Friday Facts #356 - Blueprint library for real

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irbork
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Re: Friday Facts #356 - Blueprint library for real

Post by irbork »

Love the new blueprint and library changes. As soon as they get released Factorio is officially gold worthy game!

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Re: Friday Facts #356 - Blueprint library for real

Post by CrushedIce »

eradicator wrote:
Sat Jul 18, 2020 5:02 pm
kovarex wrote:
Fri Jul 17, 2020 11:49 pm
Thanks for recommendations. Btw, you probably missed this http://kovarex.com/2048/ :)
I find the crafting recipe for research labs to be a bit convoluted ;p.
Can somebody bet more? :D
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Re: Friday Facts #356 - Blueprint library for real

Post by Illiou »

CrushedIce wrote:
Fri Jul 24, 2020 9:43 am
eradicator wrote:
Sat Jul 18, 2020 5:02 pm
kovarex wrote:
Fri Jul 17, 2020 11:49 pm
Thanks for recommendations. Btw, you probably missed this http://kovarex.com/2048/ :)
I find the crafting recipe for research labs to be a bit convoluted ;p.
Can somebody bet more? :D
Done :P
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Re: Friday Facts #356 - Blueprint library for real

Post by LuxSublima »

Kovarex, thank you for sharing such detail about burnout depression. I've struggled with that myself recently and its very helpful to read not only an account of how it feels but how you started coming out of it. And I think it's beautiful that playing with your son was part of that recovery.

Just another reason you and your company are my favorite developers by far. :) Be well.

Edit: also wanted to add - you've been at this for so many years, I think burnout is very human and understandable. Very wise to pick the upcoming 1.0 release date and stick to it. Congratulations for making what is already an incredible game.

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Re: Friday Facts #356 - Blueprint library for real

Post by Cheetah »

Thank you for being so candid and sharing the story of your burnout and depression.

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Re: Friday Facts #356 - Blueprint library for real

Post by azesmbog »

[/quote]

Can somebody bet more? :D
[/quote]
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Re: Friday Facts #356 - Blueprint library for real

Post by Kiwidude »

I have seen surprisingly little discussion about the actual blueprint changes in this thread. Is that because until they are released it cannot be determined if the changes fix the fundamental problems of the existing blueprint UI or not?

I am a total newcomer to the game, have been using 0.18.x. I have been watching numerous YT videos of players who have many hundreds/thousands of hours with the game and seeing the struggles that even they have with the awful clunkiness that is blueprint library management. To the point where I have been too intimidated to even bother attempting to use them myself. If these players who have been playing for years continually struggle from video to video with losing blueprints, accidentally deleting them, having to repeat certain steps over and over in just the right sequence of actions and places in inventory/slots and wherever else trying to make them work what hope is there for the newbies like myself?

It is probably the most disappointing feature of the game to me and don't the experience others here have to know if the changes are a big enough overhaul or just addresses different issues?

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Re: Friday Facts #356 - Blueprint library for real

Post by Raiguard »

Kiwidude wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 10:40 am
I have seen surprisingly little discussion about the actual blueprint changes in this thread. Is that because until they are released it cannot be determined if the changes fix the fundamental problems of the existing blueprint UI or not?

I am a total newcomer to the game, have been using 0.18.x. I have been watching numerous YT videos of players who have many hundreds/thousands of hours with the game and seeing the struggles that even they have with the awful clunkiness that is blueprint library management. To the point where I have been too intimidated to even bother attempting to use them myself. If these players who have been playing for years continually struggle from video to video with losing blueprints, accidentally deleting them, having to repeat certain steps over and over in just the right sequence of actions and places in inventory/slots and wherever else trying to make them work what hope is there for the newbies like myself?

It is probably the most disappointing feature of the game to me and don't the experience others here have to know if the changes are a big enough overhaul or just addresses different issues?
I have over 1500 hours of playtime (and another 1000 hours of modding experience) and while I always though the blueprint library was clunky, it was never "broken" per se. The biggest thing wrong with it was that the game blueprints section didn't let you save empty blueprint books, but that has now been fixed.

The new library fixes most, if not all, of the problems of blueprint management. You can nest blueprint books now, you can store upgrade and deconstruction planners as well, and most importantly, the interaction has been reworked to be identical to standard inventories.

It's not that hard to use at all, I'm not sure what "struggles" the YouTubers you watched were having.
Don't forget, you're here forever.

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Re: Friday Facts #356 - Blueprint library for real

Post by DanGio »

Kiwidude wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 10:40 am
I have seen surprisingly little discussion about the actual blueprint changes in this thread.
This update changes a LOT of things, and people need to learn the new way of doing stuff. I think people are just "wise" and think "let's try it fo a few weeks and then send feedback".

The good thing for you is, maybe now is the best time to try it out, as this is much likely the ultimate "blueprint library user experience". So you don't need to worry about things changing completely someday. Or wait for 1.0... Just a matter of days.

EDIT : also, no feedback means, for many players : "I'm perfectly fine with the changes" ;)

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Re: Friday Facts #356 - Blueprint library for real

Post by Kiwidude »

Thanks folks for the replies, ok that sounds a little more promising. It was a little disheartening to see episode after episode from multiple series of very experienced players losing blueprints, then go reading in the comments section of the videos and read others saying they make backups after their sessions etc. Or see them spend far too many minutes trying over and over to just update one small aspect of a blueprint. The whole hierarchy of interactions of inventory slots and books and hotbars and special click/key combinations seems to be less than ideal shall we say.

Don't get me wrong,there is a lot to like about this game which is why I want to invest a lot more time in it for replayability which is where blueprints will come in. But from the videos I have seen to date they appear to have some very rough edges....

