D-Load Storage (Train unloading chests) 0.1.2

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Damrus
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D-Load Storage (Train unloading chests) 0.1.2

Post by Damrus » Sun Sep 06, 2015 1:17 pm

Type: Mod
Name: D-Load Storage
Description: Adds chests the lenght of train cargo wagons for loading and unloading cargo.
License: MIT
Version: 0.1.2
Release: 2015-09-06
Tested-With-Factorio-Version: 0.12.6
Category: Item, Convenience
Tags: Chest
Latest Download:
D-Load-Storage_0.1.2.zip
(332.71 KiB) Downloaded 301 times
License
Long description
Pictures
Version history
Attachments
D-Load-Storage_0.1.1.zip
Older version.
(302.84 KiB) Downloaded 165 times
Last edited by Damrus on Sat Sep 12, 2015 8:13 am, edited 12 times in total.

orzelek
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Re: D-Load Storage (Train unloading chests)

Post by orzelek » Sun Sep 06, 2015 1:50 pm

2 simple things:
1. It's a rar not a zip.
2. Version in rar name doesn't match page and description.

Idea is awesome :D
Problems with train access are game bugs so I'm not sure why you are listing them here as mod issues. They also happen with line of normal chests.

Damrus
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Re: D-Load Storage (Train unloading chests) 0.1.1

Post by Damrus » Sun Sep 06, 2015 2:07 pm

Fixed and fixed

On the mod issue, I wan't people to know that this wont fix a base game problem and fully understand why it happens.

Thank you for the quick reply!

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Re: D-Load Storage (Train unloading chests) 0.1.1

Post by Peter34 » Sun Sep 06, 2015 2:30 pm

There is already the Large Boxes mod:
https://forums.factorio.com/forum/vie ... 94&t=14217

Which does some of the same. You'd use three Large (3x3 footprint) boxes for unloading trains, or five of them if unloading from 2 wagons (since the middle Large Chest can share 2 wagons I think), then take it from there.

It's always good to get more mods, of course. Slightly different ways of doing things, and then we'll see which of the more-or-less similar mods end up being more popular.

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Re: D-Load Storage (Train unloading chests) 0.1.1

Post by Damrus » Sun Sep 06, 2015 2:37 pm

I am aware of that mod. I also played with dytech since way before (which also had those boxes). And as I mentioned there is also the equalizer chest mod.

But none of these mods are a "one fits all" kind of solution, and neither is this. Its just an addition.

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Re: D-Load Storage (Train unloading chests) 0.1.1

Post by Zuzak » Sun Sep 06, 2015 8:09 pm

Thank you for this effective simple mod which I have waited a long time for.
horizontal: 7 long, 1 high
vertical: 1 long, 5 high
versions of all chests available, including logistics
vertical is made from horizontal and mines to horizontal.
Has its own research and crafting category.
Graphics looks nice, like one continuous chest welded together.
Steel and logistics chests have 160 stack size. :D

The only two things I can think of adding to this is:
Filtered chest like train (iron or steel only for simplicity)
Smart chest variant.

Simple. Efficient. Effective.
(and highly hilarious :lol: with increased inserter stack bonus to make belt-less factory)
Thank you.

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Re: D-Load Storage (Train unloading chests) 0.1.1

Post by waduk » Sun Sep 06, 2015 8:29 pm

Ahhh, i think finally i have the answer of those slowdown issue, i use a tons of equalizer chest, practically everywhere.
I'm gonna use this mod.
However, there are certain "issue".
Either the chest was too long, or it was too short for my configuration ( i use 5 or 12 equilizer chest in a row, it fit nicely with substation).
And it would be too much trouble if i request for you to add a 5 and 12 tiles chest.
So I'm gonna modified myself, but need guidance.
Aside from entity graphics ( i can do that), the only thing i need to edit is the collision & selection box; width & height, right ?
So how does it works ? What this number means ?

Taken from long steel horizontal.

Code: Select all

    collision_box = {{-3.4, -0.4}, {3.4, 0.4}},
    selection_box = {{-3.5, -0.5}, {3.5, 0.5}},

Code: Select all

      width = 240,
      height = 32,
      shift = {0.2, 0}

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Re: D-Load Storage (Train unloading chests) 0.1.1

Post by Damrus » Mon Sep 07, 2015 8:26 am

Hey waduk,

I won’t mind making those variations when I get home. But I am not sure you will need them. I might be wrong, but I’ll explain. It might save you and/or me some extra work.

If you are set on making your own ill help you out at the end here. But first, I'd advice pressing f4 (In-game) and checking the collision and selection boxes for the basic debug menu and then pressing f5 to start the basic debug menu.

