Terrain elevation, hills and mountains with fake cliffs

[n00dles]

oh boy it bugged me since i read what all you of had to say.. couldn't keep myself away from trying it...^^
sadly i'am just able to make you look sexy with PS, not a 0111001 person.. anyone interested to make an mod?
i could make decent images / sprites, in what ever format is required, if someone is willing to script it.

as far as i know it can't be that hard..
it's like adding 8 (+the belt / pipe stuff) ofc.) new tree's / rocks to the game, right?
shouldn't be destructible etc. but i guess that would be just some minor changes..

the mining drill train is far away from being a beauty, i just thought now that we can use equipment on vehicles it would might be a possibility's to make tunnels without blowing up the planet!

it would take some brainstorming, what could be and what not, maybe we could first make it work on the map editor & build a scenario with it. so the community can see for it self how it "feels".



the tunnel could be possible in the same way "Factorisimo" works, but i'm not quite sure if the pathfinding AI would bug out by that. could trains pass trough ? what about our beloved biters? could they enter? is that even a thing to consider?
i'm against a underground base, should be limited to non connecting tunnels, in fact there shouldn't be much more then train tracks inside maybe a lamp or two.^^



so long & thanks for all the fish, n00dles

[n00dles]

"...you have to provide them rations and ammo so having a factory make sushi to feed them would be a big help to him.

well i didn't asked what arumba (btw big fan, bought factorio because of him & steeeeeeejo) in a bob's mod let's play would use it for nor do i really care what some mercenaries eat..^^

i asked YOU mageman, what would you like to do with it, perhaps if someone who's experienced enough on 011001 stuff likes your idea when he reads it & is willing to do it..

[mageman1842]

Haven't played this game mutch. So I'm just pointing out stuff that I think could help the modders and if the mods are good enough then they should be incorporated into a "new vanilla".

big post

[quote="n00dles"]oh boy it bugged me since i read what all you of had to say.. couldn't keep myself away from trying it...^^
sadly i'am just able to make you look sexy with PS, not a 0111001 person.. anyone interested to make an mod?
i could make decent images / sprites, in what ever format is required, if someone is willing to script it.

as far as i know it can't be that hard..
it's like adding 8 (+the belt / pipe stuff) ofc.) new tree's / rocks to the game, right?
shouldn't be destructible etc. but i guess that would be just some minor changes..

the mining drill train is far away from being a beauty, i just thought now that we can use equipment on vehicles it would might be a possibility's to make tunnels without blowing up the planet!

it would take some brainstorming, what could be and what not, maybe we could first make it work on the map editor & build a scenario with it. so the community can see for it self how it "feels".



the tunnel could be possible in the same way "Factorisimo" works, but i'm not quite sure if the pathfinding AI would bug out by that. could trains pass trough ? what about our beloved biters? could they enter? is that even a thing to consider?
i'm against a underground base, should be limited to non connecting tunnels, in fact there shouldn't be much more then train tracks inside maybe a lamp or two.^^



so long & thanks for all the fish, n00dles[/quote]

looking good n00dles

[aubergine18]

n00dles that mockup looks awesome!

I think modders could potentially implement such a feature - to some extent. The main issue is having the ability to choose wether to go 'through/up/down' a mountain, vs. creating a new underground 'surface' within it (like underground mine). I think that's part that mods would struggle with, because currently the modding API is somewhat limited (for numerous technical reasons) when it comes to certain types of mouse/keyboard interactions, particularly while placing entities. The only way to do it in a nice way would be to incorporate in to vanilla game.

IMO underground base, or rather underground mines - for rare ores, particularly those that might come with nuclear power - is very desirable. If there was some way to limit what entities could be placed (to prevent player from creating whole base underground) and also have disadvantages like pollution buildup (thus needing ventilation, etc) I think it would be really nice feature to have underground mines.

