Realtime Clock / Timer to pause game / On Screen Display which displays current system-time

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Realtime Clock / Timer to pause game / On Screen Display which displays current system-time

Post by H2So5 » Mon Jul 17, 2017 4:13 pm

Hi

Every time i play this game i forget the (real) time and paly houers and hours till shops are closed or i missed my meetings.
Is their a mood that shows me the real time or can someone write a mod?

Thanks

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Re: Realtime Clock

Post by Koub » Mon Jul 17, 2017 4:55 pm

This should help
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Re: Realtime Clock

Post by ssilk » Mon Jul 17, 2017 9:59 pm

See for the problems around this and what is suggested instead:

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=340 Sleepless night
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=1438 Timer to pause game
viewtopic.php?f=71&t=13299 Send players current time as event to all others
viewtopic.php?f=5&t=21379 Quantified lack of sleep
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=32690 Clock needed to keep in touch with the outside worl
viewtopic.php?f=69&t=32966 OSD for current time? (On Screen Display which displays current system-time)
viewtopic.php?f=89&t=42206 Please will someone make realtime clock?
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In-Game System Clock display

Post by PyroFire » Sat May 12, 2018 2:28 am

TL;DR
Factorio should show your local system clock while in-game.

What ?
aka, the time that's displayed on your computer.
Don't care where it is, just that it is visible at all times, or at least an option for it.
Why ?
When playing full screen, it is very easy to lose track of time.
I find myself constantly tabbing out just to check what time it is so i can monitor how long my play sessions are, and when i need to stop playing.
It's a pretty standard feature to ensure play sessions are of a healthy length.

As much as i would like to play until 3,4,5am, i can't.
Please show me the system clock so i know when i need to put the game down and attend to my other commitments.
*This is mostly an issue when playing full-screen.
Why should this be added to VANILLA and not be sourced from a mod ?
Because of aforementioned losing track of time.
Not showing the system clock can lead to some pretty bad habits, like playing for waaay too long.

I'm sure it can be done with mods, but fact is i shouldn't have to disable achievements just because factorio doesnt want to show me what time it is.

The real question here is, if factorio doesn't need the system clock to show, i can only ask; what kind of habits or play session lengths are you expecting from your players!?

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Re: In-Game System Clock display

Post by Koub » Sat May 12, 2018 5:42 am

The usual way to get the time is by using a watch. Many people also use their phone nowadays. But the watch works really well. I know it's an old technology, but it does the job pretty well, and you can have it with you when you're not playing Factorio, which is practical when your gaming rig weights 20 kg. :mrgreen:
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Re: In-Game System Clock display

Post by PyroFire » Sat May 12, 2018 6:15 am

Koub wrote:The usual way to get the time is by using a watch
I'm not one of those people that constantly need to look at their phone.
As for your watch, is it syncronized with an NTP server and does it adjust for daylight savings in your local region?
And not everyone can afford those fancy new "smart watches".
On second thought, who actually wears a watch while they're using their computer?
Wouldn't that get really annoying with your wrist always in contact with your table/mousepad/etc?

My point is yes, i can check my computers time by alt+tabbing.
And yes, there are other ways to keep track.

But this suggestion has more to do with how easy it is to get drawn into factorio and spend hours playing around with designs.
And this just shows how good of a game factorio is, that it would even need to be suggested to have a clock in-game.

But exit points are also very important.
Not everyone is constantly checking their watch or phone while playing, because of how easy it is to get drawn in.

Of course, this suggestion won't be necessary for some.
But for a game like factorio where you can play practically endlessly, for literal days on end, just having a clock right there always reminding you of how long you're playing would be highly appreciated.
I'm just asking for an in-game option to turn it on for the players who feel like this would be useful to them.

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Re: In-Game System Clock display

Post by steinio » Sat May 12, 2018 6:59 am

This topic was also discussed here: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=32690

I would also like a real time clock in the game.

@Koub: your answer is stupid. That's like saying "You have a problem with Factorio? Play another game."

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Re: In-Game System Clock display

Post by LukeM » Sat May 12, 2018 8:18 am

PyroFire wrote:As for your watch, is it syncronized with an NTP server and does it adjust for daylight savings in your local region?
And not everyone can afford those fancy new "smart watches".
On second thought, who actually wears a watch while they're using their computer?
Wouldn't that get really annoying with your wrist always in contact with your table/mousepad/etc?
Mine is radio synchronised, has daylight saving adjustment for a huge list of cities, and it cost about £20 ($30) iirc :D (It's the cheapest Casio 'wave ceptor' watch, might have got it during a sale because it seems slightly more expensive atm).
I wear mine fairly loosely and on my left wrist, as I'm right handed so its my right wrist that needs to be moving around on the desk, and my left one is usually either not resting at all or just resting slightly on the edge so I can push my watch up my arm slightly so it doesnt touch.