This will show you the range of the collision boxes for your train wagons and boxes (and why I choose the lengths of the boxes as I've made them).

7 tiles is to long for the horizontal as 5 would be better, but only if you have one wagon behind your train and only if it’s perfectly stationed. The moment you add another wagon, the access for inserters changes for the first wagon and instead of being 5 long they become 6ish long.

In addition, whenever a train stops at a station, the wagons never perfectly fit the grid. So they might be a bit in one tile and 6ish long, but hit 7 tiles total. This is why I made them 7 tiles long. A similar issue is there with the vertical ones, but there I was forced to leave a gab in between the chests or have the chest extend by one for every 2 train wagons.

I considered making 5,6,7 long horizontal boxes but that is not the cleanest way of doing things, I'd say. And I rather stayed with the 7 long boxes as it will stick out 1 on uneven trains, but always work with even wagoned trains.

The picture I used in my post, has a train that placed itself at the station (as it normally would by driving there) and all the inserters have access to those wagons (but funny enough not the other way around from container to wagons).

Anyway, enough of that, you probably still want to edit the mod yourself :D



Code: Select all

    collision_box = {{-3.4, -0.4}, {3.4, 0.4}},
    selection_box = {{-3.5, -0.5}, {3.5, 0.5}},
This bit reference to those collision and selection boxes I was talking about (obviously). The first numbers in each set (-3.4 and 3.4) are the width of those boxes and the second bit (-0.4 and 0.4) are the height. This is all from its center so that’s why you have 2 numbers and negative numbers at that.

Code: Select all

      width = 240,
      height = 32,
      shift = {0.2, 0}
This bit refers to the height and width of the images being used. A tile is 32 pixels long and wide so a 7 tile box is 32 * 7 = 224 pixels, Plus some shadow gets you the 240 pixels in width. So if you edit the images just remove or add 32pixels per tile you want.

Now, if you would place the object that box will not be perfectly centered, because the shadow is in there and only on one side. So the shift function lets you move the whole image up a bit. First is width second is height.


I hope that helps, if not, let me know and Ill try to be more helpfull.

Good luck!

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Re: D-Load Storage (Train unloading chests) 0.1.1

Post by Damrus » Mon Sep 07, 2015 9:26 am

Zuzak wrote: The only two things I can think of adding to this is:
Filtered chest like train (iron or steel only for simplicity)
Smart chest variant.

I wouldn't know how to make a filtered chest, (ill look in to it)
But I can make a smart chest, Somehow I didn't even consider doing it. >< Ill try to make it asap.

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Re: D-Load Storage (Train unloading chests) 0.1.1

Post by Darloth » Mon Sep 07, 2015 11:08 am

Looks good, might use this in my next play.

I'd prefer it if the graphics were a bit more consistent - right now they look different depending on horizontal or vertical - I know it's a bit more work to splice them together, but if possible I'd like them to all look like the vertical graphics, which remind me of the walls, sortof a long chest with little crenelations part way along.

Regarding filtered chests, apparently the only way to do it currently in the factorio engine is to use a train car - so the filtered chests mod that's already out there actually creates train cars that look and act like chests. This has some odd consequences elsewhere, so I'd recommend not doing filtered chests for this mod. I'd love them if you could, but I'm not sure it's worth the effort fiddling with dummy train car entities and suchlike. Plus, if I want a long, filterable chest exactly the same size as a train car... I can just use a train car :)

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Re: D-Load Storage (Train unloading chests) 0.1.1

Post by waduk » Mon Sep 07, 2015 1:27 pm

Thanks Damrus for the explanation.

Actually i don't question why you choose 7 tiles. But the explanation will served well for another user that questioning the reasoning.
7 tiles is perfect.
I mentioned about 5 tiles for different reason (i use 5 tiles to make buffer chest). I can redo that design easily using your 7 tiles chest.

==================================================================
Further question about modding :
==================================================================
Start with the graphic, because i think i understand this the most.
So, because i want to make 12 tiles, which means:
12x32=384 pixels
Plus 16 pixels for the shadows, gives me 396

Because i use the same shadow, the shift value is still the same.
LIke this ?

Code: Select all

width = 396,
height = 32,
shift = {0.2, 0}
Still little confused about the shift value, if the shadow were 16 pixels, and if one tiles is 32 pixels wide. Why it shifted 0.2 in x-axis coordinate (?) instead of 0.5 ?
No info on wiki about shift value :|

------------------------------------------------------------------
Completely lost with Collision & selection box :roll:
Currently reading this, but still lost :
https://forums.factorio.com/wiki/inde ... properties
https://forums.factorio.com/wiki/inde ... es/AABBbox

The value is a tiles count ? And the tiles count is (or can be) a float/decimal value ?
I'm confused because in my country, the comma is used instead of dot if we want to wrote decimal value.
Dot is used as terminator number/separate entry.