[n00dles]

n00dles that mockup looks awesome!

thanks man, well already did some "ground work". pimpt the graphics a 'lil and made a sprite sheet (if you want to call it that way)

i did indeed, planned on underground mining in the same manner factorisimo works. (because i think it wouldn't work to drive through a tunnel)the author of that mod has some stuff restricted inside his buildings, so it is possible.

i was preparing an more detailed plan to post on the suggestion forum. maybe mid week, there is other stuff lurking deep in my mind that needs to be modded as well.

if nobody is willing to support this project or even want to use the graphics.. hell i would even learn the stuff to do it on my own. but i promise never to release it.. will just host hours of hours gameplay vid's on youtube!

[hitzu]

Great mockup, n00dles! But I would increase the height of cliffs to 3 or 4 squares so the train tunnel wouldn't be tightly squished and would look like the ceiling is paper-thin.

[n00dles]

... But I would increase the height of cliffs to 3 or 4 squares so the train tunnel wouldn't be tightly squished and would look like the ceiling is paper-thin.

hmm,can't imagine that.. oh wait i can! resize for the win..
i don't think that i like that, looks way to tall for the rest of the stuff..

btw the train on that picture (and the train tracks as well) are from a screenshot of a different zoom level.
first realized it when i created new graphics. so there is nothing in relation to real sizes of the game.

well the entrance to the tunnel is just a small pole and another flip.. without the bottom part, guess nobody would like it anyway. ^^ was just trying to use stuff that is already there so i wouldn't look so "unnatural" because it hast to fit and stick with the theme.

just wait 2 days~ and see what i have done till then, ok?

greetings, n00dles

[ssilk]

This looks really nice, no awesome, much better than I thought.

I see problems with entrances from the north and the sides; needs really much work to make look it properly.
I like the idea with the underground entities, totally logical.

[aubergine18]

To help visualise entrances from north and sides, stone tunnel entrance could be used, something like:



The game "Train Fever" uses a similar design; it gives good visibility from all angles and zoom levels.



Another tunnel design (large image so just linking to this one): https://www.transportfever.net/filebase ... cd982f.jpg

Pipe and belt entrances could be tricky, although the current way underground pipes/belts are rendered should suffice?

For underground mines, there would also need to be way to get electricity, circuit network, maybe even logistic network from Nauvis to the underground surface. For such things, maybe a vent sprite on top of the hill to provide ventilation and also act as conduit for circuit and electric lines? Robots could fly through the vent maybe?

[tobsimon]

It is great to see, how easily the illusion of different hights is achived. The horizontal belts and pipe which go through a cliff look like they are shifted to the side, as predicted. To improve on the graphics, I'd suggest making them about twice their current size, so that the shift accounts fo a whole tile, and making the cliffs not vertical, but steep, so that the north and vertical sides are more visible and prominent and that the north side does not hide the next buildable tile above.

[Jan11]

I think this is necessary for the game. I don`t have any problems to expand my base, because it`s a big flat landscape and bugs are very easy to handle. I think a landscape with hills and cliffs makes the game more difficult. Like

[Matthias_Wlkp]

I'm all for false cliffs. I actually wanted to post the same game examples as OP . C&C was my first RTS game...

[golfmiketango]

Too much slope, IMO.

[MalcolmCooks]

I'm really split on this to be honest. One the one hand, this mockup looks incredible and I can really see it adding a lot to the game. That small scale of cliffs I think actually fits pretty well with Factorio. A train tunnel should only be able to fit on TWO cliffs though, so maybe it should be possible to dig cuttings into the rock, perhaps by blasting it with dynamite. Then it follows that it should also be possible to fill in areas or build foundations.

HOWEVER

I'm not sure that it would actually fit the game. The geography of Nauvis may seem pretty unrealistic compared to Earth, but remember that it is an alien planet, and since the whole surface consists of flat plains and lakes, it is probably geologically very stable and inactive. No plate tectonics or volcanoes, means no mountains and cliffs, and if the whole surface is very flat then there is no flowing water to form valleys ect. My point is that although the planet doesn't resemble Earth, I don't neccessarily think that it seems unrealistic.

So basically.... on the one hand, I think Factorio works perfectly as it is now. But I also think that false cliffs would add a lot to the game without spoiling the gameplay or the "feel" of it. Maybe if the cliffs were very limited in height, like you could have a maximum difference of 3 or 4 cliff across the world, with water only appearing in the lowest elevation. The cliffs would always make complete contours, with a few places where you could move from one level to the next, and the ability to research a technology that lets you build your own slopes.

