Version 0.17.5

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moon69
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Re: Version 0.17.5

Post by moon69 » Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:45 am

Just for my curiousity, why did the medium & big power pole sprites change size by a few pixels!?

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Re: Version 0.17.5

Post by Mr. Tact » Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:46 am

moon69 wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:45 am
Just for my curiousity, why did the medium & big power pole sprites change size by a few pixels!?
I'm going to guess it was a consequence of the total redesign of the sprites to HD?
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Re: Version 0.17.5

Post by Antun789 » Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:53 am

ejg wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 8:42 pm
For the higher research levels (roughly around level 4) the new mining is (asymptotic towards) 80% cheaper to research than the old situation. Thus effectively a factor five buff to the mining research.

*I compared the total cumulative cost to the total effect
I'm getting different results:

The cost for 5 levels (10%) before 0.17.5
x*100 + (x+1)*100/1.02 + (x+2)*100/1.04 + (x+3)*100/1.06 + (x+4)*100/1.08
this becomes
x*481.125 + 943.736

The cost for 1 level (10%) on 0.17.5
x*500

Sum of arithmetic series for the cumulative cost:
x*(943.736 + x*481.125 + 943.736)/2 becomes
x*(2*943.736 + x*481.125)/2

x*(0+x*500)/2 becomes
x*(x*500)/2

Their ratio (new/old):
(x*500) / (2*943.736 + x*481.125)

It equals 1 at x = 99.9985

Image
https://imgur.com/a/peVZtCJ

But it only becomes less than 4% more expensive even at very high levels.

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Re: Version 0.17.5

Post by moon69 » Tue Mar 05, 2019 12:15 pm

Mr. Tact wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:46 am
moon69 wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:45 am
Just for my curiousity, why did the medium & big power pole sprites change size by a few pixels!?
I'm going to guess it was a consequence of the total redesign of the sprites to HD?
It was hr in 17.2 {368x244}, and is the same images in 17.5, just re-sized to {336x252}!

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Re: Version 0.17.5

Post by pleegwat » Tue Mar 05, 2019 12:27 pm

Antun789 wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:53 am
ejg wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 8:42 pm
For the higher research levels (roughly around level 4) the new mining is (asymptotic towards) 80% cheaper to research than the old situation. Thus effectively a factor five buff to the mining research.

*I compared the total cumulative cost to the total effect
I'm getting different results:

The cost for 5 levels (10%) before 0.17.5
x*100 + (x+1)*100/1.02 + (x+2)*100/1.04 + (x+3)*100/1.06 + (x+4)*100/1.08
this becomes
x*481.125 + 943.736

The cost for 1 level (10%) on 0.17.5
x*500

Sum of arithmetic series for the cumulative cost:
x*(943.736 + x*481.125 + 943.736)/2 becomes
x*(2*943.736 + x*481.125)/2

x*(0+x*500)/2 becomes
x*(x*500)/2

Their ratio (new/old):
(x*500) / (2*943.736 + x*481.125)

It equals 1 at x = 99.9985

Image
https://imgur.com/a/peVZtCJ

But it only becomes less than 4% more expensive even at very high levels.
You need to multiply by 25, because what used to be level 100-104 (total 510) is now level 20.

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Re: Version 0.17.5

Post by bobucles » Tue Mar 05, 2019 12:44 pm

What will players do when their mining productivity gets so high that it can not fill up a blue belt any more? Switch to bot mining I guess.
What will players do when their mining productivity gets so high that it's faster than 60/sec? That'll be a sight.

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Re: Version 0.17.5

Post by Bilka » Tue Mar 05, 2019 12:46 pm

bobucles wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 12:44 pm
What will players do when their mining productivity gets so high that it can not fill up a blue belt any more? Switch to bot mining I guess.
What will players do when their mining productivity gets so high that it's faster than 60/sec? That'll be a sight.
Mine into trains :)
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Re: Version 0.17.5

Post by Eiermann » Tue Mar 05, 2019 1:06 pm

Bilka wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 12:46 pm
bobucles wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 12:44 pm
What will players do when their mining productivity gets so high that it can not fill up a blue belt any more? Switch to bot mining I guess.
What will players do when their mining productivity gets so high that it's faster than 60/sec? That'll be a sight.
Mine into trains :)
Mine into cars. :-)

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Re: Version 0.17.5

Post by DaveMcW » Tue Mar 05, 2019 1:15 pm

Bilka wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 12:46 pm
Mine into trains :)
And watch their UPS drop when the train leaves. :cry:

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Re: Version 0.17.5

Post by Tigre Demon » Tue Mar 05, 2019 1:47 pm

I'm wondering, can you not enable research queue for an old game ?

