[0.12.x][v0.12.10] Bob's Logistics mod

[orzelek]

Are the stack inserters still in your mods? Or, did they get removed ?

The new stack inserters added in 0.13 are untouched by my mods.

Would you consider removing Electronic circuit board from stack inserter recipe?
Considering how hard they are to get in electronics mod it will take very long to actually use a stack inserter.

[British_Petroleum]

Would you consider removing Electronic circuit board from stack inserter recipe?
Considering how hard they are to get in electronics mod it will take very long to actually use a stack inserter.

I'm surprised they don't require a higher level circuit board.

[orzelek]

Would you consider removing Electronic circuit board from stack inserter recipe?
Considering how hard they are to get in electronics mod it will take very long to actually use a stack inserter.

I'm surprised they don't require a higher level circuit board.

It depends on their role.
With current state they are mid game toy. If you add higher tier board they will be to late to mean much unless you are going for megabase with 10's or more rocket launches.
Might be my play style - using research extending mods (would be similar with marathon) makes some things that are usually "granted" move into mid-late game or even end game.

[Nexela]

Have you given any thought to changing your inserters code to something like this work of art from GotLAg? https://mods.factorio.com/mods/GotLag/Side%20Inserters

I was playing around with it and it would clear up a lot of inserter items as you would not need 2 slightly different copies of each since both the pickup arm is rotatable and the extension can be adjusted from near side to far side.


Would clear up the inserter list too just these.
burner inserter (base)
long handed burner (bobs)
inserter (base)

fast (base)
fast standard - Long (bobs)
fast long - Standard (bobs)
stack (base)
stack filter (base)
filter (base)

And Express Versions

You could also add configs to enable or disable rotation

[bobingabout]

I had no idea you could modify the hand pickup/drop positions on the fly.

[Nexela]

I didn't either until I got bored and started browsing other peoples code I even made a few alterations to it to work on having long inserters switch to a long in standard out set up.

[orzelek]

I had no idea you could modify the hand pickup/drop positions on the fly.

It's a recent feature that was added in 0.13.
And after playing with Side Inserters mod I think it's the way to go currently. You don't need that many inserter items anymore.

[iamwyza]

I had no idea you could modify the hand pickup/drop positions on the fly.

This would be glorious.

[bobingabout]

My question though is with blueprints.

Although we can configure the inserters, I have a suspicion that any inserters placed via a blueprint will take on their default properties, rendering this whole thing pointless.

If I am wrong, and they keep their configuration when copied via a blueprint, then I may just implement something like this myself.

Perhaps (if I can figure out how to lay it all out properly) some sort of GUI where you can configure the input and output positions.
Assuming output faces north, the input would be in terms of tile, to the east, south and west, 1, 2, or maybe even 3 tiles away. And the output would be in terms of not only tile, 1, 2 or 3 tiles away, but also which side of a belt to place it on. (Near or Far)

I could go do a whole grid, but... it complicates things. Like is the far side of the belt on the north, or is it on the east, west, or if you choose a southern orientation, is it even no the south side? Okay, maybe it could be viable to make a grid for the input position, but output would have to be limited to directly in front of the inserter, it's just a case of how far.

I also like the idea of being able to pick up and place on the same side actually, to do what I'd call a shuffle inserter, pick up from 1 tile in front, place 2 tiles in front, or vica verca.


Of course, this is just an idea of what could be possible, I'm not currently planning it at all, and if I do or not depends entirely on if it's blueprint friendly.

[Nexela]

My question though is with blueprints.

Although we can configure the inserters, I have a suspicion that any inserters placed via a blueprint will take on their default properties, rendering this whole thing pointless.

Blueprinted inserters that are changed paste correctly .
The only slight draw back I have seen is from copying and pasting. (shift - left click, shift - right click) Is it also copies the positions of the arms.

Perhaps (if I can figure out how to lay it all out properly) some sort of GUI where you can configure the input and output positions.
Assuming output faces north, the input would be in terms of tile, to the east, south and west, 1, 2, or maybe even 3 tiles away. And the output would be in terms of not only tile, 1, 2 or 3 tiles away, but also which side of a belt to place it on. (Near or Far)

I could go do a whole grid, but... it complicates things. Like is the far side of the belt on the north, or is it on the east, west, or if you choose a southern orientation, is it even no the south side? Okay, maybe it could be viable to make a grid for the input position, but output would have to be limited to directly in front of the inserter, it's just a case of how far.

I also like the idea of being able to pick up and place on the same side actually, to do what I'd call a shuffle inserter, pick up from 1 tile in front, place 2 tiles in front, or vica verca.

Take a look at Cursed Programmable Inserters mod for this kind of setup... I think it over complicates things though. the Way GotLag has his is a lot simpler and more intuitive. I just shift-n on the inserter to change from near to far and shift-r to rotate the arm.

[edit] Also with Cursed PI each other mods have to add their inserters. Where as GotLag's version works with other mods by just using the inserters type.
[edit 2] You can also remove the Side inserters mod and inserters keep their positions.

[bobingabout]

If I were to implement something, I guess it would be closer to Cursed's method. I'll have to try them both out. Perhaps it's possible for a hotkey to be assigned to open the GUI, would that simplify things?

[iamwyza]

If I were to implement something, I guess it would be closer to Cursed's method. I'll have to try them both out. Perhaps it's possible for a hotkey to be assigned to open the GUI, would that simplify things?