Code: Select all

collision_box = {{-3.4, -0.4}, {3.4, 0.4}},
selection_box = {{-3.5, -0.5}, {3.5, 0.5}},
So, this means you use ;
Collision: 6.8 tiles wide and 0.8 height ?
For selection: 7 tiles wide and 1 height?

Or is it
Collision: 7 tiles wide and 0.4 height ?
For selection: 8 tiles wide and 0.5 height?

As you can see, i'm a bit confused about the numbering standard.

But i think the first one is the correct one ?
So is it like this for 12 tiles chest ?

Code: Select all

collision_box = {{-5.9, -0.4}, {5.9, 0.4}},
selection_box = {{-6, -0.5}, {6, 0.5}},
If those were correct, how do i add new entry to the crafting windows? I didn't want to replace the 7 tiles chest, just add new one.
------------------------------------------------------------------
Also, why you choose stack size of 180 ?
Vanilla steel chest can hold up 48 stack, so 7 chest should hold 336.
Is it because screen limitation ? To make it view able on screen ?



==================================================================
Skip the wall of text below, it's just (the technical ?) reason why i want 12 long chest.

"Why i choose 12 chest"
==================================================================

I have a "weird" outpost design, using 12 equalizer chest, for performance and compactness.
Let me explain a bit if you don't mind reading why i choose 12, and using yours 7+7 didn't fit well on my configuration.



Express belt can transport 2400+ item per minute, and fast inserter can move 120+ item per minute, so i need 20+ inserter, 20 chest.
More than that, the extra inserter will not do any work, wasted space.
But the number were round up, we actually need additional 1 or 2 fast inserter (if split).

Here's my current outpost config:
Although i only need 11 chest on each side, i use 12 or aesthetic reason.
Current outpost
The problem with that config, even with equalizer chests, that the further the chest from center, the less item they get due item dividing is getting smaller.
This will pose a problem on unloading area, because i set-up my train to leave if any of the cargo is empty.

Using your chest(7+7), while it perfectly fit the train cargo (yaay !), the problem was even more severe.
Outpost config using 7+7 long chest
Hard to look at, but further chest get too little item due the inserter didn't get the item (only 3 working, the rest 4 were idle).
The math hold up, if split we only need 10+1 inserters, the rest will not working.

Sure there are another config that will work, making it a two vertical row instead horizontal, but i liked if my outpost were not big vertically.

Another issue is the unloading/substation placement.
Current config
LIke above, even using equalizer chest, the further chest will get empty sooner, even if there are item left in inner chest, it will not being distributed/too slow.
7+7 long Chest Config
With your chest, the problem were more severe, because the further chest didn't get distributed item. Al chest store independently (obviously)
Also, the substation placement is not compact.
Substation can only connect 6 tiles, so i cannot place substation side by side, it will leaves 2 unpowered inserter if i put 7+7 in a row.
And it ttok too many substation 6 instead of 3 to make it aligned.
I can come up with this placement, but the substation is not perfectly aligned .
Alternative placement


TLDR: I need 12 long chest.

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Re: D-Load Storage (Train unloading chests) 0.1.1

Post by Damrus » Mon Sep 07, 2015 6:15 pm

waduk wrote:snip

Woa, load of questions! xD maybe its best if we skype and/or PM a bit and I can show you/ anwser you, all your questions. I wouldn't even mind sharing my Psd's with you.

But maybe its best if we keep this thread clear for issues with the mod :D

which reminds me. I still have to go about making a smart chest variant! (ill get on that one tomorrow, Sorry)

Ill send you a PM via the board so you can contact me there for your preferd way of communication.


EDIT:

O ill anwser the chest size here btw,

I simply lowered the chest size for a few ("stupid") reasons.

1. I envisioned the chest actually moving stuff around within the box so that an inserter can put something in, on one side of the box and another can take something out on the complete other side. This mechanisem of belts and arms should take up some space within the chest. (this reasoning can be ignored, its just my own little thing). Its a similiar % missing of each cargo chest type btw.
2. I didn't want these to just be a better/easier/convient way of storing loads of stuff. its not the function of the mod so I don't mind it being worse at it than something thats meant to store loads of stuff.
3. I've seen people complain about the large box mod having a ridiculous cargo hold and found myself agreeing with them to some degree. Its simply not needed to have so much of a cargo hold. These unload chests should be a buffer not a sink hole :D

On that note though. Feel free to change it to what ever number you feel is right!

