Friday Facts #142 - Playtesting

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MiiNiPaa
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Re: Friday Facts #142 - Playtesting

Post by MiiNiPaa » Sun Jun 12, 2016 8:09 am

Serge wrote:nah, the crane has to be a liquid loader. Otherwise, why would it have a crane?
Maybe because it is not a crane, but overhead rail signal?

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Re: Friday Facts #142 - Playtesting

Post by Islacrusez » Sun Jun 12, 2016 11:21 am

Since a few people are arguing against, I'll add my voice to for. Extra slots should be tied to actual armour, not to research, not as an unlock. Otherwise it makes no sense. Where does this extra capacity come from? If the armour has extra capacity, not having the armour should remove it.

Personally I think the "locked inventory" system is the better solution than item-drop (just no) or armour-specific-inventory (make some extra armour and you can carry how much?). Someone mentioned that locking the inventory on armour removal is a bad solution, but never said why? Anyone want to elaborate on that?

One potential "exploit" could be that you could put armour on, load up inventory, take armour off, go somewhere and then put armour on to access that inventory. However the scope for exploitation is slim indeed. Only really exploitable if multiple people are sharing the same armour for this purpose, and even then it'd probably be easier to use cars.

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Re: Friday Facts #142 - Playtesting

Post by slindenau » Sun Jun 12, 2016 11:50 am

Islacrusez wrote:Otherwise it makes no sense. Where does this extra capacity come from?
Are you really arguing inventory space logic in a video game where a character can carry thousands of metal plates?? Or a whole showroom of cars in his pocket?

Let's just keep the realism to places where it makes sense, and have bigger inventory spaces just be unlocked by technology.
(i dont see anyone complaining about researching a bigger toolbelt either, so...)
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Re: Friday Facts #142 - Playtesting

Post by Sebb767 » Sun Jun 12, 2016 1:04 pm

Islacrusez wrote:Since a few people are arguing against, I'll add my voice to for.
Since its already implemented and in testing, I guess its too late for voting.
Islacrusez wrote:Personally I think the "locked inventory" system is the better solution than item-drop (just no) or armour-specific-inventory (make some extra armour and you can carry how much?). Someone mentioned that locking the inventory on armour removal is a bad solution, but never said why? Anyone want to elaborate on that?
I guess you simply can't take of your armor if your inventory is too full (like chests, which can't be mined if full) or that the items are stored in the armor and inaccessible until reequipped (unlikely, but possible).

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Re: Friday Facts #142 - Playtesting

Post by MiiNiPaa » Sun Jun 12, 2016 1:34 pm

Sebb767 wrote:Since its already implemented and in testing, I guess its too late for voting.
As long as there are arguments provided in posts, it can give dev team new ideas to test, and it can lead to changes/improvements/scraping/remaking some aspects of the game depending on test results. So this kind of feedback is useful.

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Re: Friday Facts #142 - Playtesting

Post by Islacrusez » Sun Jun 12, 2016 4:16 pm

Sebb767 wrote: I guess you simply can't take of your armor if your inventory is too full (like chests, which can't be mined if full)
This would potentially cause problems if your armour is destroyed. What would happen then?

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Re: Friday Facts #142 - Playtesting

Post by KatherineOfSky » Sun Jun 12, 2016 4:32 pm

Islacrusez wrote:
Sebb767 wrote: I guess you simply can't take of your armor if your inventory is too full (like chests, which can't be mined if full)
This would potentially cause problems if your armour is destroyed. What would happen then?
An excellent reason for ++ storage to be linked to research instead of armor ;-)
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Re: Friday Facts #142 - Playtesting

Post by slindenau » Sun Jun 12, 2016 4:36 pm

Islacrusez wrote:
Sebb767 wrote: I guess you simply can't take of your armor if your inventory is too full (like chests, which can't be mined if full)
This would potentially cause problems if your armour is destroyed. What would happen then?
All inventory would be destroyed, just like chests now.

Ahh the good old days, when the entire contents would spill all around the chest on the ground :D.
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Re: Friday Facts #142 - Playtesting

Post by TheSAguy » Sun Jun 12, 2016 4:36 pm

Whooh!:

Code: Select all

Evolution factor 0.8702 (Time 9%)(Pollution 57%)(Spawner kills 32%)
Was looking for this feature for a long time.

I was wondering though, if a mod does an Evolution deduction, who will this work with this feature?
To use round numbers, let's say the evolution factor is 30% = (Time 10%)(Pollution 10%)(Spawner kills 10%). IF a mod removes 6%. (exaggerated) , so the new evolution factor is 24%. What will the values then be?
Will it be 24% = (Time 8%)(Pollution 8%)(Spawner kills 8%) or 24% = (Time 10%)(Pollution 10%)(Spawner kills 10%)(Other -6%). or do you have to specify from what factor the deduction should happen?

