Friday Facts #320 - Color correction

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BrainlessTeddy
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Re: Friday Facts #320 - Color correction

Post by BrainlessTeddy » Fri Nov 08, 2019 8:49 pm

I'm a fan of the changes. I always thought that the game looked to dark, especially the map. I really appreciate that trees are now way easier to see.
English is not my native language, please correct me if I make any mistakes.
Also I'm the creator of Minesweeper and Pong in Factorio.

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Re: Friday Facts #320 - Color correction

Post by ssilk » Fri Nov 08, 2019 9:06 pm

Generally like that change. But I must admit, in some cases the saturation seems to be a bit too much.
Seen on iPad.
But go on! This is the right direction.

Btw: talked with Albert on the 0.16 party two years ago about the look of Factorio. Mentioning the dark look brought Albert to explain me the redesign.
We talked then a bit about the Art of Factorio. In my eyes, the visible look of Factorio is not just a design for a game, but it’s art in its very pure.

An example of what I mean:
12F67661-5010-4211-90E8-602B292C92C4.jpeg
12F67661-5010-4211-90E8-602B292C92C4.jpeg (1.13 MiB) Viewed 662 times
This is from the exhibition “Urban Art!” from October this year in the Völklinger Hütte (a very famous ironwork which is since 1986 a World Heritage near Saarbrücken, Germany).

More pictures from that exhibition, that reminded me to Factorio:
images

And in contrast the raw and dark pictures from the Ironwork. I think a bit of this contrast can be seen in Factorio.


more images
Last edited by Bilka on Fri Nov 08, 2019 9:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: spoilered the images to make them less of a wall
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Re: Friday Facts #320 - Color correction

Post by Murzik » Fri Nov 08, 2019 9:10 pm

No, no, please, no! Not this way. This is too much sparkling stuff.

1) Some people including me prefer to play in the dark or at night. These bright colours will put extra stress on the eyes. Please consider that many players also spend hours and hours at Factorio without even noticing their fatigue. It is not surprising as game is highly addictive.

2) Old graphics looks bleak for a reason. The awesome rusty look gives game a lot of realism, a feeling of imperfection. The items and buildings almost feel heavy thanks to it. The more cartoonish the items are, the more weightless and insignificant they feel.

3) Yes, Alien Biomes look great, but it's a matter of choice whether to use this mod or not. And it doesn't touch the buildings.

I understand that in many cases bright colours look nice. Therefore, a compromise may be needed. At least something like a gamma slider in the options would be nice.

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Re: Friday Facts #320 - Color correction

Post by Marconos » Fri Nov 08, 2019 9:11 pm

I really love the new changes. The darkness is hard to see and distinguish things. This makes it so much better. I wonder how many of us would have been so dramatic in our opinions if we didn't see them side by side. Brightness is something that I always have an issue with in games (most are too dark for my eyes).

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Re: Friday Facts #320 - Color correction

Post by coppercoil » Fri Nov 08, 2019 9:11 pm

I don’t like new colors. They look really vivid and… makes pain to my eyes. Everything shines like diamonds, it fits for poster, but for hourly play it looks to be exhaustive.

I also don’t like blue colors in the darkness. I think it’s an overrated cliche. If you look at the photograph taken in the darkness, it may look blue, but the point is, human eye adapts to the ambient color, so in the real life you still see normal colors, not bluish. So, darkness looks just unnatural now.
I like warm desert colors though.

BTW the first image is sooo incredibly large, I was unable to scroll the page down when I opened it in my phone. Image literally locked the page.

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Re: Friday Facts #320 - Color correction

Post by ssilk » Fri Nov 08, 2019 9:19 pm

In addition to my above post:

make more difference between the fresh, bright, clean and colorful nature of Nauvis
.vs.
the dark, scrappy, dirty and loud factory.
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Re: Friday Facts #320 - Color correction

Post by Illiou » Fri Nov 08, 2019 9:20 pm

I really like the changes overall. In direct comparison the old images look like as if they were coming from a bad camera, having really low contrast, brightness and color.
As others have mentioned though, I do think the terrain could use slightly less saturation on some occasions. Also it feels like you're suggesting the new night shade makes everything better visible - it's rather the opposite.

The idea that the LUT could change based on the amount of pollution at a given spot sounds really compelling to me. If possible I think you should mess around with that a little bit.

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Re: Friday Facts #320 - Color correction

Post by Solinya » Fri Nov 08, 2019 9:44 pm

netmand wrote:
Fri Nov 08, 2019 3:56 pm
It was good to see the cliffs highlighted a bit more on the map as they are though to see for my old eyes.
If nothing else, being able to see the cliffs and trees on the map will be a huge improvement for me as well. I know they are there on the current version but trees especially are very difficult to make out on the desaturated map, especially near grassy areas.

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Re: Friday Facts #320 - Color correction

Post by Solinya » Fri Nov 08, 2019 9:47 pm

Illiou wrote:
Fri Nov 08, 2019 9:20 pm
Also it feels like you're suggesting the new night shade makes everything better visible - it's rather the opposite.
I think it depends. The belts look more visible to me with the new night mode, but I’m undecided on the buildings.

