[1.0][1.1] Building Platform v1.2

[imajor]

A summary of my experiences so far: Start was pretty slow, mostly because I just finished another playthrough, and it was a bit hard to start everything again. This mod doesn't really affect the beginning, and I also decided to use the no hand crafting mod (which was a mistake I think). Anyway I'm almost at the automatic construction now, and things are getting pretty interesting. Overall I love the mod mainly for two reasons:
1. nothing is the same as the previous games, I cannot reuse the same blueprints. Whatever I want to make, I need to consider the available space, and use a new design which is only useful in this particular case. To be honest I like messy spaghetti builds anyways, and now the game encourages me to make those. It is really satisfying when I can squeeze one more working assembly machine into an area which I previously thought is full.
2. I'm playing with building platform frequency set to very rare and size set to big. So the patches now are far enough from each other to use trains to transport stuff around. I was partially disappointed in vanilla when I realized that I only use trains for raw resources, and I only transfer them to my main base, there is no real train network. This is now over. The train network starts looking like in transport tycoon back in the good old days.

So great job, thanks a lot!

One suggestion: even with frequency set to very rare, I think the platforms are too close to each other. If I wasn't a train lover, I could just use conveyor belts to transfer items between the platforms. I would me more happy if the distance between the platforms would be so big, that my only option would be trains.

[Neemys]

Thanks for the feedback.

1) Yes you cannot use complete blueprint of build but you can use part of them. My build begun to be spaguetti until I research circuit network (I do that rather late to be honest). But in 0.13 I can make a single belt give 4 or more ressource to multiple assembling machine (and this don't use combinator, just wire). That a space saver and a way to make more clean build, only downside is the belt need to be a loop to work so you either squeeze the return line using underground belt, or place the return line outside the platform. I will post this build here when I update screenshot for the first post. Someone already post a similar build on the forum not a long time ago.

2) Honestly, I'm not satified with the building platform generation for all settings (even default one). I spend hours to try tweaking the generation without successfully finding one correct. I may need to write an entire custom generation process (like RSO did) instead of trying to use default autoplace. But doing so will take some time so it's not for today. I haven't test but maybe as a temporary fix I can make my generation work with RSO if it is enabled to place platform further apart. I will try it when the next release is done (I'm waiting for factorio 0.13.18 as a bug regarding hidden tile should be fix in this version #31092).
Another problem with platform further apart is bitter, in 0.13 they are much more base than 0.12 with default settings. When you try to go outside starting area you will be figthing to get platform, sometimes big bitter base. Fighting those early on will make the evolution factor skyrocket.

[imajor]

Yea, I forgot to tell, that I ended up using a cheat command turning on peace mode. I'm not a fan of fight in this game, usually trying to avoid it if possible. And this time the start of the playthrough was already slow, so I didn't want to spend time with the bitters, I wanted to experience the building platform gameplay.

[Neemys]

Yeah fighting bitter is not hard, just bothersome, so I understand why people deactivate it. Though I might need to lower the increase in evolution factor done by killing nest to avoid it rapid increase when expanding (for people not playing peacefull).

[Neemys]

Some news here, I'm unable to upload nor test my mod for the next couple days.

The actual download version "should" work in 0.13.18 and 0.14.1 (I've read the changelog, nothing I use changed). I can't test it for sure but if you want to play in 0.14, you need to edit the file "info.json" in the mod and edit the line "factorio_version" from 0.13 to 0.14.

I will upload the new version for 0.13 and 0.14 as soon as I can next week.

[Neemys]

Finally I'm able to upload new versions :

Version 0.1.2 for factorio 0.13.18+ (older version still available for those who don't/can't upgrade factorio)

