Always request space platform foundation first

[kpreid]

What?

When a space platform makes requests for construction, always sort space platform foundation first in the list, and cargo bays second.

Right now, foundation and cargo bays are usually in about the middle of the list (for the platforms I’ve designed). This means that a lot of buildings may be launched before any of them can be built. Instead, request foundation first, so that buildings can always be built as soon as they’re received.

Why?

• If you’re building or modifying a platform by hand rather than from a blueprint, it’s harder to read when lots of things are ghosts. Sending foundation first will reduce the chances of that, because while you always need both foundation and a building to put on it, foundation is useful for all buildings whereas a rocket load of that building is more specific.
• Another user mentioned (but not in the suggestions forum or I can’t find it) that with a large platform, it’s possible for the automatic construction requests to get into a stuck state where the hub is full but nothing can be built. If foundation were launched first, it would always be possible to build the buildings so they don’t take up hub space. Similarly, launching cargo bays second ensures that any necessary cargo space expansions are available (but that is a much less likely problem since it requires there be non-building items involved).

[Sworn]

Another user mentioned (but not in the suggestions forum or I can’t find it) that with a large platform, it’s possible for the automatic construction requests to get into a stuck state where the hub is full but nothing can be built. If foundation were launched first, it would always be possible to build the buildings so they don’t take up hub space. Similarly, launching cargo bays second ensures that any necessary cargo space expansions are available (but that is a much less likely problem since it requires there be non-building items involved).

+1

Yah, I got this one myself, copy and paste my space science, and it got full of items, and nothing got build because there was no platform to expand it.
Annoying as hell. Sure, just send some items down, and some platform up and job is done, but still annoying

[mmmPI]

That kinda make sense but i've seen people on other topics complaining that they want the ammo to be loaded first.

[kpreid]

Good point. I build all my platforms on Nauvis, so I don’t need to worry about quickly supplying ammo. But, that sounds like something that would be hard to handle automatically at all, and so would be better served by building a small interim blueprint before a big one — because you’re going to want to build everything involved in supplying the turrets, and that could be all sorts of things.

[macdjord]

Note that if you're building a platform in the orbit of a planet other than Nauvis, you can't just slap down a giant blueprint and then start sending stuff up to build it with, because even if you send the ammo first, it does no good without guns to shoot it, and those guns are presumably at the edges of the blueprint. You'd have to build up in stages, first build a minimal platform with guns and ammo to defend itself, then ship up the resources to build the blueprint, then build the blueprint all at once so you can start using the new guns.

Now, you do need to keep the platform supplied with ammo as you're shipping up the parts for later expansion. I think it would work fine if the priority list went ammo -> foundation -> cargo bays -> everything else. As long as nobody requests so much ammo that it completely fills the hub, it won't stall out.

[Paradroid]

+1 from me too. I've just run into this trying to make a platform from a blueprint. The blueprint needs 7000 foundation so it deadlocks itself, because it fills up with building first before request foundation, by which time its storage space is full.

Very annoying and means big platforms can get themselves into a situation where they can't be built from blueprints.

[Khazul]

+1 - Ive had deadlocks from this many times.

Out of frustration made a logistics group containing just foundations and a few cargo bays called 'Build the f****** platform!' and switch that one immediately and auto-logistics off.

Be nice if I didn't have to do this.

I dont care about ammo as I always build at Nauvis anyway so it doesnt keep getting trashed while it is being built.

[Hommit]

Very reasonable

[Tinyboss]

Someone in another thread had a great idea, a bit more general: prioritize things that could be built now if we had them. So that's naturally going to be platforms, and it will work outward from the hub, meaning cargo bays will get sent up early, too.

This generalizes better to any future modded content.

[mrvn]

While I agree that space platform foundation is crucial for all construction once you get the recipe to produce copper from asteroid chunks you can build space foundation in space.

Which brings me to another feature request that I think meshes with this one: I don't want to request space foundation or anything else I produce in space.

And I don't want to be able to request construction stuff at just some planets so I can still use the "All Requests satisfied" condition.