Just wondering.
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Re: Friday Facts #142 - Playtesting

Post by MiiNiPaa » Sun Jun 12, 2016 4:55 pm

TheSAguy wrote:I was wondering though, if a mod does an Evolution deduction, who will this work with this feature?
To use round numbers, let's say the evolution factor is 30% = (Time 10%)(Pollution 10%)(Spawner kills 10%). IF a mod removes 6%. (exaggerated) , so the new evolution factor is 24%. What will the values then be?
Will it be 24% = (Time 8%)(Pollution 8%)(Spawner kills 8%) or 24% = (Time 10%)(Pollution 10%)(Spawner kills 10%)(Other -6%). or do you have to specify from what factor the deduction should happen?
Percentage will always add to (almost) 100%, as those a factor contributing to current evolution factor and calculated dynamically. So at the start of the game you could see something like
Evolution factor 0.0002 (Time 100%)
. I believe, that there will be required tag when manipulating evolution factor, which will determine which category it belongs.

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Re: Friday Facts #142 - Playtesting

Post by alan2here » Sun Jun 12, 2016 5:06 pm

So I will soon be able to check the evolution factor, improve my factory to produce less pollution, wait without attacking or burning anything, before checking the pollution factor again to see that it has decreased?

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Re: Friday Facts #142 - Playtesting

Post by malecord » Sun Jun 12, 2016 5:14 pm

alan2here wrote:So I will soon be able to check the evolution factor, improve my factory to produce less pollution, wait without attacking or burning anything, before checking the pollution factor again to see that it has decreased?
Pollution factor can decrease? I thought it was monotone.

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Re: Friday Facts #142 - Playtesting

Post by KatherineOfSky » Sun Jun 12, 2016 5:19 pm

malecord wrote:
alan2here wrote:So I will soon be able to check the evolution factor, improve my factory to produce less pollution, wait without attacking or burning anything, before checking the pollution factor again to see that it has decreased?
Pollution factor can decrease? I thought it was monotone.
Using less energy (Efficiency modules) and reducing polluting buildings (steam engines, boilers, etc.) will reduce your pollution cloud significantly. It takes time to be absorbed, however; the effect isn't instant.
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Re: Friday Facts #142 - Playtesting

Post by alan2here » Sun Jun 12, 2016 5:21 pm

It'll be interesting to see, I think I'm quite good already but I would love to see whats going on more.

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Re: Friday Facts #142 - Playtesting

Post by MiiNiPaa » Sun Jun 12, 2016 5:24 pm

Pollution itself can decrease, but it impact on evolution factor is irreversible. In fact, even single forge, completely surrounded by trees, so pollution will never escape the chunk will eventually provide enough pollution to inctease evolution factor up to 1.

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Re: Friday Facts #142 - Playtesting

Post by brunzenstein » Sun Jun 12, 2016 5:46 pm

DedlySpyder wrote:Ok, I inserted a rail into the "crane" image, and it fits. So, I definitely think it is a train station.
Tin-Foil Hat Train Station
Could that be a crane moving standard containers onto low level wagons?

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Re: Friday Facts #142 - Playtesting

Post by alan2here » Sun Jun 12, 2016 6:46 pm

Thanks for the info :) It's a shame that the evolution factor never normally decreases. I'd hoped improving the factories pollution output would cause them to attack less, dominating the other factors such as play time for a long time.

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Re: Friday Facts #142 - Playtesting

Post by MiiNiPaa » Sun Jun 12, 2016 7:44 pm

If you limit your factory pollution, so it stops spreading, and destroy nests already influenced by pollution, then no new biters will attack (as long as you prevent base-building. I do not rememeber if non-aggravated bases send builders).

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Re: Friday Facts #142 - Playtesting

Post by jaworeq » Sun Jun 12, 2016 8:26 pm

alan2here wrote:Thanks for the info :) It's a shame that the evolution factor never normally decreases. I'd hoped improving the factories pollution output would cause them to attack less, dominating the other factors such as play time for a long time.
There was a funny bug a while back, when evolution factor could decrease. It would go into negative numbers and crash the game :P

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Re: Friday Facts #142 - Playtesting

Post by Recon777 » Mon Jun 13, 2016 1:09 am

Speaking of faster mining of rails... Can you please do the same for walls? Since the segments are only 1x1, it takes AGES to correct a misaligned or otherwise unwanted wall until you finally get the deconstruction planner.

Also, I was thinking... the deconstruction planner itself is super cheap since it is infinitely reusable. I wonder if it might be better to have it stackable and partially use up just like the repair packs. Maybe have them capable of marking 500 objects for deconstruction before they are used up, and allow 100x planners in a stack. Or something.

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