[MOD 0.15.2+]Useful Space Industry[0.2.8]

[jorgenRe]

That's an awesome design for the receiver.

I found some stuff done by JAXA about space based power. The article says that for laser-based power transmission (hundreds of THz) the receiver needs to be "several hundred meters long" per GW of power, not sure if that is sent or received 1 GW nor what the shape of a "long receiver" might be. While for a microwaved-based transmission (at 5.8 GHz) the receiver would need to have a radius of 3 km per 1 GW of power, due to the size this is basically a large level area. 5.8 GHz was specifically chosen to meet regulation. Lower frequencies result in a longer wavelength (i.e. larger receiver). The article states "Frequencies in the range of 1 to 10 gigahertz offer the best compromise between antenna size and atmospheric attenuation." So you could pick a higher frequency than 5.8 GHz to find a scientifically accurate and more reasonably sized receiver.

Thanks for finding that article !
It certainly was interesting article to read.
Now a receiver that is 3 km wide for 1 GW of energy That equals to 7 squaremeter per MW, but the atmossphere in Factorio is different so maybe we could increase the power production with 20 %. Therefore when one steam engine is 6 squaremeters. Then we could same spot we could fit 1 MW of energy production. And then sadly it would be taking up way too much space to be something one would want to use :/!
I guess that is something to know.
Now then there is of course the fact that why should we follow the regulations so maybe just maybe we could increase the amplitude of the wave, and with all the advanced tech we got manage to create a dipol antenna that is able to be a whole lot bigger or something.

Yes the picture i sent was for a different kind of antenna. I found out earlier that to turn microwaves to energy it would need to be used a whole load of dipole antennaes(as they also statet in the article). So il think about the design !

[safan]

there should be some negative to a endless power source anyways.

isn't a 7x7 model 49 square meters anyways?

[jorgenRe]

there should be some negative to a endless power source anyways.

isn't a 7x7 model 49 square meters anyways?

If each tile is 1 x 1 m big. Then yes
THough by 7 x 7 i meant 7 x 7 tiles, though i guess you already understood so !

[safan]

yes, every tile is 1m square.

see also the calculations in this thread: https://forums.factorio.com/forum/vie ... =10#p73361

[Kanji]

The 7-9 MW per receiver makes this a really excellent modular power source. No more running power lines out to distant mines and outposts.

Edit: Typo

[jorgenRe]

The 7-9 MW per receiver makes this a really excellent modular power source. No more running power lines out to distant mines and outposts.

Edit: Typo

That is actually a pretty good point !

[Peter34]

I read about solar power sattelites, in popular science magazines, some decades ago. What I remember is that the energy recieving antennae aren't solid. Rather' they're long strings of some material, and then under them you have a lot of real estate that you ca use for other things, including farming crops.

So in terms of ground level real estate use, the solar power recievers shouldn't take up a lot of tiles. Ideally you'd have a 20x20 tiles area, or 32x32 tiles, but with the middle empty and so available for other uses, and only a "rim" of 1-3 tiles width along the edges, a bit like this:

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

Each X is an occupied tile, used for holding up those high-above strings, and each O is an unoccipied tile, free for whatever use the player desires.

Factorio's engine might not be at all ready for such structures, though. I remember the ridiculous mounts of problems and bugs caused by the non-square Gun Turrets back in alpha 11.

[jorgenRe]

I read about solar power sattelites, in popular science magazines, some decades ago. What I remember is that the energy recieving antennae aren't solid. Rather' they're long strings of some material, and then under them you have a lot of real estate that you ca use for other things, including farming crops.

So in terms of ground level real estate use, the solar power recievers shouldn't take up a lot of tiles. Ideally you'd have a 20x20 tiles area, or 32x32 tiles, but with the middle empty and so available for other uses, and only a "rim" of 1-3 tiles width along the edges, a bit like this:

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

Each X is an occupied tile, used for holding up those high-above strings, and each O is an unoccipied tile, free for whatever use the player desires.

Factorio's engine might not be at all ready for such structures, though. I remember the ridiculous mounts of problems and bugs caused by the non-square Gun Turrets back in alpha 11.

When you want to convert microwaves to electricity(alternating current) you use so called dipole antennaes. Think about the antenna you used to have on your house instead of a parabol. !

Now the thing is when you go big you have to use ALOT of them, and when microwaves are so much smaller than the radiowaves that was/is used for transmitting tv signal. The dipol antennas must be much smaller. So for the one above it said 1 BILLION of those was in that 7 square kilometer area! Each antenna would then be half the wavelength of the microwave which is 10^-2 m = 1 cm so half a centimeter long is each antenna. Therefore maybe you may be right about the antenna being just a string of some sort of material(maybe carbon nanotubes?)