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Re: D-Load Storage (Train unloading chests) 0.1.1

Post by Peter34 » Tue Sep 08, 2015 6:46 am

Zuzak wrote: Has its own research and crafting category.
Even though I'm not going to use this mod myself, almost certainly, I'll still vehemently against giving its own crafting tab to a mod that only adds 2 items to the game. That's just silly.

Having separate crafting tabs for large mods is good. But a tab with just 2 items, that's a bad idea.

What could be done, to improve the idea to be tolerable, is if the new Train Unloading Chests are added to this tab specific to this mod, along with everything pertaining to Trains and railway transport. That is, all the existing objects from the vanilla game, such as Rails, Locomotives, Signals et cetera.

That could make sense.

But a new tab just for 2 items, that's a very bad idea. Most players who don't use one big mod, or play the vanilla game unmodded, use a mixture of mods. Often there'll be 3-8 additional crafting tabs, added by the bunch of mods used. Adding one more, with just 2 piddly items, is severely un-good.

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Re: D-Load Storage (Train unloading chests) 0.1.1

Post by waduk » Tue Sep 08, 2015 8:58 am

Peter34 wrote:
Zuzak wrote: Has its own research and crafting category.
Even though I'm not going to use this mod myself, almost certainly, I'll still vehemently against giving its own crafting tab to a mod that only adds 2 items to the game. That's just silly.

Having separate crafting tabs for large mods is good. But a tab with just 2 items, that's a bad idea.

What could be done, to improve the idea to be tolerable, is if the new Train Unloading Chests are added to this tab specific to this mod, along with everything pertaining to Trains and railway transport. That is, all the existing objects from the vanilla game, such as Rails, Locomotives, Signals et cetera.

That could make sense.

But a new tab just for 2 items, that's a very bad idea. Most players who don't use one big mod, or play the vanilla game unmodded, use a mixture of mods. Often there'll be 3-8 additional crafting tabs, added by the bunch of mods used. Adding one more, with just 2 piddly items, is severely un-good.
I'm on the opposite
Separate crafting tab is good. Keep it. It would make less cluttered on vanilla crafting tab.
This mod add dozen items, (2 variant of wood, iron, steel, and all the logistic). it should have it's own tab.

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Re: D-Load Storage (Train unloading chests) 0.1.2

Post by Damrus » Tue Sep 08, 2015 12:04 pm

There is a new version out.

0.1.2
Added Smart chests.
Changed some icons.
Changed some health values.


On the mod having its own tab.

Most of the time I don't prefer mods having their own tab either, But I really don't like it if a mod makes me have to scroll inside of a tabs. Now there are 16 diffrent items. Something I thing warrents its own tab also (like Waduk pointed out).

That being said, I also don't like it if mods move basic items away from where I am used to having them. So It will be very unlikely that I will do that.

But I appreciate the feedback from both of you.

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Re: D-Load Storage (Train unloading chests) 0.1.2

Post by waduk » Tue Sep 08, 2015 3:41 pm

Error on startup :
Image
The info.json version haven't been updated ?

Also, can you add description so the crafting tab didn't show as "Unknown.key.item-group name.chest"?

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Re: D-Load Storage (Train unloading chests) 0.1.2

Post by Damrus » Tue Sep 08, 2015 6:06 pm

Derp...

Fixed and fixed,

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Re: D-Load Storage (Train unloading chests) 0.1.2

Post by waduk » Tue Sep 08, 2015 7:23 pm

Thanks !

Oohh..one last bit, should say this in the first place, forgot to wrote it.

Realllyy minor typo in the technology name. "Standerd D-loading Chests".
Or is it intentional ? Instead of "Standard"?
Because on previous version, one of the icon in technology folder is given the name standerd-icon.png
Btw, i successfully add new entity, also redo the work. Instead of adding new steel chest, now there are 12 tiles smart chest,..yaayy ! Thank you !!!

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Re: D-Load Storage (Train unloading chests) 0.1.2

Post by orzelek » Tue Sep 08, 2015 7:34 pm

You have potentially annoying bug with zipped version. There is problem with case of icon names for technology - mod will not run as zip and needs to be extracted. Might also fail on linux/mac where case sensitiveness is also present in file system.

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Re: D-Load Storage (Train unloading chests) 0.1.2

Post by Damrus » Tue Sep 08, 2015 7:58 pm

Both should be fixed.

I'm just very dyslexic so the standerd/standard thing was a honest misstake :x Thanks for pointing it out!

Got to triple check everything I type.

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