"Kupferdrache" (I don't know his username in this forum) added some words on
https://forums.factorio.com/wiki/inde ... network/de
Because I really hate discussing in a wiki, I move now this into the forum.
I quote him:
Well. There are several problems.It is hard to understand for me why so hard to setup a wiki inital, that the wiki is multi language capable.
Of course you are right. When this pages are created here sub-pages and suitable linking are better. Never the less, all templates which contain readable text will be required double.
If we do so, we have to ask ourself: Why is a link to german wiki on main page?
even categories have to created double and linked properly, that could lead to confusion under english speaking users.
any Ideas to solve this (maybe we should beginn by filling the help pages ) --Kupferdrache (talk) 09:27, 23 April 2014 (CEST)
1. The correct way to link to the different languages
The links on the current main-page are the old links, which have been created long before I begun to have fun with the wiki-pages.
My current hobby-sub-project is this page:
https://forums.factorio.com/wiki/inde ... n_page_new
As you see here on the bottom, the language-links are more consistently. In the end I want to automate that language-bar with a template and this is also the way, which is more or less used by mediawiki itself.
And to make the structure clear, how I currently think that the linking between the different languages can work:
Code: Select all
Main page Is the English main page Main page/de The German main page de:Hauptseite A redirect to the Main page/de - if useful! I think in most cases it is not needed to have special language pages.
Code: Select all
Inserter English Inserter/de German Inserter/pl Polish Inserter/ru Russian de:Knickarmroboter Redirect to Inserter/de - this redirects are not always needed, it depends strong on the "feel of the language". ru:изги́б ро́бот Redirects to Inserter/ru (I don't have any glue if this is correctly translated, but it is is just an example)
2. Why is the current structure not already set up for different languages?
The problem is, that this wiki exists since > 1 year and has been developed by - I can't say it differently, but I don't mean it negative! - by amateurs. The translators come from time to time, translate some pages and leave again due to the big work. Then the structure has changed and nothings fits together anymore... And there are many, many other mistakes, which are done...
Also me is an amateur and I learn just the hard way, how it is eventually correct. So, be free to suggest a better way or just make it. I think nobody will cry too loud and for the badest mistakes we all watch that.
Well, I've plenty ideas. But much more important for me are the priorities.
#1 prio to import item/recipe/entity-pages automatically
#2 to get the information structure (that what you see currently on the main-page, the networks, concepts and so on) fixed and so extendable, that new game content fits into it (at least for some versions)
#3 setting up different "views" of the content and more separating from the mods-content
#4 long nothing and then translations
Let's that explain a bit more:
For #1 I'm working since end of last year on some converters for the items/entities/recipes etc. so that they are generated and updated automatically, including the pics and many more information.
You need to know, that the current item- recipe- and so on -pages are generated by Factorio itself. There are options, which enable to print that out as Wiki-content and from there it was uploaded into the wiki. So this is already automateable, but I don't think, that it is useful to have a C++-binary as generator for wiki-pages. This is just stupid.
My problem with that is, that I don't have much time to program that. This has different reasons. Currently I'm at the point where I can walk through the data-structures and begin to generate stuff. But I won't just throw out pages, I want it also structured, self-references, categorized and those things need a lot of time to think about, because I want it so, that it works also, when I have no fun anymore with Factorio and others should make the job... This is to point #2.
To #3 I come back to the new main-page (link from above):
I will throw out the whole "Network" stuff and so on and explain just the items. I think more or less like the current build-screen looks; switch the tabs and have the four main-categories and then you can click for example on an inserter and land on the page for that inserter, but there is also the included content for the general information about inserters and some more informations which are more or less autogenerated.
I don't have much time for that, but it looks good to have some more first version end of month.
Again: my first thought is about automating the wiki-generation, then having then english contents right, in a form which is robust enough to survive - let's say - the next 3 releases (the oil-industry changed so many things, then the that nothings fits any more), then setting up more views onto the content, especially for beginners.
And how can you help?
I would appreciate any help (perhaps I should put my programs on github, even if they are total crap yet...), I have also nothing against "I want to do my thing", every information is better, then no information, so be free to change the pages and so on, they are free to change, it's not my ownership on them!
I just can't tell you, how to do it. It is in the flow. I know it will change a lot.
But what I would apreciate much more is talking about, if this is the right way. Is my current vision really correct? Do you know a better way? Do you have a better idea? Did you have experiences in that? What would you await from the wiki? Is the translation really so important for an alpha-version of a game? Shouldn't there not be much more pictures in it, so that translation is just not so much needed?
Such things. Others are invited to discuss, too.