Version 2.1.7

[GregoriusT]

Also, a wall ship at 40km/s against a medium asteroid used to remove half the HP of walls. Now, 4 walls are destroyed on impact, and some are damaged.

Four walls horizontally, right? As in 1 Wall deep 4 Walls wide, on impact, right?

Just asking if Walls are at least useful to precent ONE impact of a medium Asteroid.

Wondering how well Quality Walls would do.

[thedoh]

Also, a wall ship at 40km/s against a medium asteroid used to remove half the HP of walls. Now, 4 walls are destroyed on impact, and some are damaged.

Four walls horizontally, right? As in 1 Wall deep 4 Walls wide, on impact, right?

Just asking if Walls are at least useful to precent ONE impact of a medium Asteroid.

Wondering how well Quality Walls would do.

Not much better.

[stoicfaux]

Wait wait wait...

Fixed that turret shooting speed didn't work at higher speeds depending on the turret animations.

Does that mean the railgun animation limitation is gone?

Yes, and boy howdy you have to be careful with what you shoot at now, because if you're not careful, you'll blow your railgun ammo production AND you power budgets!!

Yeah, the power draw has jumped dramatically, if not excessively. From 10.94MW @ 0.84 shots/s to 77.5MW @ 1.09 shots/s. That's a 7x jump in power draw for a 30% increase in rate of fire.

If it's not a bug or a side effect (e.g. arbitrarily hard coded value) of the old cap on railgun firing speed, then I'm curious as to what the formula for power use is.

[Filcius]

Also, a wall ship at 40km/s against a medium asteroid used to remove half the HP of walls. Now, 4 walls are destroyed on impact, and some are damaged.

Four walls horizontally, right? As in 1 Wall deep 4 Walls wide, on impact, right?

Just asking if Walls are at least useful to precent ONE impact of a medium Asteroid.

Wondering how well Quality Walls would do.

An asteroid coming from the front will destroy 4 walls wide.

[vybornak]

• Increased asteroid crushing asteroid chunk yield from 20% to 30%.
• Increased advanced asteroid crushing asteroid chunk yield from 5% to 10%.
• Fixed asteroid chunks were not marked as lossy catalyst.

I think you mean "Fixed asteroid chunks were now marked as lossy catalyst."

I loaded my 2.0 save and checked. Asteroid chunks in the processing recipes are no longer affected by productivity, completely killing space casino. That was unexpected and doesn't align with the FFF wording!

It's also a huge nerf to *all* space-based production. Most 2.0 spaceships blueprints would stop being self-sufficient due to the max 4x reduction of *all raw materials*, mostly ice.

I suggest an immediate reversion.

I Actually never liked space casino as it feels like a workaround. I am glad that they decided to make this change.

[traycer]

If you're just wanting to update in place, open the game and hit the update button.

On a headless server?

[traycer]

I deleted the data folder and re-extracted the zip over and it sorta worked.

I'm glad I found this thread, as I was having the exact same problem updating my headless instance. It simply untars over top of the existing installation, and that has always worked in the past. Why would an unreferenced file cause problems, though? I assume the bootstrap process iterates through all the Lua scripts in a folder and executes them.

Removing the data/ folder should work nicely, as it is the only subfolder created during the extraction that contains more than one file, and there are a number of other files that no longer exist moving from 2.0 to 2.1.

[CheeseMcBurger]

How do I change the lane that the inserters drop the items?

[GregoriusT]

How do I change the lane that the inserters drop the items?

Using the flip keybinds while holding cursor over the inserter

Do note that the Belt does need to be pointing towards or away from the inserter for this to work.

[darekols]

Please make an Factorio 3D just to kill off Satisfactory, which claimed to be your rival, but didn't delivered.

[sarge945]

Please make an Factorio 3D just to kill off Satisfactory, which claimed to be your rival, but didn't delivered.

Factorio could learn a lot from Satisfactory, even if I think Factorio is the better game.

I feel like the different pipe tiers and fluid dynamics of Satisfactory add a lot to the game that isn't present in Factorio.

My main gripe with satisfactory is the lack of needing to deal with any sort of byproducts (just void everything lol) and the lack of an overall game goal.

[MrGrim]

The already beastly combat shotgun gets even more beastly buffs! Nice!



All that other stuff is cool too...

[Alex(ander)]

I have played Factorio for over 1000 hours, and this is my very first post commenting new release. I have never felt the need to speak up or complain about an update before, but this is the first change that makes me genuinely sad because it is destroying fun in this game.

