[0.15.x] Bob's Mods: General Discussion

[jodokus31]

So, this seems like a stupid question in the midst of the highly detailed and technical mod discussion taking place...but my searches haven't resulted in helping with what I'm looking for.

First, Bob and Angel's mods are amazing. I can't play Factorio without them and I really enjoy the complexity of using them together. My only issue at the moment is that I feel like I'm jumping through hoops with Angel's refining to avoid producing raw nickel ore. Besides complimenting a few higher tier recipes, what is nickel used for? I feel like I'm missing something due to the high quantity of nickel the early-mid game produces as a side product.

I think, the question would have been better located to angels forum thread.
Nickel ore is only a side product in Angels refining, if you use the single (crushed, chunk, etc.) to many ore sorting. There are other sorting recipes, which takes many (crushed, chunk, etc.) to produce a dedicated ore. First type of sorting is used for kickstarting some processes, but for long-term the second variant is really more usefull.
Nickel is also used in invar and nitinol, and catalysts, but its more mid to end game.

[chadsteam]

So, this seems like a stupid question in the midst of the highly detailed and technical mod discussion taking place...but my searches haven't resulted in helping with what I'm looking for.

First, Bob and Angel's mods are amazing. I can't play Factorio without them and I really enjoy the complexity of using them together. My only issue at the moment is that I feel like I'm jumping through hoops with Angel's refining to avoid producing raw nickel ore. Besides complimenting a few higher tier recipes, what is nickel used for? I feel like I'm missing something due to the high quantity of nickel the early-mid game produces as a side product.

I think, the question would have been better located to angels forum thread.
Nickel ore is only a side product in Angels refining, if you use the single (crushed, chunk, etc.) to many ore sorting. There are other sorting recipes, which takes many (crushed, chunk, etc.) to produce a dedicated ore. First type of sorting is used for kickstarting some processes, but for long-term the second variant is really more usefull.
Nickel is also used in invar and nitinol, and catalysts, but its more mid to end game.

Yes, I had thought about that, but felt this was the better forum for a few reasons. Bob's Mods introduced nickel ore and the stand alone still produces excessive nickel when mined with the "galena ore" in the early-mid game (unless you simply turn of nickel, which never made sense to me as Bob introduced it as a dual ore). Angel's lower tier refining appears to me to remain true to Bob's mods in its production of ores and I didn't think that Angel's mods are alone producing vast quantities of nickel. In addition, the meat of these mods is in the many complex recipes Bob introduces in the way of circuits, science packs, defense/armor, etc. Angel's mods are more focused on realistic refining of ores, oils, and gases, what I would consider materials not end products.

I still have the same question without Angel's mods...am I missing something or is nickel simply an ore you put in a void chest until needed late game?

[laku]

tl;dr sry
you should have a look at the laser rifel upgrades. you need blue science to get them, for the acctual tech you only need military (+red&green) and for the first upgrades you only need red science. that seems to be the wrong way around

[bobingabout]

the science pack costs for each research are based on the costs of other weapons to upgrade. Since it costs Science pack 3 to get it, that means the first few upgrades are easy street! (Basically, the laser rifle with no research is balanced to the other weapons with no research, so you need to do all these firepower upgrades to re-balance it to be similar to the weapons you already have)

As for Nickel, the only "Early game" use for it is Invar, and that's what I'd call tier 2 level(Same as steel). Tungsten (unless angel changed it) then uses nickel at tier 4, and Nitinol at Tier 5. it is rarely used as a pure metal (Though there are a couple of examples if you really look)

[jodokus31]

Yes, I had thought about that, but felt this was the better forum for a few reasons. Bob's Mods introduced nickel ore and the stand alone still produces excessive nickel when mined with the "galena ore" in the early-mid game (unless you simply turn of nickel, which never made sense to me as Bob introduced it as a dual ore). Angel's lower tier refining appears to me to remain true to Bob's mods in its production of ores and I didn't think that Angel's mods are alone producing vast quantities of nickel. In addition, the meat of these mods is in the many complex recipes Bob introduces in the way of circuits, science packs, defense/armor, etc. Angel's mods are more focused on realistic refining of ores, oils, and gases, what I would consider materials not end products.

I still have the same question without Angel's mods...am I missing something or is nickel simply an ore you put in a void chest until needed late game?

Ok, sorry. I just thought, you are using those angels ores (sapharite, etc.). It never happened to me, that I have those bobs ore mines on the maps, if i use bobs & angels mod. So i cannot really tell, whats going on there. I wonder, which constellation of bobs and angels mods (esp. incl. angels refinining) have only bobs ores?