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Re: Friday Facts #356 - Blueprint library for real

Post by Notxarb »

Looks great!

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Re: Friday Facts #356 - Blueprint library for real

Post by valneq »

I was playing around with the new blueprint features. I love it ^^ Thanks @Wube

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Re: Friday Facts #356 - Blueprint library for real

Post by kovarex »

Raiguard wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 3:58 pm
The new library fixes most, if not all, of the problems of blueprint management. You can nest blueprint books now, you can store upgrade and deconstruction planners as well, and most importantly, the interaction has been reworked to be identical to standard inventories.
You can even setup an empty blueprints by holding a book with them. So you hold a book with few empty blueprints, setup first, confirm, shift-wheel to another, setup second etc.

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Re: Friday Facts #356 - Blueprint library for real

Post by AmericanPatriot »

kovarex wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 3:11 am
Raiguard wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 3:58 pm
The new library fixes most, if not all, of the problems of blueprint management. You can nest blueprint books now, you can store upgrade and deconstruction planners as well, and most importantly, the interaction has been reworked to be identical to standard inventories.
You can even setup an empty blueprints by holding a book with them. So you hold a book with few empty blueprints, setup first, confirm, shift-wheel to another, setup second etc.
Why would you do that instead of just using the hot key and pressing q?
:D

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Re: Friday Facts #356 - Blueprint library for real

Post by valneq »

AmericanPatriot wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 3:18 am
kovarex wrote:
Sat Aug 01, 2020 3:11 am
Raiguard wrote:
Fri Jul 31, 2020 3:58 pm
The new library fixes most, if not all, of the problems of blueprint management. You can nest blueprint books now, you can store upgrade and deconstruction planners as well, and most importantly, the interaction has been reworked to be identical to standard inventories.
You can even setup an empty blueprints by holding a book with them. So you hold a book with few empty blueprints, setup first, confirm, shift-wheel to another, setup second etc.
Why would you do that instead of just using the hot key and pressing q?
Pressing q will drop it in inventory, filling it up. What kovarex suggests will keep them in the book, keeping your inventory free for actual items.

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Re: Friday Facts #356 - Blueprint library for real

Post by BattleFluffy »

Kovarex this story was wonderful to read, thankyou for sharing :>

I absolutely love the changes to the blueprint library. Building blueprints from the map is amazing too!!

So cool.

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Re: Friday Facts #356 - Blueprint library for real

Post by LuxSublima »

This is a comment on the new Blueprint "Absolute reference point" feature introduced with this FFF - let me know if I should post elsewhere.

Suggestion 1: Why not have the "absolute reference point" default to whatever offset would allow the blueprint to snap to exactly where you created the blueprint? The reason is I'm having a really hard time adjusting the point in order to tile off of where I started.

Suggestion 2: Allow the reference point to be edited manually rather than just shift-click (i.e. type in the coordinates as numbers) - this would have made it easier to adjust for my case.

Suggestion 3: Don't show the green grid that demonstrates the reference point - if it's off center it can massively increase the size of the preview, making its content even harder to see.

I'm working with a 200x200 tile for a big train network. I love the new blueprint features, the place-from-map, and automatic tiling, but with the above three suggestions, it would be sooooo much easier to create big tile blueprints. :)

Thank you for this great game!

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Re: Friday Facts #356 - Blueprint library for real

Post by AmericanPatriot »

LuxSublima wrote:
Sun Aug 09, 2020 6:44 pm
This is a comment on the new Blueprint "Absolute reference point" feature introduced with this FFF - let me know if I should post elsewhere.

Suggestion 1: Why not have the "absolute reference point" default to whatever offset would allow the blueprint to snap to exactly where you created the blueprint? The reason is I'm having a really hard time adjusting the point in order to tile off of where I started.

Suggestion 2: Allow the reference point to be edited manually rather than just shift-click (i.e. type in the coordinates as numbers) - this would have made it easier to adjust for my case.

Suggestion 3: Don't show the green grid that demonstrates the reference point - if it's off center it can massively increase the size of the preview, making its content even harder to see.

I'm working with a 200x200 tile for a big train network. I love the new blueprint features, the place-from-map, and automatic tiling, but with the above three suggestions, it would be sooooo much easier to create big tile blueprints. :)

Thank you for this great game!
Sometimes it is impossible to move the snap point where you want without increasing the preview size first.
:D

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Re: Friday Facts #356 - Blueprint library for real

Post by Bulkje »

I for one HATE the fact that the blueprints in "my blueprints" and the inventory are linked now.
When I delete a blueprint from my inventory it also deletes it from "my blueprints".
My way of keeping my inventory clean with blueprints was to only ever use a couple, and then clear them with shift + right click. BUT THAT WAS REMOVED TOO.
Now, I forsee a future where I have to keep more blueprints in my inventory than before because they can be removed from my library for NO REASON.

Seeing where you blueprint on the map is nice though.

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Re: Friday Facts #356 - Blueprint library for real

Post by Qon »

Bulkje wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 1:15 pm
I for one HATE the fact that the blueprints in "my blueprints" and the inventory are linked now.
Wrong.
Bulkje wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 1:15 pm
When I delete a blueprint from my inventory it also deletes it from "my blueprints".
Wrong.
Bulkje wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 1:15 pm
My way of keeping my inventory clean with blueprints was to only ever use a couple, and then clear them with shift + right click. BUT THAT WAS REMOVED TOO.
https://xkcd.com/1172/
Bulkje wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 1:15 pm
Now, I forsee a future where I have to keep more blueprints in my inventory than before because they can be removed from my library for NO REASON.
Wrong.

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