Also, if it is that big of a problem, you can always play in fullscreen windowed mode, then you can still see your system clock without needing to tab out.

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Re: In-Game System Clock display

Post by Koub » Sat May 12, 2018 2:04 pm

steinio wrote:@Koub: your answer is stupid. That's like saying "You have a problem with Factorio? Play another game."
Actually, I just voice my opinion : Never understood why real life time should be displayed in a computer game (except when events in the game are timed depending on the IRL time of course).

If a clock should be added, why not a web browser so that people can watch let's plays while playing Factorio ? Oh and of course a spreadsheet so that people can make their calculations for optimal ratios while playing. I'd rather have a clock that tells me the ingame time.

btw my watch is an almost 25 years old quartz watch. I have to shift one hour twice a year, change the day number whenever the last month was not 31 days, and change its battery every 2 years. But if I trust it to be on time in my everyday life, I guess it's good enough to prevent me playing too long at night :).
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Re: In-Game System Clock display

Post by PyroFire » Sat May 12, 2018 3:47 pm

Koub wrote:Never understood why real life time should be displayed in a computer game (except when events in the game are timed depending on the IRL time of course).
It's because Exit Points are very important if you want your game to be Humanely Designed.

Or to put it another way, having the system clock to show in-game is showing respect to the players life outside the game.
An option in the F4 menu to do this shouldn't be that big of an ask.
Last edited by PyroFire on Sat May 12, 2018 3:54 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: In-Game System Clock display

Post by Jap2.0 » Sat May 12, 2018 3:48 pm

PyroFire wrote:I'm not one of those people that constantly need to look at their phone.
Neither am I.
PyroFire wrote:As for your watch, is it syncronized with an NTP server and does it adjust for daylight savings in your local region?
No. It's not that difficult to set the time a couple times a year.
PyroFire wrote:And not everyone can afford those fancy new "smart watches".
Neither can I.
PyroFire wrote:On second thought, who actually wears a watch while they're using their computer?
Me.
PyroFire wrote:Wouldn't that get really annoying with your wrist always in contact with your table/mousepad/etc?
No - generally only my hand is in contact with my mouse.
PyroFire wrote:My point is yes, i can check my computers time by alt+tabbing.
And yes, there are other ways to keep track.
Correct.
PyroFire wrote:But this suggestion has more to do with how easy it is to get drawn into factorio and spend hours playing around with designs.
And this just shows how good of a game factorio is, that it would even need to be suggested to have a clock in-game.

But exit points are also very important.
Not everyone is constantly checking their watch or phone while playing, because of how easy it is to get drawn in.
I could also easily ignore (or probably turn off) the clock in game.
PyroFire wrote:Of course, this suggestion won't be necessary for some.
But for a game like factorio where you can play practically endlessly, for literal days on end, just having a clock right there always reminding you of how long you're playing would be highly appreciated.
I'm just asking for an in-game option to turn it on for the players who feel like this would be useful to them.
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Re: In-Game System Clock display

Post by PyroFire » Sat May 12, 2018 3:53 pm

Jap2.0 wrote:
PyroFire wrote:Wouldn't that get really annoying with your wrist always in contact with your table/mousepad/etc?
No - generally only my hand is in contact with my mouse.
What?
I said wrist in contact with the table/mousepad.
Not hand in contact with the mouse...
Anyway what are you trying to say?
An option for "show-system-clock" in the F4 menu is too much and shouldn't be added?

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Re: In-Game System Clock display

Post by LukeM » Sat May 12, 2018 4:43 pm

Having a system clock is also unnecessary clutter on the screen though, and will be information that players that arent playing in fullscreen borderless mode (or just players with a clock / watch) already have. And you cant really argue to have it as an F4 menu option as most players would never even find that setting, so it wouldn't be used by those that actually want to use it.

IMO a better solution is to either use a mod for this functionality, as its in fact probably easier to find than an obscure debug option, or just not press the button that hides you're actual system clock (play in full screen windowed instead of full screen borderless)

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Re: In-Game System Clock display

Post by PyroFire » Sat May 12, 2018 5:04 pm

LukeM wrote:Having a system clock is also unnecessary clutter on the screen though
Agreed. I am not suggesting it should default to on.
LukeM wrote:and will be information that players that arent playing in fullscreen borderless mode already have.
As i have stated, this will not be useful for some players who rely on other means.
Y'know, the kinds of players who don't have a family or full-time job to attend to.
This game is great, but i can't sit around and waste time outside what i have allocated to this area of my free time.

