[0.12.x][v0.12.12] Bob's Metals, Chemicals and Intermediates

[Kayser]

Sulphur Dioxide isn't a Gas, it's a Liquid, it doesn't vent. You need to use a chemical lab to turn it into either Sulfur, or Sulfuric Acid, each of which already have plenty of uses.

Aw, I thought it's a gas. Thanks.

It is a gas at room temperature and pressure. But you wouldn't want to vent it anyway, because it's heavy, toxic, and smells like sh*t.

[bobingabout]

Sulphur Dioxide isn't a Gas, it's a Liquid, it doesn't vent. You need to use a chemical lab to turn it into either Sulfur, or Sulfuric Acid, each of which already have plenty of uses.

Aw, I thought it's a gas. Thanks.

It is a gas at room temperature and pressure. But you wouldn't want to vent it anyway, because it's heavy, toxic, and smells like sh*t.

Okay, maybe it is a gas. Still, the point of being able to vent gasses, Oxygen, Nitrogen, Chlorine and Hydrogen, is because their use varies wildly depending on what you're doing. In the case of Sulphur dioxide, it can very easilly be converted into either Sulfur, or Sulfuric Acid, which is commonly used, and usually one of the major points, along side plastic, for creating the oil chain in the first place. You can quite easilly turn it into sulfur and box it, making it easier to control than the ones that can be vented, or turn it into acid and pipe it into your battery factory, or other uses. I think some people don't even really use the oil -> Sulfuric Acid chain anymore if they're using this.

[Kayser]

Sulphur Dioxide isn't a Gas, it's a Liquid, it doesn't vent. You need to use a chemical lab to turn it into either Sulfur, or Sulfuric Acid, each of which already have plenty of uses.

Aw, I thought it's a gas. Thanks.

It is a gas at room temperature and pressure. But you wouldn't want to vent it anyway, because it's heavy, toxic, and smells like sh*t.

Okay, maybe it is a gas. Still, the point of being able to vent gasses, Oxygen, Nitrogen, Chlorine and Hydrogen, is because their use varies wildly depending on what you're doing. In the case of Sulphur dioxide, it can very easilly be converted into either Sulfur, or Sulfuric Acid, which is commonly used, and usually one of the major points, along side plastic, for creating the oil chain in the first place. You can quite easilly turn it into sulfur and box it, making it easier to control than the ones that can be vented, or turn it into acid and pipe it into your battery factory, or other uses. I think some people don't even really use the oil -> Sulfuric Acid chain anymore if they're using this.

If I'm not mistaken, batteries draw exaclty the amount of H2SO4 that is generated by its own lead processing, so more sulphur dioxide than needed is always generated (since lead is also needed for solder plate). It's of course possible to switch between normal and advanced lead processing, but it feels more robust to use advanced lead processing for all lead and dispose of the excess sulphur compounds by barrelling. Venting would actually be even more convenient.

[bobingabout]

Sulfur is used for more things than that though, for example, doesn't Zinc processing need Sulfuric Acid, and Explosives need Sulfur?

[Kayser]

Sulfur is used for more things than that though, for example, doesn't Zinc processing need Sulfuric Acid, and Explosives need Sulfur?

Yes, the demand can be higher than supply. Personally I've never experienced it more than temporarily, though. It might be so, however, if you use a lot of special ammo.

[MainTango]

Sulfur is used for more things than that though, for example, doesn't Zinc processing need Sulfuric Acid, and Explosives need Sulfur?

Well, I'm a slow player and haven't progressed past science pack 3 yet. I'm at a stage of the game where I'm drowning in intermediates and side products and have to box and tank them away. Nickel ore is another one of these candidates. However, so far I've simply refused to start destroying my excess stuff.
Kayser has a point there with venting sulfur dioxide being problematic due to it being toxic and heavy. Then again you are able to vent chlorine.
I do indeed get my lead plates partially from Advanced Lead Processing with which I've entered the vicious circle of my battery production supplying itself with the needed sulfuric acid. Furthermore, I'm looking at a mountain of nickel ore which needs to be processed and will in turn generate even more sulfuric acid.

I'm gonna continue further down the line to get a glimpse of the bigger picture and hopefully I'll be back with a more educated opinion on the matter.
Bob, you're a nasty one. Because your mods are so badass, you've ruined vanilla for me

[Airat9000]

Sulfur is used for more things than that though, for example, doesn't Zinc processing need Sulfuric Acid, and Explosives need Sulfur?

please more furnages thanks!

[Photoloss]

Sulfur is used for more things than that though, for example, doesn't Zinc processing need Sulfuric Acid, and Explosives need Sulfur?

How much zinc and explosive weaponry do you actually use though? Right now lead and nickel are much higher in demand, and mass use of resin will also leave an excess of petroleum to turn into sulfur. Sadly the main renewable sink for the stuff, fertiliser and pesticide production, isn't implemented in the game.

I really like the "advanced processing" concepts though, perhaps you could implement one which translates large amounts of sulfuric acid into a small return of additional metal? How about a "slag processing" chain:
Chemical plant: ore+sulfuric acid(lots!)=ore slurry
Chemical furnace/plant(/electrolyser): ore slurry+catalyst(coal?)=metal(with bonus)+slag
(chemical) furnace: slag=stone
This would give additional stone for plastering large areas, and if implemented for iron ore would consume plenty of sulfuric acid while being entirely optional.
"gold washing" has already been suggested, and could also use some acidic assistance. Or, if you ever need an additional tier of materials, you could use such "advanced processing" methods as the only source of e.g. platinum or semiconductor materials beyond silicon. New uses for the existing alloys would also be nice, bronze doesn't seem to serve much of a purpose right now.