Personally I'd think to just add an icon in the upper left hand corner similar to how the circuit network icon shows up when you click on an inserter now. A hotkey could be nice as well so that keyboard folks can use those and mouse folks can use the icon.

It'd also be nice to be able to shift-right and shift-left click one inserter to copy/paste the settings like you do with assemblers and filter inserters.

Extra bonus points for being able to configure the inserter based on circuit network conditions. (though I'd rather just the basic above functionality be in there first)

[orzelek]

Cursed mod was created earlier so it didn't have access to current functionality in game that made Side Inserters possible.
It would be possible to make GUI and result would be to change inserter positions.

From my point GUI is more cumbersome then hotkeys and so I prefer way with hotkeys.

[Arch666Angel]

Cursed mod was created earlier so it didn't have access to current functionality in game that made Side Inserters possible.
It would be possible to make GUI and result would be to change inserter positions.

From my point GUI is more cumbersome then hotkeys and so I prefer way with hotkeys.

The most complete implementation up until 0.13 was the K&L inserter mod which had a gui to create every possible combination of inserter, haven't checked out GotLags new SideInserters though

[orzelek]

Cursed mod was created earlier so it didn't have access to current functionality in game that made Side Inserters possible.
It would be possible to make GUI and result would be to change inserter positions.

From my point GUI is more cumbersome then hotkeys and so I prefer way with hotkeys.

The most complete implementation up until 0.13 was the K&L inserter mod which had a gui to create every possible combination of inserter, haven't checked out GotLags new SideInserters though

Do try they are cool And work on all bob's inserters and you also don't need to make any special near versions anymore.
Never used K&L - to much GUI for mass placement and it had issues with blueprinting I think.

[Nexela]

I see no problem with using a cursed pi like setup BUT I *personaly* wouldnt want to use a GUI which is why I don't use Cursed or K-S also think being able to set every single direction including diags would ruin the bob's mods gameplay which until the endgame is not badly balanced.

Honestly I even think Side Inserters are just a little over powered but with many of the higher tier bobs mod stuff having an inserter that can rotate two extra directions would make for a LOT neater factories. and the ease of use for setting near-far side also helps. Also don't forget if you implement something like this I hope you go the route that supports new modded inserters by default.

Also I vote for a dumb fast inserter and dumb express inserter to be added into the mod, by dumb I mean doesn't have stack bonus I will actually work on a personal mod to turn off stack bonus on reg inserters and burners. (or a bob logistics extension mod that does that)

[Lukas0120]

plase add stack inserters becouse I don't know any mod that adds very fast/express stack inserters
I don't need programmeble Inserters or somthing like that I only want diffrent version of stack inserters including very fast /express versions

[bobingabout]

Since I am likely going to remove a lot of my special inserters in favour of programmable ones, I can probably add in new stack versions.

as for configuration... I could probably have multiple shortcut keys, one that brings up the GUI, and others like the shift + R, Shift + N like Gotlag's side inserters.

I'm also thinking if I can have researchable technologies that open up more options, such as an unlock that lets you do diagonals, another that lets you do near side, and another that lets you do long, or extra long combinations.

Near side is also objective, as mentioned before, if you move the placement position to the right hand side... is near the upper side, or lower side of the belt? does it need to rotate the far and near sides so they're left and right? This is why a GUI is more useful, it lets you see exactly what it's doing while you're setting it up, at the very least, give you more options.

I mean, if you allow diagonals, there are 8 pick up positions with a 1 reach, (if you assume the placement isn't in this range), but there are 16 pick up positions for 2 tiles away. do I just cycle through all of them? I would likely add an extra shortcut key to toggle long/short on the pickup position too.


I think at least I should still keep 2 different types of express inserter. The standard express inserter, and the long express, the long being able to be programmed with the more advanced options (even to serve the function of a standard express inserter if configured to do so), while the standard only had the 7 rotations (minus the 8th for drop) with near far. Now while N can toggle through near, standard, far and long (I can finally drop those names by the way), we'd probably want a button to toggle more than just direction for the pickup, a separate button for range. Perhaps Shift + L?

And then have something like SHIFT + P (for program) for the GUI?

I'm just rambling as I think here, what do you think?

[orzelek]

I'd assume that would be a separate mod also?
And honestly I'm not sure about duplicating functionality of Side Inserters - it's not needed really.
Separate mod for GUI and it's settings would be a nice addition especially if it would support strange inserter variants - for those situations where you really need to move that item 2 tiles left and 1 down
Additional research to unlock stuff there would be nice gating mechanics (and another thing to spend lots of resources on).

[iamwyza]

This is based on a previous post here. "Smart" means you can change the arm behavior. This takes us down from...30 (?) inserters to 10 (or 12 if you do express stack).

burner inserter (base)
long handed burner (bobs)
inserter (base)

fast smart/filter (bobs) (replace fast with fast smart/filter)
fast long/smart/filter (bobs) - Technically you could make it long using the fast smart, but this one defaults to long to help simplify building.
stack (base)
stack filter (base)
filter (base)

Express Smart/Filter (bobs)
Express Long/Smart/Filter (bobs)

Are these necessary? IDK...
Express Stack Smart/Filter (bobs)
Express Stack Long Smart/Filter (bobs)