[mrvn]

Yes, I had thought about that, but felt this was the better forum for a few reasons. Bob's Mods introduced nickel ore and the stand alone still produces excessive nickel when mined with the "galena ore" in the early-mid game (unless you simply turn of nickel, which never made sense to me as Bob introduced it as a dual ore). Angel's lower tier refining appears to me to remain true to Bob's mods in its production of ores and I didn't think that Angel's mods are alone producing vast quantities of nickel. In addition, the meat of these mods is in the many complex recipes Bob introduces in the way of circuits, science packs, defense/armor, etc. Angel's mods are more focused on realistic refining of ores, oils, and gases, what I would consider materials not end products.

I still have the same question without Angel's mods...am I missing something or is nickel simply an ore you put in a void chest until needed late game?

Ok, sorry. I just thought, you are using those angels ores (sapharite, etc.). It never happened to me, that I have those bobs ore mines on the maps, if i use bobs & angels mod. So i cannot really tell, whats going on there. I wonder, which constellation of bobs and angels mods (esp. incl. angels refinining) have only bobs ores?

If you leave out Angels infinite ores then you skip all the ore crushing and work with bobs ores exclusively.

[chadsteam]

As for Nickel, the only "Early game" use for it is Invar, and that's what I'd call tier 2 level(Same as steel). Tungsten (unless angel changed it) then uses nickel at tier 4, and Nitinol at Tier 5. it is rarely used as a pure metal (Though there are a couple of examples if you really look)

Thanks for responding bobbingabout. I appreciate all the great work you do on your mods. It's forever changed the way I play Factorio.

I did do a bit of searching for how nickel is used today...besides currency, it seems to be predominantly used in different forms of batteries (however, Lithium is now dominating that market) and in stainless steel and other alloys. But none of the examples I found would enhance Factorio in any meaningful or fun way.

Bob's mods creates such a massive list of recipes in the tech tree, sometimes it's easy to overlook a specific ingredient until you realize you need something you haven't been stockpiling. So I've gotten into the habit of saving everything I'm not currently using, but that can sometimes jam up the flow of the factory.

[asw122]

Hi guys,

Quick question. I'm getting back into Factorio while I recover from being ill.

Historically I've never really made any train networks (just simple A->B->A ones). As I've got a bit of time on my hands, I thought I'd set up something a bit more complex and self-repairing.

So I built myself up some loco's and for the first time ever I actually tried to use a vehicle roboport. Problem is that when I go to insert it into an MK1 Locomotive, it won't insert. I've been able to insert solar panels and batteries. I've checked that I've definitely picked up a vehicle port rather than a personal, and there's space in the grid, but for some reason when I try to add to the grid, its red and won't insert.

I'm hoping that this is just my sick-addled brain missing something, but if not, I can pull screenshots out easily enough.

Thanks

[orzelek]

Hi guys,

Quick question. I'm getting back into Factorio while I recover from being ill.

Historically I've never really made any train networks (just simple A->B->A ones). As I've got a bit of time on my hands, I thought I'd set up something a bit more complex and self-repairing.

So I built myself up some loco's and for the first time ever I actually tried to use a vehicle roboport. Problem is that when I go to insert it into an MK1 Locomotive, it won't insert. I've been able to insert solar panels and batteries. I've checked that I've definitely picked up a vehicle port rather than a personal, and there's space in the grid, but for some reason when I try to add to the grid, its red and won't insert.

I'm hoping that this is just my sick-addled brain missing something, but if not, I can pull screenshots out easily enough.

Thanks

I think thats one of game limitations.
Locos have only fuel inventory and no normal inventory that roboport needs to work. You will need to use cargo wagon for that.

[asw122]

Hi guys,

Quick question. I'm getting back into Factorio while I recover from being ill.

Historically I've never really made any train networks (just simple A->B->A ones). As I've got a bit of time on my hands, I thought I'd set up something a bit more complex and self-repairing.

So I built myself up some loco's and for the first time ever I actually tried to use a vehicle roboport. Problem is that when I go to insert it into an MK1 Locomotive, it won't insert. I've been able to insert solar panels and batteries. I've checked that I've definitely picked up a vehicle port rather than a personal, and there's space in the grid, but for some reason when I try to add to the grid, its red and won't insert.

I'm hoping that this is just my sick-addled brain missing something, but if not, I can pull screenshots out easily enough.

Thanks

I think thats one of game limitations.
Locos have only fuel inventory and no normal inventory that roboport needs to work. You will need to use cargo wagon for that.

Thanks, never thought of that. Knew it would be my sick-addled brain.