• You can now build over any tile that are over building platform, don't need to remove them anymore.
• Added internal capability to unrestrict buildings per pattern in case some other mod need it to unrestrict some building.
• New building, the oil barreling machine, placeable anywhere on map, 2x2, can only fill and empty oil from barrel. Crafting speed of 1, unlocked with automation 2 (if a mod remove or rename this tech, it is unlocked from the beginning, if you want me to add compatibility with a mod's tech tree, just ask). The recipe to craft it is more expensive : 10 iron plate, 5 electronics circuit, 5 iron gear and 1 assembling machine 2. The actual graphics is a glitchy placeholder, don't look at it too closely. This building is activated by default, you can deactivate it in the config file.
• New barreling capability. Normal assembling machine can now fill and empty barrel with water and lubricant. If you only need lubricant somewhere or if your steam engine have no lake around that's the solution. Beware feeding steam engine require lot's of barrel. The recipe for lubricant barrel is the same as oil barrel. But I change speed and capacity of barrel for water. In theory, you *could* feed 10 steam engine with only 1 assembly 3 working 100% (it give you 60 water/second) but only in theory, it don't work in my save (fluid mystery or my math is wrong). Expect some tweaking for water barrel in next release.(you can feed 10 steam engine with one assembly 3 on certain condition see this post). I recommend that you power water barreling with solar or accumulator, if your steam engine can't keep up with the power demand, the power plant will auto-shutdown VERY quickly. Those new recipe are active by default and unlocked with fluid handling (again, if the tech doesn't exist it is unlocked from the start, if you need to add specific tech unlocking for a mod, just ask).
• When upgrading from previous version of the mod, new building and recipe should be added automatically if you have already unlock the tech.
• Config change :
  • Logistic chest and roboport are now unrestricted by default, if you want to keep them restricted, change the "unrestrictLogistic" to false.
  • You can now unrestrict storage tank if you want, juste change "unrestrictStorageTank" to true (still restricted by default).
  • You can toggle new barrel recipe on or off with "moreBarrelRecipe" (on by default).
  • You can toggle new barrelling machine on or off with "oilBarrelingBuilding" (on by default).

Version 0.2.0 for factorio 0.14 : Made necessary change for 0.14 compatibility.

Apply one of this new version on an existing save should not break anything. Due to config change older config file are not compatible, take the new one and edit it again.


What to expect in next release ?

• - Water barrel tweaking ?
  - Solar panel change to make viable.
  - Upload on mod portal !
  - Mod description change to reflect that it include vanilla tweaking to make playing less problematic in vanilla savegame.
  - Screenshots uploads

Both 0.1.2 and 0.2.0 will receive update. At least in this thread, I doubt the mod portal let me upload version for the two version at the same time.

[Neemys]

After further test, steam engines can be fed with only 1 assembly 3, the only thing that need to be done is :

- Let the pipe fill with water BEFORE plug-in the engines onto main network.
- NEVER let the assembly machines run out of water too long, if the pipe began to be empty, the water will not flow quickly enough for the steam engines to work at 100%.

I don't know enough of fluid mechanics to explain why steam engine are able to work fully only if the pipe are more full as we make the exact same quantity of water in the two case. It might be a bug because we are able to generate two different quantity of power using the same amount of water (and maybe coal) (the difference is 200kW on average between pipe almost empty and pipe full per group of 10 steam engines)



While waiting for next release here one of the setup I might add to first post's screenshots :

Science setup with 37 labs on this little platform.

science.jpg (340.1 KiB) Viewed 8011 times

That's the science lab setup I use since I redo it when I hit blue science (and leaving for good the starting area). It use a bit of circuit network, but a simple one with no combinator. Here I need blue science, when it will come, even if the belt have all three other bottle, the blue one will enter the belt that goes near all lab. As I use only one belt for bottle, I can squeeze more lab as I only need two tile between labs. But there no space for pole so I need substation around, I manage to sacrifice only one lab space for a substation (the top one) and this lab space wasn't usable because no inserter could reach the belt. A second lab space is sacrificed for purple bottle making. Sadly I wasn't able to squeeze it with the other bottle making.

[Neemys]

Mods finally out in mods portal ! It has been split into two mods, see detail below :

Changelog for Building Platform Mod :

06-10-2016 - 1.0.0 (for 0.14) : 0.14 version of Building Platform 0.9.0. For Factorio 0.14.0+.