It should be noted that for the transmitting method that uses UV-C instead will be using a solar panel(because it would be more or less impossible to create such small dipol antennas) to receive the power(i talked with my phisics teacher and he agreed to that as a possible solotion as long as one could generate enough ozone)

[Kanji]

Also umm i will ask about the possibillity of destroying the ozon layer using CFC gas(really useful, but very(!!) bad stuff that we luckily phased out!) and then sending down the energy as UV-C waves !

To take advantage of current game mechanics while maintaining some scientific accuracy have you considered having power generation for a UV-C transmission method with a power transmission efficiencies relative to the amount of pollution in the receiving chunk? That might simplify implementation.

[jorgenRe]

Also umm i will ask about the possibillity of destroying the ozon layer using CFC gas(really useful, but very(!!) bad stuff that we luckily phased out!) and then sending down the energy as UV-C waves !

To take advantage of current game mechanics while maintaining some scientific accuracy have you considered having power generation for a UV-C transmission method with a power transmission efficiencies relative to the amount of pollution in the receiving chunk? That might simplify implementation.

Ehhhmmmm that wouldn't really simplify the implimentation :/
Unless of course you meant that instead of adding CFC gas to the game. The ozone layer would already be destroyed by the pollution that already is. So the more pollution in a chunk, the greater power efficiency.
Il have to take a look at that
Though i would have to do it the CFC way if i wanted to implement that mutating biters thing ^_^!
But i do wonder if it's already the case that the ozone layer is being destroyed by our pollution when considering the fact that the biters ARE evoling already.

[JohnnyBandit]

I think I broke it, I host a local multiplayer and whenever my friend joins in, it starts desync'ing and constantly re-putting up the message "Satellites already orbiting the planet detected: 0"
so it goes
De-sync
Auto-Rejoining
Satellites detected
De-sync
Auto-Rejoin
etc...

[jorgenRe]

I think I broke it, I host a local multiplayer and whenever my friend joins in, it starts desync'ing and constantly re-putting up the message "Satellites already orbiting the planet detected: 0"
so it goes
De-sync
Auto-Rejoining
Satellites detected
De-sync
Auto-Rejoin
etc...

How odd :/
I guess it is most likely caused by my "hacky" way of generating energy. At least RSeding has confirmed that a generator entity will be added for the excact purpose to make life simpler for mods. I will however for the time being see if i cannot replicate what you experienced and then see what i can do, as i am a little curious to why it would cause a desynch seeing as everything should be happening at the same time for each player. :/
Though it is sortoff weird when thinking about the fact that it says 0 detected so it may as well not be due to the power generation.

Did you already have some energy receivers placed down, and is the number of satelites correct?

[JohnnyBandit]

No recievers, just started the map, only a furnace and burner drill had been placed, so since new map, ya that was the correct amount of satellites,
and if it helps mod list:
5dim's Core
5dim's Trains
5dim's Vehicles
Factorio Smarter Circuitry
Cursed Programmable Inserters
Deep Ores
Electric Switch
Force Fields
Logistic Combinators
Personal Roboport Fix
Rail Tanker
RoadWorks
Transformator
Tree Farm Lite
Tree Farm AC
All the Dytech Mods
Smarter Trains
RSO
Useful Space

And ya, the desync's stopped after disabling your mod, i didnt try to see if disabling anything else stopped it thou...

[darksparks]

i also found mp with this mod causes rolling desync

[jorgenRe]

3rd October
Fixed the desynch issues caused by the mod
Also going to be using github now since it makes it a whole lot easier to get the new version over to my school pc for multiplayer testing !

[darksparks]

wtf.. you fixed it too fast.. please take longer to fix issues in the future.. O.o

<3

[jorgenRe]

wtf.. you fixed it too fast.. please take longer to fix issues in the future.. O.o

<3

Wait what :O!
I fixed the bug which was only by adding global. before all findrockets variables. Basically something that is run ONLY once every time the game starts was the cause
Then i went and picked up my mom's bike and then at last i went home where i tryed to figure out a little bit more of how to use github then at last i uploaded the fix. So i wouldn't really call that fast. Hehe !

[jorgenRe]

Just a small update to make it compatible with 0.12.11+ !

[Sensei]

Next, can we use our satellites as death rays? If they're sending down several megawatts in a small area, surely that's enough to set biters on fire, yes?

[jorgenRe]

Next, can we use our satellites as death rays? If they're sending down several megawatts in a small area, surely that's enough to set biters on fire, yes?

Well that is one possibility !