I personally prefer to play in full screen (which is also the default display setting FYI), as it allows me to have more on the screen at once.
Side note: mouse-hovering over certain structures gives you an information readout on the right of the screen.
This is often cut off if there is too much information, such as logistics chests showing you what items are in the logistics system.
This problem would be exacerbated with the inclusion of the taskbar at the bottom of the screen and the factorio title bar at the top, making the vertical size of the game window smaller.
...In addition to the having less on the screen, which i have already stated
LukeM wrote:And you cant really argue to have it as an F4 menu option as most players would never even find that setting, so it wouldn't be used by those that actually want to use it.
Allow me to prove you wrong.
IMO a better solution is to either use a mod for this functionality
And disable achievements solely because this simple, humane request is too much/too hard to add to the game?
To suggest that i should instead take away from my play experience because... Wait, why is a mod a better solution?

I'm quite surprised the number of people in this thread that would refuse this suggestion from off-hand means that don't actually address the reasons why i feel this should be added into the game.

Work-arounds, excuses and unreasonable compromises do not explain why this simple option should not be added into the game.

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Re: In-Game System Clock display

Post by PyroFire » Sat May 12, 2018 5:24 pm

Was poking around the other threads.

This has been suggested a few times already, with a dev response saying that it is not currently possible to add a real-time clock into the game using mods, and that it might be added into the base gamemode:
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=60251
viewtopic.php?f=89&t=42206

I guess this is a frequent suggestion now .. ?
Though i'm being a bit more specific in its use.
Just an option to show it on-screen as suggested in the second thread linked there.

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Re: In-Game System Clock display

Post by LukeM » Sat May 12, 2018 5:30 pm

PyroFire wrote:
LukeM wrote:and will be information that players that arent playing in fullscreen borderless mode already have.
As i have stated, this will not be useful for some players who rely on other means.
Y'know, the kinds of players who don't have a family or full-time job to attend to.
This game is great, but i can't sit around and waste time outside what i have allocated to this area of my free time.
I don't see why you are relating not having a family / job with having a watch / clock / playing in windowed mode :P
I see why you would want to know the time, I would too as I am in full time education (and often have an hour or two limit that I have to strictly follow or I will be late), just not why you are so quick to dismiss other means of telling the time. A watch is an incredibly useful thing that IMO everyone should have, you can get really cheap watches that automatically update due to daylight saving / running slow so theres pretty much no disadvantage of having one.
PyroFire wrote:I personally prefer to play in full screen (which is also the default display setting FYI), as it allows me to have more on the screen at once.
Side note: mouse-hovering over certain structures gives you an information readout on the right of the screen.
This is often cut off if there is too much information, such as logistics chests showing you what items are in the logistics system.
This problem would be exacerbated with the inclusion of the taskbar at the bottom of the screen and the factorio title bar at the top, making the vertical size of the game window smaller.
...In addition to the having less on the screen, which i have already stated
Although I don't think that the small change really matters, I guess I can see where you're coming from.
PyroFire wrote:
LukeM wrote:And you cant really argue to have it as an F4 menu option as most players would never even find that setting, so it wouldn't be used by those that actually want to use it.
Allow me to prove you wrong.
Thats fps though, generally you would expect any game to have a way to get an fps counter, so would naturally google it if you wanted one. An in-game system time isn't really something you would expect, so personally I wouldnt even think to google it to find out if there is one.
PyroFire wrote:
IMO a better solution is to either use a mod for this functionality
And disable achievements solely because this simple, humane request is too much/too hard to add to the game?
To suggest that i should instead take away from my play experience because... Wait, why is a mod a better solution?

I'm quite surprised the number of people in this thread that would refuse this suggestion from off-hand means that don't actually address the reasons why i feel this should be added into the game.
As I explained in my last post, the reason I think a mod would be a better solution is because thats where I would look to find this feature, so it would probably be the best way to make this feature visible to the people that want to use it.
I guess you have a good point with the achievements, although isn't there a way to make a cosmetic only mod that doesn't disable them? If not then I think this is more of a problem with achievements (maybe if they were only disabled if anything in the world is actually changed / accessed?).

Edit:
PyroFire wrote:(...) a dev response saying that it is not currently possible to add a real-time clock into the game using mods
I thought that lua had a way to get the system time? Or is that disabled for mods?