06-10-2016 - 0.9.0 (for 0.13) :

• Splitting the mod in two part, this mod will only hold the platform mechanics and building restriction. A new mod available in the same topic, named Building Platform Tweak will take care of modifying vanilla gameplay to add QoL improvement for Building Platform. The tweaks mod is optional. The rest of this changelog from this version and later only list Building Platform changes. For Building Platform Tweaks changes, it have his own changelog.
• Building platform's tile, item and recipe should now properly exist even if the modded game don't have concrete. It still take concrete data if it exist.
• Added base game dependency in info.json so it is not loaded on unsupported factorio version. The mod only support 0.13.18 and later version since 0.1.2.
• Rework of how the mod represent restriction rules. If you made a mod that edit/use them, you need to update your mod.
• Add public function to add custom rules, callable in data-updates phase by other mod to override the default ones. More information in the "Mods compatibility" section of this post. Those functions should be used only for non released mod compatibility or for big mod/modpack custom rules. If you want to make your mod compatible with Building Platform you better contact me so I edit default rules to take into account your mod by default.
• To make an existing savegame not breaking from the update, add the tweaks mod if you used Water/Lubricant Barrel or the oil barreling machine to properly migrate. If you do not add the mod, those buildings/items will disappear. Building platform mechanics
• Config change :
  • Added unrestrictBoiler config to make boiler placeable outside platform when other power related building are still restricted. Default to false (restricted by platform)
  • Added unrestrictRoboport config to make roboport placeable outside platform. Default to true (not restricted by platform).
  • Edited unrestrictLogistic config to only (un)restrict logistics chest. Default to true (not restricted by platform).
  • Added unrestrictSubstation to make substation placeable outside platform. Default to false (restricted by platform).
  • Added unrestrictFurnace to make furnaces placeable outside platform. Default to false (restricted by platform).
  • Added unrestrictAssemblingMachine to make assembling machines placeable outside platform. Default to false (restricted by platform).
  • Added unrestrictLab to make Labs placeable outside platform. Default to false (restricted by platform).
  • Added unrestrictBeacon to make beacon placeable outside platform. Default to false (restricted by platform).
  • Added unrestrictRocketSilo to make Rocket Silo placeable outside platform. Default to false (restricted by platform).

Changelog for Building Platform Tweaks Mod :

06-10-2016 - 1.0.0 (for 0.14) : 0.14 version of Building Platform Tweaks 0.9.0. For Factorio 0.14.0+.

06-10-2016 - 0.9.0 (for 0.13) :

• Split from Building platform main mod 0.1.2, take the Lubricant and Water barrel and the oil barreling machine.
• New long range scanning radar. A new radar that does not reveal nearby area, but scan chunk twice further than vanilla radar. It consume 1MW and should scan a chunk every 15 seconds. Vanilla radar is untouched. Should be used to detect new platform. It's only placeable on platform unless you edit the Building Platform config file to not restrict radars.

What's next ?

- I will try different popular mod and check that everything is block correctly.
- Building platform graphics redone.
- Bugfixes if needed.
- Implementation of suggestion and ideas if good one are posted.


There is no change to solar panel as after some test, their "build and forget" state and the energy they make is enough balanced for now.



Edit : There is no localization entry for the long range radar, it is fixed for next release soon.

[Neemys]

Quick fix for the missing localisation, I added in the same time my first compatibility fix for some mod :

Building platform update :

07-10-2016 - 1.0.1 (for 0.14); 0.9.1 (for 0.13) :

• Alert Combinator from the Alert combinator mod are now properly blocked.
• High tier Labs from Science Cost Tweaker Mod are now properly blocked.

Building platform tweaks update :

07-10-2016 - 1.0.1 (for 0.14); 0.9.1 (for 0.13) : Added missing english localisation for Long range radar entity, recipe and item.

[sol]

I do love this type of mod, but I must say: Unstable Ground was much better with it's generation and textures of the actual solid ground. With this mod, even with world gen set to extra large for the platforms, the solid ground is far too small and broken up for any real building. I can't even fit most of the bigger buildings on a single platform. While I am aware that you can craft more ground as you need, I feel it defeats the idea of the mod even if the platforms are expensive. Unstable Ground's generate of the solid ground always had usable chucks, and even on the lower setting they were large enough to work with for a challenge.

I do encourage you to check out that mod's world generation code and effects. I would absolutely love this mod for continuing this cool idea if the world gen was scaled better.

[Neemys]

This mod came from unstable ground, but as world generation was redone in 0.13 they broke how unstable ground done it (if you take unstable ground, do the change for 0.13 compatibility, it's all platform everywhere). I intend to improve the generation, maybe being able to completly control it as rso does with ressources.

What do you mean by "I can't even fit most of the bigger buildings on a single platform" ? Before putting this mod on mod portal I do a playthrough with my mod, and I was able to make a base on medium (default) size. Do you have a mod that change how ressources spawn that can change how platform spawn (it use ressource generation to place platform), if it is a mod that change it, I may be able to make the necessary change to be compatible with it.