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Re: Friday Facts #320 - Color correction

Post by Drury » Fri Nov 08, 2019 9:50 pm

Yeah I'm not gonna even try for subtlety, this is straight up awful. I follow FFFs dilligently since almost the absolute beginning, and this has to be one of the worst ideas you guys have presented, if not the worst. It is that bad, sorry.

The upped saturation and brightness is hard on the eyes, doesn't fit the game at all, and frankly I don't get it. I absolutely don't understand this decision. I don't know what else to say. It's a straight downgrade. I don't see the point in even a milder version of the effect, the game looks fantastic as is and requires no extra saturation or brightness.

I'm not even hyped for blue nights. I *love* shader shenanigans in videogames, and I love blue-tinted nights, they put me at ease. But this is probably the only game where blue nights need no apply, and the reason why is easy to discern in your comparison - all the items on the belt lose their color codification, they all turn blue. You could make the argument that the items shouldn't be visible at night at all and that I should just spam lights to get rid of the blue tint, but I don't do that, I like the atmosphere of a dim factory at night and I like to do things in it at that time in real life, and having everything be the same color would make that difficult. Since it's a LUT, I take it this will be moddable/removable, but the point still stands.

For the record, I do like Alien Biomes and the color variety it brings. It's a little bit on the intense side as well, but it's more so the variety in palette than the saturation of the colors that makes it tick. So yes, I do like the idea of differently colored trees, just so long as they're not neon-colored along with everything else rendered onscreen.
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Re: Friday Facts #320 - Color correction

Post by stevev45 » Fri Nov 08, 2019 10:00 pm

I would prefer to stay with the old colors if possible.

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Re: Friday Facts #320 - Color correction

Post by Haphollas » Fri Nov 08, 2019 10:04 pm

I have mixed feelings about the color change.
As a person with a color blindness it's already very difficult for me to distinguish between red and green circuit wires. This is the reason why i think something like a colorbling option should be added to the game.
I already have issues to see trees on the map preview and the new color scheme doesn't make it better.
As an example: I can see that there are trees on the left side of the slider but i barely see trees on the right side - only a few 'brighter' dots within the red circle https://imgur.com/a/L9Xi1kl
Instead of making it harder for colorblind people to distingish between colors you should focus on making the game more accessible for everyone. One step might be to add a proper colorblind mode.
This is also the reason why i use the 'colorblind circuit network' mod as a quality of life mod. It only changes the red and green wires to blue and yellow - even if you can't see the colors you can distinguish between them because of the brightness in the game.

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Re: Friday Facts #320 - Color correction

Post by ske » Fri Nov 08, 2019 10:16 pm

Neutral reaction.

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Drury
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Re: Friday Facts #320 - Color correction

Post by Drury » Fri Nov 08, 2019 10:17 pm

Haphollas wrote:
Fri Nov 08, 2019 10:04 pm
I already have issues to see trees on the map preview and the new color scheme doesn't make it better.
As an example: I can see that there are trees on the left side of the slider but i barely see trees on the right side - only a few 'brighter' dots within the red circle https://imgur.com/a/L9Xi1kl
Actually, the left side would be the new, saturated look. And to be fair, you're right, it helps a lot here and doesn't look too shabby. I can see the full color spectrum, but it's still quite hard for me to tell the trees apart from the background in the more muted, old style. In the map view, that is.

The demand for a colorblind more isn't new, I hope for you guys' sake it gets added officially. I think this is something every game should have, and it shouldn't even require drastic changes to the palette. I remember complaints about circuit wires and the red pollution on the map not being visible.
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Re: Friday Facts #320 - Color correction

Post by MicFac » Fri Nov 08, 2019 10:41 pm

I like most of the changes, but I think the new night is way too blue. Also, some of the brighter parts on inserters and assembling machines seem a little too bright in the new version.

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Re: Friday Facts #320 - Color correction

Post by Losash » Fri Nov 08, 2019 10:45 pm

As sad as it gets to upset artists, who worked on this change and made a big effort, I have to join those who disliked the change.
At some enteties which were already standing out, like, for example, yellow inserter, I can clearly see how vibrance and brightness has gone too far.

You've mentioned that yourself - the game is not a cartoon for kids. The sky of the planet is not supposed to be that crystal clear all the time so that bright sun flickers onto clean and oiled perfectly new machines. I know that sometimes it's tempting to do something just for the sake of doing something. Just don't...

P.S. I do have proper IPS monitor.

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Re: Friday Facts #320 - Color correction

Post by alexk » Fri Nov 08, 2019 10:52 pm

Awesome change, pleasing to the eyes.

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Re: Friday Facts #320 - Color correction

Post by ManaUser » Fri Nov 08, 2019 11:37 pm

So... as long as you're reworking colors, can you make the red desert red again?

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Re: Friday Facts #320 - Color correction

Post by irbork » Sat Nov 09, 2019 12:22 am

I wonder how long it will take for speedrunners to get used to the new map color scheme. It may prove to be difficult after millions of re-rolls and express map evaluations they have done so far.

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Re: Friday Facts #320 - Color correction

Post by Gatsukama » Sat Nov 09, 2019 1:12 am

IMO items should sparkle like christmas decorations when first put down, and them grow increasingly grimey with a) use and b) time under pollution, stopping a bit before they become soot covered silhouettes (you should still be able to tell what colour belt/inserter/... you're looking at).

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