If so then maybe yes, a debug option is the best way to go, even if it is sub-optimal.

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Re: In-Game System Clock display

Post by Kyralessa » Sat May 12, 2018 5:36 pm

Koub wrote:If a clock should be added, why not a web browser so that people can watch let's plays while playing Factorio ? Oh and of course a spreadsheet so that people can make their calculations for optimal ratios while playing. I'd rather have a clock that tells me the ingame time.
Given the intricate calculations some people make while playing, an in-game spreadsheet would get quite a lot of use, actually. :lol:

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Re: In-Game System Clock display

Post by PyroFire » Sat May 12, 2018 6:08 pm

LukeM wrote:just not why you are so quick to dismiss other means of telling the time. A watch is an incredibly useful thing that IMO everyone should have
Well i'm dismissing these other means for the same reason i am dismissing my current method (alt-tabbing every 10 seconds to show taskbar).
It's just too easy to forget to do that and suddenly an hour has gone by.
I don't have a watch, or any other timing devices near my computer. I already have my PC why do i need more than that?
Everywhere else i go either has a PC nearby, a clock on the wall or if i Really need to know what time it is i'll check my phone when i'm out and about.
This greatly detracts from the immersive experience that factorio provides, mainly because i have to keep stopping and thinking "have i checked what time it is, how long has it been?".
I can't get comfortably immersed with this constant concern.
Having the system time clearly in peripheral view solves all issues, and all potential issues around this suggestion in a single fell swoop.
The losing track of time being the biggest issue.
LukeM wrote:Although I don't think that the small change really matters, I guess I can see where you're coming from.
I don't have a big monitor, so those small differences are pretty large.
My native resolution is 1440x900.
Additionally, i use two rows on my taskbar because it is necessary for my other activities. I can accept this as a niche case for my situation, but it's noteworthy.

The easy comparison is minecraft.
I play that in windowed because the only thing on the HUD is your hotbar, and the game world is easy enough to discern without needing higher resolutions.
You could play minecraft in 800x600 and not have any issues in determining your surroundings.

Factorio is different because there is significantly more information on the screen at any given time, as well as the UI being far more complex.
There aren't many cases where i would suggest so strongly that the system time should be displayed in-game, but factorio is definitely one of those cases.
LukeM wrote:Thats fps though, generally you would expect any game to have a way to get an fps counter, so would naturally google it if you wanted one. An in-game system time isn't really something you would expect, so personally I wouldnt even think to google it to find out if there is one.
I googled this beforehand thinking with a game this large and complex, it should be there.
So, if it existed i would be using it right now without needing to have suggested it.
Same goes for anyone else who feels the same way.

It's a game design thing. It's not appropriate for all games, but it definitely is appropriate for factorio.
Having a game this engaging is absolutely great!! Much credit to the dev team for creating this amazing work.
It's almost *too* engaging sometimes, i would say.
And that's not necessarily a bad thing.
It would just be nice to have some way to more easily moderate our play sessions.
LukeM wrote:As I explained in my last post, the reason I think a mod would be a better solution is because thats where I would look to find this feature, so it would probably be the best way to make this feature visible to the people that want to use it.
Fair point, but i disagree with the visibility of mods.
Versions change all the time, and i do not see mods as reliable.
With 0.17 coming up and its changes to the UI, it's fair to assume that all previous mods that alter the HUD (or make use of menus in general) would require updating.
And the whole achievements thing.
I do not like playing modded, and i would exhaust other options first before resorting to mods.
Making this suggestion is one of those options i have decided to persue.

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Re: In-Game System Clock display

Post by Jap2.0 » Sat May 12, 2018 6:16 pm

PyroFire wrote:
Jap2.0 wrote:
PyroFire wrote:Wouldn't that get really annoying with your wrist always in contact with your table/mousepad/etc?
No - generally only my hand is in contact with my mouse.
What?
I said wrist in contact with the table/mousepad.
Not hand in contact with the mouse...
Anyway what are you trying to say?
An option for "show-system-clock" in the F4 menu is too much and shouldn't be added?
No, that's generally not a problem for me. I'm not against it as an option, as long as I can turn it off.
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Re: In-Game System Clock display

Post by smew » Fri Sep 21, 2018 9:04 pm

Here's a hacky solution for a multiplayer server. It places a giant stone clock at spawn. It doesn't use mods, but it does disable achievements since it uses cheat commands to place blocks.

viewtopic.php?f=96&t=62617&p=379797&hil ... ck#p379797

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