Yeah crafting of platform defeat the idea of the mod, that's why it is deactivated by default, only there because I believe not everyone play the same way so I provide mean to customize how they want things.

Thanks for the feedback

Edit : As a temporary solution before I am able to redo generation completly, I could add a config off by default, that when on, platform will be bigger overall.

[sol]

Thanks for responding so quickly! I see, I knew there were world gen changes but I didn't know it was that bad. I do had RSO as of now, so I can try turning that off and see what it does, but I think the config file would be a great temp solution.

I guess when I'm referring to the size, I'm make the comparison to Unstable ground where the solid ground was not only bigger but it was usually a circle of sorts. this mod tends to generate solid ground in a snaky formation making it difficult to devote a single platform to multiple bigger buildings. especially any thing huge (though I haven't tested the huge buildings yet). though, like you said, this is probably due to recent changes in generation for the game and maybe RSO.

[sol]

Oh and sorry for not reading the whole forum! I see you already address this earlier.... but at least you know there is more desire for this to improve...

[Neemys]

I do some test, RSO does not change how building platform spawn.

I was able to get huge platform and I haven't add the new option to get bigger platform see this screenshot :

big.jpg (495.67 KiB) Viewed 7711 times

It's not the bigger one that spawn on map, just an average one (see the minimap there is bigger next to this one)

But like vanilla ore, you need to set frequency to low or very low to have big platform (that's how the game works, size is function of size AND frequency, high frequency reduce size). You maybe don't reduce frequency.

For the screenshot I set frequency to very low and size to very high.

I doubt that adding a config to have platform bigger than those one is usefull.


To talk about unstable ground generation, I loved how the ground was shaped but see how unstable ground generation ended in 0.13, in the following screenshot I only copy pasted unstable ground generation without the portion to protect water (this portion bug in 0.13 and all map is covered in platform when it is present). World generation option set to default (medium).

unstablegroundgeneration.jpg (153.97 KiB) Viewed 7711 times

But yes I do know that current generation is not ideal and I do intent to modify it.

[Usernm]

I can build anyting on floor from mods:
https://mods.factorio.com/mods/Tone/More_Floors
https://mods.factorio.com/mods/Versepel ... unkMarkers

I think any modded floors affected.

By the way - vanilla stone brics floor can be used too. And I can remove other mods, but i can't fix vanilla behavior.

[Neemys]

It's a custom script that check for placability on tile (modded or vanilla), there maybe a problem, I check later when I got back.

[Neemys]

Bugfix release :

16-10-2016 - 1.0.2 (for 0.14); 0.9.2 (for 0.13) :

• All restricted buildings should now be properly blocked on modded and vanilla tile if there is no platform under those tile. Thanks to Usernm for reporting it.
• Fix checking area for placing building was offset by one on negative position (was a temporary fix for a bug that was fixed some time ago).

Should work on existing save without problem. Now I have a bug report to fill.......

[sol]

Holy Moses that's ridiculous hahaha I really see what you mean about the old generation for Unstable Ground. Yeah, I'm not sure what I'm doing differently, but I was not able to get the platforms to be that big with or without RSO. in my tinkering I did notice the frequency-to-size ratio thing though. but even with freq set to very low they were genning smallish even on extrabig. is there something else that I could be doing (or not doing) to make them smaller? I certainly cannot get the mod to make any platforms that huge.

in both the example pics I'm posting I've set platforms to gen very low freq with extra big size

the first example, there is only one mildly big one off to the top left, but the rest are too small by far. and on the second one, the platform is a decent size but it's literally the only one in the starting area with nothing else to work with.

[sol]

Also, I get this error when I enable the recipe to craft platforms.

[imajor]

I also had problems with the platform generation. I was satisfied with the shape and size of the platforms. If they were too big or too circular then the mod would be pointless I think, I could just use the same blueprints as in vanilla. And the main reason why I like this mod is because it prevents me from reusing the same blueprints in every game, because that way each playthrough would be pretty much the same

But for frequency, I couldn't get what I wanted. My expectation was that the patches would be so far from each other that I need to use trains to transport stuff between them. But even with frequency set to very low they were too close, it was possible to just lay down conveyor belts.

But other than that I really like this mod. It makes the replayability of this game much better.