[BraveSteelDragon]

I'm really split on this to be honest. One the one hand, this mockup looks incredible and I can really see it adding a lot to the game. That small scale of cliffs I think actually fits pretty well with Factorio. A train tunnel should only be able to fit on TWO cliffs though, so maybe it should be possible to dig cuttings into the rock, perhaps by blasting it with dynamite. Then it follows that it should also be possible to fill in areas or build foundations.

HOWEVER

I'm not sure that it would actually fit the game. The geography of Nauvis may seem pretty unrealistic compared to Earth, but remember that it is an alien planet, and since the whole surface consists of flat plains and lakes, it is probably geologically very stable and inactive. No plate tectonics or volcanoes, means no mountains and cliffs, and if the whole surface is very flat then there is no flowing water to form valleys ect. My point is that although the planet doesn't resemble Earth, I don't neccessarily think that it seems unrealistic.

So basically.... on the one hand, I think Factorio works perfectly as it is now. But I also think that false cliffs would add a lot to the game without spoiling the gameplay or the "feel" of it. Maybe if the cliffs were very limited in height, like you could have a maximum difference of 3 or 4 cliff across the world, with water only appearing in the lowest elevation. The cliffs would always make complete contours, with a few places where you could move from one level to the next, and the ability to research a technology that lets you build your own slopes.

The only 'geologically stable and inactive' planet i can think of is... well... kinda dead.
Even then, geologically dead planets still retain nonetheless their geographical peculiarities.

[Forsaken67]

n00dles quote

[quote="n00dles"]oh boy it bugged me since i read what all you of had to say.. couldn't keep myself away from trying it...^^
sadly i'am just able to make you look sexy with PS, not a 0111001 person.. anyone interested to make an mod?
i could make decent images / sprites, in what ever format is required, if someone is willing to script it.

as far as i know it can't be that hard..
it's like adding 8 (+the belt / pipe stuff) ofc.) new tree's / rocks to the game, right?
shouldn't be destructible etc. but i guess that would be just some minor changes..

the mining drill train is far away from being a beauty, i just thought now that we can use equipment on vehicles it would might be a possibility's to make tunnels without blowing up the planet!

it would take some brainstorming, what could be and what not, maybe we could first make it work on the map editor & build a scenario with it. so the community can see for it self how it "feels".



the tunnel could be possible in the same way "Factorisimo" works, but i'm not quite sure if the pathfinding AI would bug out by that. could trains pass trough ? what about our beloved biters? could they enter? is that even a thing to consider?
i'm against a underground base, should be limited to non connecting tunnels, in fact there shouldn't be much more then train tracks inside maybe a lamp or two.^^



so long & thanks for all the fish, n00dles[/quote]

ssilk quote

[quote="ssilk"]This looks really nice, no awesome, much better than I thought.

I see problems with entrances from the north and the sides; needs really much work to make look it properly.
I like the idea with the underground entities, totally logical.[/quote]

I think an easy solution to the tunnel entrances would be to limit them to 2 block high cliffs that way the tunnels would be proper size and the trains would realistically fit. However if they implement it to a max height of 1 then this wouldn't work. However smaller tunnels could still be used for mining, by simply walking up to it and hitting enter like your getting in a vehicle, you could be taken to a limited size room full of random high amounts of ores. They could even be clumped together so that you would need to sort them out for processing. These mine entrances could also be limited by only being capable of digging in designated locations on cliffs to make the entrance just like how you can only mine on flat ground where ores are.

[Ranakastrasz]

Those belt tunnels up the cliff from the left side, while I know they are perfectly lined up, appear to not be so, due to the illusion of depth. Which goes to show how effective that is.

Ofsetting the visual positions of things on cliffs might be advisable.

[Jan11]

are there any news concerning this topic ?

[vdvTeHb]

What do You think about underground hives and any mobs, who can destroy rock or create tunnel to your base. Is it possible to create underground modules 5x5 with wall on perimeter to build facility there, outside can create only railway, belt, pipes.

[ssilk]

I think that is already a mod called "Factorissimo".