I'm on a multiplayer game and after I updated launched 4 rockets and still no Research Queue in sight.

I tried /c game.player.force.research_queue_enabled = true but it tells me that it isn't allowed to me

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Re: Version 0.17.5

Post by Nomadic Steppe » Tue Mar 05, 2019 1:49 pm

I use the GOG version, and I can only update to version 17.01, how can I update to this version?

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Re: Version 0.17.5

Post by Nova » Tue Mar 05, 2019 1:57 pm

GOG will have to manually update the files on their servers - Wube can't tell you how long that will take.
Greetings, Nova.
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Re: Version 0.17.5

Post by Aardwolf » Tue Mar 05, 2019 1:57 pm

Nomadic Steppe wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 1:49 pm
I use the GOG version, and I can only update to version 17.01, how can I update to this version?
The original post said:

We're having problems with our automatic updater at the moment, so please use Steam, or download the full installation at http://www.factorio.com/download/experimental.

Does that work for you?

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Re: Version 0.17.5

Post by BlueTemplar » Tue Mar 05, 2019 1:58 pm

Tigre Demon wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 1:47 pm
I'm wondering, can you not enable research queue for an old game ?

I'm on a multiplayer game and after I updated launched 4 rockets and still no Research Queue in sight.

I tried /c game.player.force.research_queue_enabled = true but it tells me that it isn't allowed to me
Did you do it twice ?
(You need to do that, because it will disable achievements.)

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Re: Version 0.17.5

Post by BlueTemplar » Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:01 pm

Nomadic Steppe wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 1:49 pm
I use the GOG version, and I can only update to version 17.01, how can I update to this version?
https://www.gog.com/forum/factorio/how_ ... sion_guide

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Re: Version 0.17.5

Post by Tigre Demon » Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:05 pm

BlueTemplar wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 1:58 pm
Tigre Demon wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 1:47 pm
I'm wondering, can you not enable research queue for an old game ?

I'm on a multiplayer game and after I updated launched 4 rockets and still no Research Queue in sight.

I tried /c game.player.force.research_queue_enabled = true but it tells me that it isn't allowed to me
Did you do it twice ?
(You need to do that, because it will disable achievements.)
Yeah I know, I have them all anyway. I did it more than twice but still won't enable me. Maybe I need to activate something on my server to let me use admin commands ?

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Re: Version 0.17.5

Post by BlueTemplar » Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:12 pm

Yes, AFAIK /c commands are disabled by default for non-admins ?

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Re: Version 0.17.5

Post by Antun789 » Tue Mar 05, 2019 3:09 pm

pleegwat wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 12:27 pm
You need to multiply by 25, because what used to be level 100-104 (total 510) is now level 20.
Ah, thanks. But I think I only need to multiply the x's in the first expression by 5.

Pre 0.17.5
5*x*100 + (5*x+1)*100/1.02 + (5*x+2)*100/1.04 + (5*x+3)*100/1.06 + (5*x+4)*100/1.08
x*2405.63 + 943.736
sum of series starting at old level 16 (x=4):
x*(1600+x*2405.63 + 943.736)/2

0.17.5
x*500
sum of series starting at level 4:
x*(2000+x*500)/2

0.17.6
(x-3)*2500
sum of series starting at level 4:
x*(2500+(x-3)*2500)/2

sum plots:
https://imgur.com/a/gRrmGsy

ratio of proposed 0.17.6 vs old:
https://imgur.com/a/niQOZ68

It looks like it's still going to end up a bit more expensive, unless I messed something up.

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Re: Version 0.17.5

Post by Khaylain » Tue Mar 05, 2019 3:26 pm

Nice work, Antun.
It looks like it will be slightly more expensive in 0.17.6 than before 0.17.5, but it looks like they're asymptotically so close that it will be treated as a rounding error by most players. When you get to that point you don't really care about the resource costs as much as the time cost, I think.
In 0.17.5 it was far too cheap, I'd say. I wouldn't complain about it, but I understand the reasoning behind bringing it back to near the previous cost.

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Re: Version 0.17.5

Post by gothicdude1044 » Tue Mar 05, 2019 3:59 pm

i have yet figured out how to clear the quickbars how can we do that on 0.17 you cant even change the items on the quick bar either my 9 bars are full and no way to change them to something else.

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