
And by Chemical Processing 2 you can unlock only respective recipes.

[Recon777]

Chemical plant by default is unlocked via Chemical Processing 2, which requires Electrolysis 2

Actually, that's the Steel Chemical Furnace. The Chemical Plant is unlocked earlier, though I can't seem to find the tech in my list at the moment.

Wouldn't it be great if there was a way to say "what unlocks X" and get the tech for it?

[nagapito]

Chemical plant by default is unlocked via Chemical Processing 2, which requires Electrolysis 2

Actually, that's the Steel Chemical Furnace. The Chemical Plant is unlocked earlier, though I can't seem to find the tech in my list at the moment.

Wouldn't it be great if there was a way to say "what unlocks X" and get the tech for it?

Chemical plant is unlocked at.... drums.... Chemical plant research and does not require Electrolisys, only steel and electronics. This change is actually made by BobRevamp

[bobingabout]

Chemical plant by default is unlocked via Chemical Processing 2, which requires Electrolysis 2

Actually, that's the Steel Chemical Furnace. The Chemical Plant is unlocked earlier, though I can't seem to find the tech in my list at the moment.

Wouldn't it be great if there was a way to say "what unlocks X" and get the tech for it?

Chemical plant is unlocked at.... drums.... Chemical plant research and does not require Electrolisys, only steel and electronics. This change is actually made by BobRevamp

Chemical plant research does move when the chemical plant is unlocked. I was talking about where it is when you don't have revamp installed. (Since you don't NEED revamp to get this stuff, it's all in bobplates)
Look at where it is in bobplates without revamp, and you'll see what I'm talking about.

[Recon777]

Is anyone else missing Lithia Water on the map when running RSO?

I think something broke it because I've got a slightly older map which has it.

[clampi]

Hello Bob,

Here are some of my thoughts regarding the water purification/desalination process. I took a look at Wikipedia page regarding the desalination process and there are multiple ways to do that. Some are more efficient than others, some depend on other industrial infrastructure, some are simple to implement, others require complex technology. Thus, instead of searching for a single, simple, easy solution, you could go bobmods TM way and offer multiple options for the desalination process. Having choices is always nice and thus far you've always gone for them, AFAIK.

Let's say, start simple in terms of complexity but expensive in terms of energy, maybe evaporation-condensation. Then go up tech tree, unlock some advanced tech, then provide an alternate way to get the purified water and brine. The alternative should be more complex or require special ingredients, but be more energy efficient. Let's imagine something on the lines of having a big requirement of plastic bars to transform them in membranes for reverse osmosis. Each method should support upgrades, for large volume purification, and not force the players to have zillions of purification plants the way smelting lines are done.

Now, on to another topic, regarding things you may have missed from bobmodules, here is some code I use for beacons

Code: Select all

if data.raw.beacon["beacon"].fast_replaceable_group == nil or data.raw.beacon["beacon"].fast_replaceable_group == "" then
	data.raw.beacon["beacon"].fast_replaceable_group = "beacon"
end

if data.raw.beacon["beacon-2"] and data.raw.beacon["beacon-2"].fast_replaceable_group == nil then
	data.raw.beacon["beacon-2"].fast_replaceable_group = data.raw.beacon["beacon"].fast_replaceable_group
end

if data.raw.beacon["beacon-3"] and data.raw.beacon["beacon-3"].fast_replaceable_group == nil then
	data.raw.beacon["beacon-3"].fast_replaceable_group = data.raw.beacon["beacon"].fast_replaceable_group
end

[septemberWaves]

Is anyone else missing Lithia Water on the map when running RSO?

I think something broke it because I've got a slightly older map which has it.

Lithia water should spawn, it's just quite rare (I tend to find several huge patches of gold before finding any lithia, and sometimes even tungsten appears closer to spawn). I thought it was missing a while ago too, but shortly after posting reporting the "issue" I discovered some lithia water.

How far have you explored? It might be worth going into a test world, enabling cheat mode, and running across the terrain with as many exoskeleton legs as you can fit in the highest-tier powersuit to check to get a good idea of whether lithia water actually isn't spawning.

The only worldgen substance I haven't found at all is cobalt, but considering the fact that I can get it as a byproduct of copper processing I don't think lack of the ore is much of an issue (similarly with silver, though I have found one patch of that earlier).