[bobingabout]

If you use my mods, the vehicle grid requires special vehicle equipment (Available in the vehicle equipment grid mod)

On that note though, you can't put a roboport in a locomotive, because it has no inventory (and therefore can't hold robots, or repairpacks, or materials for construction etc.)(Which was answered already, I know)

[Recon777]

Is there any plan on making Bronze more used? Yes, it's used in the blue science packs, but that's quite nearly all. Kind of a weird alloy that might do better either applied to more things or cut from the game and replaced with another alloy.

[foodfactorio]

hi, for Chadsteam, have a quick look here at my post with screenshot for you:
viewtopic.php?f=185&t=51225&p=300866#p300746

this just shows that Nickel is very very useful for storage (including invar), especially as you mentioned you would like to store everything up so as not to waste anything... that is exactly what i tried my best to do, as can be seen with all the storage silos

if you want to see more storage, just check out my cascascading warehouses Lol (cool for storing all the Bob and Angel goodies plus honey from the Bee mod)
viewtopic.php?f=97&t=34176&start=20#p294780 (a few pictures down)

(actually that gives me an idea for a mod request... for a way to make a Logistic''s robot, move 1 stack of items, from one warehouse, if the stack is stuck at a low value, and not changing, and to move it to another warehouse or two, that are already also having a low number - essentially freeing up a stack slot, to make the warehouse more effficient)

[Recon777]

Does anyone use the vanilla coal liquefaction recipe, considering the availability to make heavy oil from coal in the chemical plant?
Coal liquefaction is a much more complex process, and it produces far less product than the simple heavy oil recipe. Wondering about the balance here. Pretty much anywhere I need lubricant, I just ship in coal locally and slap down a couple chemical plants and a water line, and I get all the lubricant I need with no byproduct.

[bobingabout]

Is there any plan on making Bronze more used? Yes, it's used in the blue science packs, but that's quite nearly all. Kind of a weird alloy that might do better either applied to more things or cut from the game and replaced with another alloy.

Bronze in itself is just a gateway resource. Gunmetal is basically a bronze brass hybrid. The tech level on that side is...
Copper -> Bronze -> Brass -> Gunmetal.

Today, very few things are actually made of Bronze, it's all just copper, or brass/gunmetal.

One of the other problems in why it's not used very much is... most of the areas where you might consider using such a thing, you already have more appropriate metals like iron available. (Look back in history, most things that Bronze used to be used for started to be made from iron when people learned how to smelt it.)

[Recon777]

Right, which is why I'm thinking maybe it doesn't need to be in the game at all. You don't have to go through bronze to get to brass (or gunmetal) in the mod. Apart from the blue science packs, nothing at all is going to need large quantities of it. [shrug]

[bobingabout]

Right, which is why I'm thinking maybe it doesn't need to be in the game at all. You don't have to go through bronze to get to brass (or gunmetal) in the mod. Apart from the blue science packs, nothing at all is going to need large quantities of it. [shrug]

That's one of the reasons why I added it to blue science. You should already be moving a fair bit of copper, and tin in the form of solder, adding in a step to mix the two together isn't such a bad idea as a research requirement.

To note: the alloy is unlocked at the same time as solder.

I could remove it, but then it will leave a gap in those places where it is used.

[Air]

How about using phosphor bronze in module contacts and requiring contacts instead of bronze plate in the blue science?

[chadsteam]

hi, for Chadsteam, have a quick look here at my post with screenshot for you:
viewtopic.php?f=185&t=51225&p=300866#p300746

Thanks!

[doppelEben]

Hey there
I‘m using almost all bob‘s and angels mods in 0.15; but I‘m kinda stuck somewhat between early and mid-game.
Really try to understand the whole oil and gas process; figured out parts of it; but I miss a manual-like thing.
Where is the most efficient source for the functions and processes for both of them (or mixed/hooked together) is there a wiki?
f.E.: I managed to generate fuel blocks with cracked oil - but how could that now be an alternate fuel, if I still need coal in the process? Sure; 12MJ(fuel) vs 2.5MJ(crushed) vs 2MJ(coal) - but I play on a map with low amount of coal - tried to force me into the oil/gas thing; and I just ran out of coal. I‘m importing coal through outpost (had to search like 1-2 hours for another coal spot - but I think there should be another solution. (saw the fluid fuel f.E. but cant figure out if theres a way to use this in boilers).

On nearly everything I try to create - lets say sulfur acid this time - I get stuck in 2 or 3 stations behind coz I dont find the right way to create the needings of the needings recipe. yay my english rocks -.-‚

Or the whole construction-vehicle-thingy. Oo.

I really like the complexity and brainfuck-touch this both overhauls create - but I need more info :O

What am I missing or doing wrong?