So overall what is needed is a way to prioritize and filter and extend the construction requests so one can:

- always see what the platform is made of showing what's present and what's missing (top/bottom number)
The construction requests should just be the first group in the requests box and and enabling/disabling the group itself enables/disables automatic deliveries. I want to be able to request construction materials but load rockets manually, too.
- reorder items and get them delivered from first to last
- blacklist items from being requested
- whitelist / blacklist planets for each item
This needs multiple choices. More than one planet might be able to supply items.
- change minimum amount for rocket delivery

[Sworn]

If the space platform hub would just only request items where there is foundation under the ghost it would greatly improve things.

viewtopic.php?p=647795#p647795

This, that you mention in another thread, would be a really good solution, it would request only things that it can actually build.
So, when first pasting a blueprint it the only thing it can build is the platform, so that would be the only thing going up.

As it expands, it will start to request the rest as well

[J-H]

Yes.
Also, having construction robots prioritize power lines would be great.

[Xellnix]

this needs to be fixed, would even say that is not a suggestion, it is a BUG, a platform that just requests auto stuff that isnt sortable, requests stuff it cant even place without foundations, i want to place a platform and dont care about, but i have to, first i have to place a bp with the foundation+storages and after that the real bp

so requesting only the stuff it can build (and foundations are always buildable) would be nice (ofc if there are turrets ammo should be piped too)
another option would be to NOT auto request stuff if there is already a rocket size stack of it present at the storage, the platform doesnt have to gather 2k belts first and block the storage if it cant even place 100

[mrvn]

this needs to be fixed, would even say that is not a suggestion, it is a BUG, a platform that just requests auto stuff that isnt sortable, requests stuff it cant even place without foundations, i want to place a platform and dont care about, but i have to, first i have to place a bp with the foundation+storages and after that the real bp

so requesting only the stuff it can build (and foundations are always buildable) would be nice (ofc if there are turrets ammo should be piped too)
another option would be to NOT auto request stuff if there is already a rocket size stack of it present at the storage, the platform doesnt have to gather 2k belts first and block the storage if it cant even place 100

If you have turrets with ammo in the ghost then ammo only gets requested once the turret is build. Before that it isn't requested from the construction area so it doesn't register with the space platform hub.

All ghosts should be that way, even on planets. If the ghost can't be build due to missing tiles (scaffolding, landfill, artificial soil, even just a tree in the way) it shouldn't be requested at all. The construction bots holding something and hovering above a ghost unable to place the entity are annoying.

[IsaacOscar]

If you have turrets with ammo in the ghost then ammo only gets requested once the turret is build. Before that it isn't requested from the construction area so it doesn't register with the space platform hub.

All ghosts should be that way, even on planets. If the ghost can't be build due to missing tiles (scaffolding, landfill, artificial soil, even just a tree in the way) it shouldn't be requested at all. The construction bots holding something and hovering above a ghost unable to place the entity are annoying.

Sure, however:

1. It makes ir much harder to know how many items you need to satisfy all the ghosts (I often build ghosts before I make the materials)
2. More importantly, space platforms don't have bots, so the extra stuff will just be waiting in the cargo hold.
3. it costs a lot of resources and time to send up a rocket, so it would be good to do this in parallel with the construction of the containing ghost

[mrvn]

If you have turrets with ammo in the ghost then ammo only gets requested once the turret is build. Before that it isn't requested from the construction area so it doesn't register with the space platform hub.

All ghosts should be that way, even on planets. If the ghost can't be build due to missing tiles (scaffolding, landfill, artificial soil, even just a tree in the way) it shouldn't be requested at all. The construction bots holding something and hovering above a ghost unable to place the entity are annoying.

Sure, however:

1. It makes ir much harder to know how many items you need to satisfy all the ghosts (I often build ghosts before I make the materials)
2. More importantly, space platforms don't have bots, so the extra stuff will just be waiting in the cargo hold.
3. it costs a lot of resources and time to send up a rocket, so it would be good to do this in parallel with the construction of the containing ghost

I've never had the problem that rockets are sitting idle on the pads during construction. As soon as a rocket sends up something it gets build way faster than the animation of the next rocket rising plays out. By the time the next rocket is ready the ammo for any turret will be requested and send then. And it always sends a rocket full of the same item. So if just one turret gets build then one rocket full of ammo is send. All further turrets get to share the ammo till it runs out and then the next rocket will bring more. There really is no delay there.

The problem in this thread is that too much stuff gets send up so the hub inventory overflows and then foundation can't be send up to actually build any of the platform at all. You actually then have to send stuff back down to have space for some foundation to resolve the deadlock.

It would make a difference if you could read requests, build the needed material and send up mixed rockets. But you can do neither with the current system. If you don't have the ammo already build the platform will simply not request it at all and a mixed rocket doesn't launch automatically.