I love hard games. I love challenges that Factorio gradually put in front of us as we progress. Quality is a late-game mechanics that is hard to begin with and require a lot of smart engineering. On that note, removing asteroid reprocessing (the "space casino") doesn't make this challenge harder. It just makes it more tedious and relies on stupid, copy-paste blueprints with different versions of casinos.

Here is why this change feels completely backwards:

• The wrong thing was removed: The LDS shuffle is the actual broken exploit that prints infinite legendary copper. Asteroid refining wasn't an exploit; it was a really fun puzzle that gave us a reason to engineer cool factories in space.

• Waste goes against the whole game: Factorio is all about efficiency. The "intended" Quality system forces us to throw away perfectly good items just to roll the dice again. It feels terrible. Replacing a unique space factory with mindless upcycling loops (like trashing iron chests over and over) is just boring.

• Resources are infinite anyway: Saying asteroid recycling is "overpowered" because it gives infinite resources doesn't make sense. Between planets like Vulcanis and endless mining productivity research, we already have infinite resources.

• Just nerf it, don't delete it: If getting materials from asteroids was too strong, why not just lower the 80% return rate? There was no need to completely delete one of the most interesting mechanics in the expansion.

Right now, Quality just feels like a tedious chore for massive post-game bases instead of a rewarding system to help you actually beat the game. "Space refineries" were a great, satisfying way to engage with Quality, and it is a huge shame to see them go just to force more wasteful recycling.

Please reconsider this choice. From what I read on the forum, steam and reddit makes me believe that many people feel the same. People won't play when this update will be released as stable. Of course there is a possibility to use a mod or revert the version on stream to 2.0 but it just feels wrong that creators are "punishing" the players for finding creative solutions and now players must modify the game to keep their factories working.

[GregoriusT]

The wrong thing was removed: The LDS shuffle is the actual broken exploit that prints infinite legendary copper. Asteroid refining wasn't an exploit; it was a really fun puzzle that gave us a reason to engineer cool factories in space.[/list]

LDS Shuffle is for Legendary Steel not really for Copper, Copper is just a Side Effect. Why? Because the other upcycling processes overproduce Copper by a large margin, meaning if you used them you would still drown in Legendary Copper to the point of needing to delete it. (also it needs high LDS productivity research, which space casinos never did)

[Hurkyl]

The wrong thing was removed: The LDS shuffle is the actual broken exploit that prints infinite legendary copper. Asteroid refining wasn't an exploit; it was a really fun puzzle that gave us a reason to engineer cool factories in space.[/list]

LDS Shuffle is for Legendary Steel not really for Copper, Copper is just a Side Effect. Why? Because the other upcycling processes overproduce Copper by a large margin, meaning if you used them you would still drown in Legendary Copper to the point of needing to delete it. (also it needs high LDS productivity research, which space casinos never did)

Printing legendary copper/steel requires high LDS productivity research.

Drowning in copper/steel? Not so much.

In my playthrough when I was working through the options for plastic upcycling, even with low productivity research I wound up stopping the LDS process because I was getting to much other product.

I'm glad I don't play maps long enough to get high productivity research; I'm pretty sure I would have lost all interest in the quality system if I had a near-lossless method available to me.

[meganothing]

• Waste goes against the whole game: Factorio is all about efficiency. The "intended" Quality system forces us to throw away perfectly good items just to roll the dice again. It feels terrible. Replacing a unique space factory with mindless upcycling loops (like trashing iron chests over and over) is just boring.

So you say Space Age should not have embraced new concepts but just delivered some more of the same? Similar to the Fifa series for example. Very safe for change-averse players who want to pay for reskins every year.
I assume lots of players wanted to see really new stuff, concepts and problems, including me.

If we go your route, we could also add:
"Multiple planets goes against the whole game: Factorio is all about expansion of a single planet"
and
"Biological growth goes against the whole game: Factorio is all about engineering and a factory"

It is very easy to fall into the trap to define for yourself what Factorio is about, essentially all the stuff you like, and not about, essentially all stuff you don't like.

Some players used a similar argument to declare Gleba as not conforming to the spirit of Factorio because of spoilage. If waste was removed from Space Age there would be no Gleba, no Fulgora, and space platforms and Vulkanus as well, or they would need a redesign to remove the need for space and lava drops. Is that the Space Age expansion you want?

[GregoriusT]

If we go your route, we could also add:
"Multiple planets goes against the whole game: Factorio is all about expansion of a single planet"

I love space age 2.1 the way it is right now and would not change it. (All personal gripes are part of the base game)

But there is one thing about this point you brought up in particular that I have to agree on. The new Planets made Nauvis Outposts almost completely useless, and I loved outpost building in the base game.

