Limit the new quality mechanic to modules

[spaghetsie]

TL;DR

The quality mechanic seems like the perfect fit to replace module tiers.

What ?

Instead of having 3 tiers of modules, there would be a single module for each type (production, speed, efficiency). And their bonus would be determined by the quality system.

Why ?

Currently, a lot of people seem dissatisfied, even angry at the idea of every item having a quality rating. Most common reasons being:

• Item clutter; from storage to inventory space to machines clogging up waiting for multiple legendary items to stack up
• The gacha element doesn't feel factorio-ey

(I elaborate on these and more here)

And the biggest argument pro quality is:

• It's something different to fully beaconing with T3 speed modules

My proposal still addresses the T3 module issue, while also removing the clutter caused by qualities of normal items. Replacing modules with better ones is also way more convenient than rebuilding whole setups with better buildings.

[Zaflis]

So it has been a week, maybe now you have read more about the topic to understand how it works? Because this topic is meaningless and wrong in so many ways.

I guess the biggest confusion with some people is that they think they start seeing quality items everywhere in their factory from smelting to green circuits etc... Quality modules are still inefficient in the whole science production chain compared to speed beacons and productivity modules. You won't have quality items in your inventory and there is no issue in them clogging the machines when you do proper sorting, in the few places where they are used.

[aka13]

So it has been a week, maybe now you have read more about the topic to understand how it works? Because this topic is meaningless and wrong in so many ways.

I guess the biggest confusion with some people is that they think they start seeing quality items everywhere in their factory from smelting to green circuits etc... Quality modules are still inefficient in the whole science production chain compared to speed beacons and productivity modules. You won't have quality items in your inventory and there is no issue in them clogging the machines when you do proper sorting, in the few places where they are used.

It's gold commenting on something with "you don't understand" without understanding, what has been said.

[Zaflis]

It's gold commenting on something with "you don't understand" without understanding, what has been said.

There's nothing to misunderstand, read his "Why" section.

If i clarify, i haven't read any "rational" argument to be dissatisfied with the quality feature. The whole "a lot of people seem dissatisfied" doesn't represent those who have actually read and digested everything the new feature contains. There is nothing wrong with it to fix.

[mmmPI]

1) You say transporting mixed qualities is going to probably be necessary because you can't unsmelt plate, this is not correct conclusion. You can still make basic ammo and recycle them to increase the quality of iron plate, or do the same process with copper wire. No need to unsmelt plate whatsoever.
You also can't put quality modules in furnaces, and don't get quality items if you don't use quality modules. At this point your argument against inventory clutter even if true, i think is more to put on your inability to organize things /misunderstanding of the feature given what are your example of it.

2) It was said that liquid can't have quality and can't get recovered by recycler. What's even your point with liquid ? There are informations you don't have so the point isn't argumented it's just written there as a point that shows what ?

3) You are afraid people are going to misuse something ,therefore that thing should be changed but you have no proposition for it ? i mean in your reddit post, i don't think it make sense to apply quality just to module as a big part of what's good in quality is the bonus applied to the many entities, like larger radius power pole or robotport faster inserter , more powerful nuclear reactor, mining drill that deplete less the ressources. Which obviously wouldn't be there if quality was limited to module. Also no guarantee people won't misused your proposition and go for a all or nothing situation with module quaity, your proposition on the forum doesn't adress the point you make on reddit.

4) I have no idea why you think people would do what you think is a good solution. You don't expect people to come up with many different possiblities ? You think the feature is not good because you think of 1 way of using it that is not fun ? I don't think the point is valid ,i think you are just not seeing the whole picturs, and from limited informations you draw erroneous conclusions. As from the same pieces of informations there are many ideas that comes to my mind, that i find fun to try. Also at this point your point 4 is the opposite as your point 1, where you started saying "transporting mixed quality will probably be necessary", and your conclusion is " players will all only belt the max quality".

My proposal still addresses the T3 module issue, while also removing the clutter caused by qualities of normal items. Replacing modules with better ones is also way more convenient than rebuilding whole setups with better buildings.

The T3 module issue ? what's that ?
Replacing modules with better ones is also possible with quality feature you don't have to rebuild your whole setup if you don't want to but you could with the proposed quality feature, win-win, whereas your proposition is limited as compared to the current game it wouldn't add anything, sure you'd have several tier of module, that you can switch in your existing build, yay, that's the same as now.

Another good point about quality that you seem to have missed because your proposition doesn't adress it is when you have the currently maxed out setup in factorio; assembler tier 3 full productivity or speed module, surrounded by beacon. The quality feature introduce a new choice to the player, do you want to use the quality feature to upgrade the furnaces ? the modules in the furnaces ? the beacons ? the modules in the beacons ? or not use quality and duplicate more of what you already have. Maybe it makes a lot of options and it's difficult to predict what players will do but that also gives a lot of options to have fun, to try and fiddle with for the player. Whereas your proposition would be of very limited value in my eyes, as there would be no question, and only the quality of the module would be to upgrade since you removed most of the good stuff from the quality feature.

Currently a lot of people seem satisfied with the quality feature

A lot of people seem satisfied too though, and when reading the reasons why, many of the disatisfied people shows lack of understanding.


Edit; sorry if the tone feels abrupt, i took time to adress each point because i recognized the attempt making constructive critism, but unfortunatly i reading it again my answers doesn't show such appreciation.

[aka13]

It's gold commenting on something with "you don't understand" without understanding, what has been said.

There's nothing to misunderstand, read his "Why" section.

If i clarify, i haven't read any "rational" argument to be dissatisfied with the quality feature. The whole "a lot of people seem dissatisfied" doesn't represent those who have actually read and digested everything the new feature contains. There is nothing wrong with it to fix.

I don't see how his why section invalidates what he suggests. I think it would be interesting to have the tier 1-3 to be removed in favor of quality, if quality is to be introduced.
I'd go as far as to say that the yellow-blue-green inserter progression and the assembly machines might go as well.

If the "quality enrichment" loops will be a thing, current "improvements" to inserters and assembly machines seem rudimentary.
I mean, we already have only one tier on every other machine, that is "younger", like the chemplants and refineries.

I also don't see why this thread has again to be flooded with like-dislike of quality.

[Zaflis]

I don't see how his why section invalidates what he suggests. I think it would be interesting to have the tier 1-3 to be removed in favor of quality, if quality is to be introduced.
I'd go as far as to say that the yellow-blue-green inserter progression and the assembly machines might go as well.

If the "quality enrichment" loops will be a thing, current "improvements" to inserters and assembly machines seem rudimentary.
I mean, we already have only one tier on every other machine, that is "younger", like the chemplants and refineries.

That would really enforce everyone to use the quality modules. It's an endgame thing primarily and not everyone is that technical minded to get into the complex sorting game. I feel it's fine that there are also simpler tiers of modules. You can extrapolate that even further that there could only be 1 modular armor, and quality 5 one would replace that much improved power armor mk2. In the end it's not the same thing though, it would feel like things were taken away from the game. It would reduce player's options.

Also if one disables the quality mod, then they would have no access to the higher tier items anymore?