Actually, I just stumbled upon a potential solution for two overflow chemicals at once: sulfuric acid could be combined with sodium hydroxide, producing sodium sulfate and water. Sodium sulfate is a cheap material to construct thermal reservoirs from, which could be used in high-tier furnace recipes instead of gear wheels, upgraded oil refineries or the true sink: alternative energy storage. Since you can keep hot water in regular tanks it would merely be an alternative accumulator recipe for now as I doubt an entire "heat management/reclamation" system could be modded in easily. The initial acid neutralisation is an exothermic process, which would warrant the introduction of a mixer/vat or (very weak) chemo-thermal generator to contain the excess energy, always nice to have an excuse for non-assembler machines.

[Airat9000]

idea 2 add new pump !

[kingoftheinternet]

This is a perpetual motion machine of the first kind; this minimally-efficient proof of concept generates about 1.8MW excess in fuel, compared to the ~600kW electricity that solar panels would generate with the same amount of space. Also, it breaks physics even moreso than lugging around 50 cars in your pocket or whatever.

I see people have already brought this up, but, still.

[bobingabout]

This is a perpetual motion machine of the first kind; this minimally-efficient proof of concept generates about 1.8MW excess in fuel, compared to the ~600kW electricity that solar panels would generate with the same amount of space. Also, it breaks physics even moreso than lugging around 50 cars in your pocket or whatever.

I see people have already brought this up, but, still.

Indeed it does seem unrealistic, the problem is the hydrogen to fuel block stage.

Basically, the only real options here are to remove the hydrogen to fuel block conversion, or make it really expensive to the point it might as well not exist.

[flatmush]

If you add CO2 as a gas, then hydrogen->methane->crude oil would be nicer (and more realistic ) path, if made expensive enough.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fischer%E ... ch_process

Or could just assume CO2 is abundant and make the process really expensive, and produce a small amount of crude oil.

[kingoftheinternet]

This is a perpetual motion machine of the first kind; this minimally-efficient proof of concept generates about 1.8MW excess in fuel, compared to the ~600kW electricity that solar panels would generate with the same amount of space. Also, it breaks physics even moreso than lugging around 50 cars in your pocket or whatever.

I see people have already brought this up, but, still.

Indeed it does seem unrealistic, the problem is the hydrogen to fuel block stage.

Basically, the only real options here are to remove the hydrogen to fuel block conversion, or make it really expensive to the point it might as well not exist.

I set the reaction to use 500 hydrogen and I actually still think it's still basically worthwhile, unless your pipe system is already a mess and you just can't fit it in; a single plant running off four electrolyzers makes a large enough trickle of solid fuel that I bothered connecting to my main fuel conveyor, at least. I think it could still be power-producing at 500 hydrogen each if you put a little effort into designing a "water plant" with your high-level boilers and steam engines, but it's not efficient to the point where you'd clearly be mad to even bother with any other power source.

[GreatAlucard]

I have a lot of excess gasses from making a similar factory to the one on the first post, although i don't have all that is needed to make it run completely, making it so that some gasses are unneeded and so they block other gasses from being produced, is there a way for me to vent a gas only when the pipe and storage is full? (I tried just placing a vent but then it hops around between one or the other being too full to produce anything (Chloride on this specific case)).

[MainTango]

I have a lot of excess gasses from making a similar factory to the one on the first post, although i don't have all that is needed to make it run completely, making it so that some gasses are unneeded and so they block other gasses from being produced, is there a way for me to vent a gas only when the pipe and storage is full? (I tried just placing a vent but then it hops around between one or the other being too full to produce anything (Chloride on this specific case)).

I usually vent out my excess oxygen, hydrogen and nitrogen. For that, I strap a small pump in between the storage tank and the gas vent. Then I wire up the tank to the pump and set the pump to only forward gas to the vent once the amount of gas in the tank exceeds a certain threshold.

[bobingabout]

Have it fill a tank, from the output of the tank, connect a small pump, use a wire (red/green) to connect the small pump to the tank. Set a condition so it only comes on when the tank is above a certain value. Feed that small pump into a void pump/gas vent.

there you have it, when the tank fills up, it gets vented.

I'd do that to all 3 gasses, with some extra pumps and logic with the combinators so the gasses from the factories can't flow if both tanks from their output are full. This requires 2 separate pumps on Hydrogen, one from Electrolysis, and another from Salt Water Electrolysis. Also if you include nitrogen in the chain, you'd need 2 from Oxygen too, one from Electrolysis, the other from compressed air processing.

[GreatAlucard]

I played Factorio before logic was fixed or started working properly last time and just recently picked it up again, I'm clueless as to how logic works but your explanations were pretty clear and I could get it to work for this matter, thanks.

[bobingabout]

I played Factorio before logic was fixed or started working properly last time and just recently picked it up again, I'm clueless as to how logic works but your explanations were pretty clear and I could get it to work for this matter, thanks.

I'm glad you were able to get it to work!

When my interest in the game returns, I will have to go create some more screenshots showing this sort of filtering system.

Fluids convert, Gasses vent (Wasted). And there's a link from the oil chain to the gas chain via petroleum gas to hydrogen cracking too. It becomes one big Fluid/Gas processing plant.

And I've never actually built a fully automated system myself yet either, I just know how to do it.

[wormzjl]

Is that normal that you get more power from hydrogen produced by water electrolysis than the power consumed by this process?...

[Necris]

Hi, i dont know if this a bug or a feature, but when the researching of the synthetic wood is completed, the recipe of the basic circuit board gets updated. After this it is not possible to craft it by hand, with only raw wood in the inventory. But i can craft wooden boards by hand and then it is possible to craft the basic circuit board out of it. Is it possible to fix that?