Add to that the ridiculous amount of Mining Productivity you can get from Biolabs and Big/Quality Drills, and you will basically not run out of Ore for months and years, without going outside of the "Map Preview" Area you saw when starting your World.

The Logistics of having a long Train line, leading to a part of the Map you may need to supply with things on a regular basis to defend against Biters, giving you the opportunity to have a train with dozens of wagons going back to the original Base, was awesome and I miss that.

[mmmPI]

I have played Factorio for over 1000 hours, and this is my very first post commenting new release. I have never felt the need to speak up or complain about an update before, but this is the first change that makes me genuinely sad because it is destroying fun in this game.

I love hard games. I love challenges that Factorio gradually put in front of us as we progress. Quality is a late-game mechanics that is hard to begin with and require a lot of smart engineering. On that note, removing asteroid reprocessing (the "space casino") doesn't make this challenge harder. It just makes it more tedious and relies on stupid, copy-paste blueprints with different versions of casinos.

Here is why this change feels completely backwards:

• The wrong thing was removed: The LDS shuffle is the actual broken exploit that prints infinite legendary copper. Asteroid refining wasn't an exploit; it was a really fun puzzle that gave us a reason to engineer cool factories in space.

• Waste goes against the whole game: Factorio is all about efficiency. The "intended" Quality system forces us to throw away perfectly good items just to roll the dice again. It feels terrible. Replacing a unique space factory with mindless upcycling loops (like trashing iron chests over and over) is just boring.

• Resources are infinite anyway: Saying asteroid recycling is "overpowered" because it gives infinite resources doesn't make sense. Between planets like Vulcanis and endless mining productivity research, we already have infinite resources.

• Just nerf it, don't delete it: If getting materials from asteroids was too strong, why not just lower the 80% return rate? There was no need to completely delete one of the most interesting mechanics in the expansion.

Right now, Quality just feels like a tedious chore for massive post-game bases instead of a rewarding system to help you actually beat the game. "Space refineries" were a great, satisfying way to engage with Quality, and it is a huge shame to see them go just to force more wasteful recycling.

Please reconsider this choice. From what I read on the forum, steam and reddit makes me believe that many people feel the same. People won't play when this update will be released as stable. Of course there is a possibility to use a mod or revert the version on stream to 2.0 but it just feels wrong that creators are "punishing" the players for finding creative solutions and now players must modify the game to keep their factories working.

You mean Space platform is the only place where you can't use robots, so the only place where you HAVE to spagetthi which is the true spirit of Factorio and otherwise players are just going to use robots and it's reducing the amount of diverse build and challenge in the game ?? yes i agree

LDS Shuffle is for Legendary Steel not really for Copper, Copper is just a Side Effect. Why? Because the other upcycling processes overproduce Copper by a large margin, meaning if you used them you would still drown in Legendary Copper to the point of needing to delete it. (also it needs high LDS productivity research, which space casinos never did)

I think you can use LDS shuffle for whatever you want, just dump the undesired stuff in Lava, it's made even faster now that a whole stack can be voided per tick instead of 1 item per tick when the inserter has several item in hands. And it's very much possible to have the space casino made to require the high productivity on asteroids, if instead of removing the ability to put quality module in the reprocessing receipe AND preventing the research to apply on the "chunk" part of the regular processing receipe, that last part was reverted. The two changes conpounds, whereas only the first one would leave casino in a similar situation as LDS regarding the need for research.

I'm glad I don't play maps long enough to get high productivity research; I'm pretty sure I would have lost all interest in the quality system if I had a near-lossless method available to me.

Many players do reach "high productivity research" in their game and enjoy or enjoyed it. If you don't reach that stage, it appears that it won't change your game in any way if the space casino are made available with high productivity reseach, so that's not a convincing argument to me.

So you say Space Age should not have embraced new concepts but just delivered some more of the same? Similar to the Fifa series for example. Very safe for change-averse players who want to pay for reskins every year.
I assume lots of players wanted to see really new stuff, concepts and problems, including me.

I read the argument the other way , space casino was part of the new concept, or the new "exercise design", or the challenge you could decide to tackle, but the change to balance them away from the game is felt you are left for quality with "more of the same". Space Platforms have that space constraint where more tiles means more fuel consumption and more area to cover with turret, and no robots rules which makes the design rules more "unique" or "different" than on the other planets. Only on Aquilo do you see robots being restricted somehow otherwise, and it's pretty light, and Aquilo isn't a place where you have a lot of raw ressources for doing quality.