Satellite required to build stuff in the zoom-to-map view

[chris13524]

The zoom-to-map view is becoming a little OP, and I'd like to see a few of those things be toned down a bit. Currently, you are able to place blueprints in any loaded (player range or the smaller box from a radar) area. However, you cannot change recipes, adjust/view circuit conditions, filters, etc. I suggest, that instead of having this tipping point where the map becomes too OP, or not powerful enough, we introduce the advanced satellite.

What we have now, is a satellite that is launched that does nothing. I suggest that this be changed to a "basic satellite"; one that can be launched into space and act just like a radar can currently (as an upgrade), keeping an area loaded with perhaps a bit bigger range. It could be maneuvered a certain number of times before running out of thrusters, crashing, and requiring you to launch a new one. If you want more territory loaded, you need more satellites.

This brings me to my advanced satellite idea. Using advanced satellites instead of basic ones would allow you to change filters, recipes, and practically control the whole world through the map view. This would come with a hefty research cost as well as very expensive components required for the satellites. The technology name "Orbital Command" was suggested here: https://www.reddit.com/r/factorio/comme ... m/dh2aovk/

Furthermore, advanced satellites could allow wireless communication (which was originally planned for radars I believe).

Just as a side thought (building on the satellites), it would be awesome to be able to nuke stuff from a special nuke satellite. It would require a certain number of atomic bombs in the crafting recipe and would use those up as you nuke stuff. For every nuke satellite you launch, some number of nukes would be added to your total nuke count. When in the map view, a notification would appear next to your hotbar which has the number of nukes (like the combat robots). When clicking on it, you'll get a nuke icon in your hand, and a giant circle (or square if that's how it works) around the area that will be damaged. After clicking, a popup will appear asking you to confirm the launch, and then a 10 second countdown will commence (perhaps allowing you to cancel, wasting the bomb). When it reaches zero, the screen will flash and a giant animated mushroom cloud would appear (if you've zoomed-to-map). I just think the game would be more entertaining with these effects. I haven't actually tried the atomic bombs in 0.15 yet, so some of this stuff could already be there.

[ssilk]

What I'm interested in: What is the argument for the first sentence:

The zoom-to-map view is becoming a little OP

? Why do you think so?

[chris13524]

What I'm interested in: What is the argument for the first sentence:

The zoom-to-map view is becoming a little OP

? Why do you think so?

Not that it's OP now, but the direction it's going could get to be OP. Maybe the developers don't want the ability to change recipes remotely, but there are a lot of people asking why you can't do it. If you're able to place blueprints, you should be able to edit filters. If they do end up implementing changing recipes and filters remotely, I think that would be OP.

That's why I suggested this, a way to allow changing recipes and filters, without becoming too OP, too soon in the game.

[Slayn25]

I wouldn't call it OP. If you created a logistics network that has access to the materials you need where you want to build something than I think you should be rewarded for it. Not to mention once your base gets huge it's very nice to be able to fix a small problem remotely than to have to travel there. I already spend too much time commuting IRL, I'm loving the remote abilities.

[BenSeidel]

While I would not call it "OP" I would definitely call it "P". During a game I find it really useful. I can zoom to see where the bottleneck is, see what type of biters are attacking me at the turrets, etc.
BUT, like all powerful things, giving them to the player right off the bat is a lost opportunity to give the player a sense of progression, of increasing power.
If the detailed view was linked to the first launch of a satellite, then that would not only give a sense of progression, but also give additional build priority choices. Do you go for that rocket earlier to get that feature, or do you just put it off until you need space science packs?

I think it would add to the game if it was behind a tech wall (maybe not the launch of a rocket specifically, but some other tech nonetheless).

[chris13524]

While I would not call it "OP" I would definitely call it "P". During a game I find it really useful. I can zoom to see where the bottleneck is, see what type of biters are attacking me at the turrets, etc.
BUT, like all powerful things, giving them to the player right off the bat is a lost opportunity to give the player a sense of progression, of increasing power.
If the detailed view was linked to the first launch of a satellite, then that would not only give a sense of progression, but also give additional build priority choices. Do you go for that rocket earlier to get that feature, or do you just put it off until you need space science packs?

I think it would add to the game if it was behind a tech wall (maybe not the launch of a rocket specifically, but some other tech nonetheless).

Yes, this was the sort of gist I was going for

[Zaydan]

The zoom-to-map view is becoming a little OP

After using the feature, I don't think I could go back to the game without it. The entire zoom to world feature is a great upgrade and adds a lot of fun to the game while removing a lot of time-consuming/running tasks.

Maybe you call it OP, but I just view it as a change to the way you play the game. It makes your experience a little easier and convenient. If you think it is too OP, then you can set your own rules/goals and decide not to use it.

I think there is already a large trade off associated with the costs, hassel and time with building with bots from the map.
1/ If you're building away from your hub, you will need to progressively place roboports, power lines and radars from the map, in most cases guessing distances.
2/ Bots will take a fair amount of time to dispatch the items to be built compared to building it locally.
3/ Building locally is probably easier/faster in most circumstances. The map just adds convenience for smaller tasks or for blueprints that don't require additional attention and are within the construction zones.

[BenSeidel]

After using the feature, I don't think I could go back to the game without it. The entire zoom to world feature is a great upgrade and adds a lot of fun to the game while removing a lot of time-consuming/running tasks.

I agree,
But it's not a case of removing it, just putting it behind a paywall.
While the points you said are nice, they all require bots, something that you won't have in a reliable amount until late game anyway. The biggest thing the zoom to map allows me to see (early game) is why the factory does not have item A. In 0.14 you would have to run to it, see that you are missing item B, run to there to see that you are missing item C... etc all the way to item Z. Being able to do this from the map saves you sooooo much time but removes a part of the game that new/future player will never get to experience.

If it was part of the research then it could be positioned late enough in a game that you still have to run round your base to find the shortage so that when you finally get it you feel the relief at not having to do it again. It should be similar to getting your construction robots: just knowing that you don't have to spin those inserters manually all the way along your line is sooo good.

[ssilk]

I kinda love to add the radar view as research. Cause it would make much more sense.
Cause currently the difference between player view and map view is - not logical. (I can explain it more detailed, but I think most know what I mean)

I would not add it late (it's just the radar technology), but I would make it expensive, cause it is so powerful.

[chris13524]

I kinda love to add the radar view as research. Cause it would make much more sense.
Cause currently the difference between player view and map view is - not logical. (I can explain it more detailed, but I think most know what I mean)

I would not add it late (it's just the radar technology), but I would make it expensive, cause it is so powerful.

Do you mean regular radar should be expensive? I disagree with that.

I think regular radar and minimap should become a research (cheap, 10 red) just because. Then the ability to zoom-to-map should be another reaearch (blue perhaps). And then the ability to place blueprints (and possibly edit filters, recipes, etc.) with high-tech science packs.