[0.12.29] [Oxyd] Cached Path Finding

[TheRealBecks]

Hi,

we're using a dedicated server (linux, version 0.12.29) and have a multiplayer game running with lot's of mods enabled: Bob's mods, something other and also a terraforming mod (viewtopic.php?f=93&t=15038)

We're using this terraforming mod to dig moats all around of our bases with only one defended entry left. The problem here is, that the enemies won't found the path anymore. They won't attack the bases and if we're going to the biters, so they will follow us, they sometimes also run onto the old path and disappear a few tiles before that moat. It seems to be that they are using a cached path?

Restarting the server isn't working, they are still using the old path. Is there any command or something else, that we can do, so the cached paths (?) get deleted?

Regards,
Becks

[Loewchen]

I think what you describe is the expected behavior of the AI regarding terrain change, if the path is blocked and an alternative can not be found in x steps the unit will either wait or if the amount of waiting units surpasses a specific amount will just disappear to prevent massive enemy accumulations. Improving the enemy AI is scheduled for 0.14 I think. The cached path though should be removed automatically after the first units could not reach the target area through it, you can check on that by displaying those paths in the debug-menu (F4).

[Oxyd]

Can I have the save?

[TheRealBecks]

Hi Oxyd,

I've attached the backup of our savegame when we first mentioned, that we don't get attacked anymore... Thanks!

Regards,
Becks

[Oxyd]

Well, there are no cached paths going across any of the moats. The biters sure do seem weird, though. Are you using any mods that change biter behaviour?

[TheRealBecks]

The following mods are activated:

Code: Select all

factorio@bierchengaming:~/factorio-0-12-29/mods$ cat mod-list.json
{
    "mods": [
        {
            "name": "base",
            "enabled": "true"
        },
        {
            "name": "additionaloilrefineries",
            "enabled": "true"
        },
        {
            "name": "AutoTrash",
            "enabled": "true"
        },
        {
            "name": "bobassembly",
            "enabled": "true"
        },
        {
            "name": "bobconfig",
            "enabled": "true"
        },
        {
            "name": "bobelectronics",
            "enabled": "true"
        },
        {
            "name": "bobenemies",
            "enabled": "true"
        },
        {
            "name": "boblibrary",
            "enabled": "true"
        },
        {
            "name": "boblogistics",
            "enabled": "true"
        },
        {
            "name": "bobmining",
            "enabled": "true"
        },
        {
            "name": "bobmodules",
            "enabled": "true"
        },
        {
            "name": "bobores",
            "enabled": "true"
        },
        {
            "name": "bobplates",
            "enabled": "true"
        },
        {
            "name": "bobpower",
            "enabled": "true"
        },
        {
            "name": "bobtech",
            "enabled": "true"
        },
        {
            "name": "bobwarfare",
            "enabled": "true"
        },
        {
            "name": "fastnsmart",
            "enabled": "true"
        },
        {
            "name": "fluid-barrel",
            "enabled": "true"
        },
        {
            "name": "GDIW",
            "enabled": "true"
        },
        {
            "name": "gravestone-mod",
            "enabled": "true"
        },
        {
            "name": "Logistics Railway",
            "enabled": "true"
        },
        {
            "name": "long-reach",
            "enabled": "true"
        },
        {
            "name": "radar-two",
            "enabled": "true"
        },
        {
            "name": "RailTanker",
            "enabled": "true"
        },
        {
            "name": "rso-mod",
            "enabled": "true"
        },
        {
            "name": "Terraforming",
            "enabled": "true"
        },
        {
            "name": "TreeSaplings",
            "enabled": "true"
        }
    ]
}

Hmm, maybe one of the following mods change the ai behaviour: bobenemies, bobwarfare

Maybe bobingabout can say something to this topic?

Regards,
Becks

[bobingabout]

Bob's mods simply add new items and entities, they don't add any scripting, and therefore, don't change any AI behaviour, at least not on purpose.

I have heard of some issues specifically with the new biters though, related to their short (unit measurement of 1) attack range, where they get confused and don't chew on walls, but running up to a moat and disappearing? nothing in my mods I know of should be able to cause that.

[TheRealBecks]

We've played intensively the last weeks and what I can say is, that the biters still behave weird - looks still like a bug as they don't see small water/moats as obstacle and want to get through it. We've builded a base for farming biters in the far west of our map. Our base is directly located between three huge nests, so the biters sometimes get triggered, because your laser defense shots some of them. We're producing massive, big, red pollution in our base, so the biters nests get that dark red pollution, too. The biters moving around and form really big groups. Until this point everything is fine.

But at one point the whole biters group gets stuck - they don't move anymore. And that's it. No attack, no movement, nothing. The only way to kill them is to go to the group and trigger them, so they are following the player directly into the laser defense.

It looks like that they still got problems with water. In our first bases was moat (thickness of one block) around the base. The biters sometimes went directly into that moat, got stuck and disappeared. When widen the moat to up to 5 blocks, this don't happen that often anymore, it seems to work a better, but absolutely not perfect, as they still don't attack that often.

Our base in the west had a moat with a thickness of five blocks, but was only about 10 blocks long. Then there was a gap five blocks long. This structure has been build about 20 times, so there was enough space to attack our base. Nothing happened.

The last thing we did, was changing that moat back to land and builded walls on it instead of that moat. I'm going to test it today in the evening.

[daniel34]

Moved to Bug Reports on author's request.

[Oxyd]

Moved to Waiting for 0.13 because there have been quite a lot of changes to the AI in 0.13 and it's possible this issue will not be present there.

[Oxyd]

I've checked in 0.15 and it seems to be working as it should – biters find paths around the moats, through the little funnels that you created.

[TheRealBecks]

In Version 0.15(.40?) the bug still exists. When our base got bigger and the UPS dropped below 60 UPS the biter attacked way less than before. Actually we're at 30 UPS and the biters don't attack anymore. They don't move but stll get even more.

You can download the save game with the mods here: https://www.dropbox.com/s/hn9h29nx0z7by ... e.zip?dl=0

It would be nice if that bug gets fixed

EDIT: They are attacking, but way less.