Fluid throughput depends on building order

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Xoriun
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Fluid throughput depends on building order

Post by Xoriun »

While designing a space-efficient build for getting water out of a lake for a nuclear power plant, I realized that the build order of pipe-pump-combinations can effect the throughput.
In the video you can see that rebuilding the pumps yields 2 times 3k/sec (maximum with this setup) while rebuilding the pipes yields slightly less.
After removing only the middle pipe, it is completely messed up and even an almost full rebuild doesn't fix it!!!
I know that before the 1.0 release, weird fluid-issues like that were put off to the side as 'not that important', which I understood.
However, since the game is now a 'full-release', I would really appreciate if unpredictable behavior like this were removed.
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Rseding91
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Re: Fluid throughput depends on building order

Post by Rseding91 »

Thanks for the report however I don't see this as ever changing. It has worked like that since day 0 of pipes being added to the game. That's the price we pay for fluids having actual flow through pipes rather than the electric network style instant transfer.
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Xoriun
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Re: Fluid throughput depends on building order

Post by Xoriun »

I'm willing to make a lot of compromises for the flow, but building order dependency is one of the things I really hate.
I'm really curious as to how the building order even effects the flow. Is there an easy explanation for that like the flow is calculated based on current flow for optimization or is it something deep in the code that just has this 'flaw' ?

pichutarius
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Re: Fluid throughput depends on building order

Post by pichutarius »

Rseding91 wrote:
Thu Jan 28, 2021 10:18 pm
Thanks for the report however I don't see this as ever changing. It has worked like that since day 0 of pipes being added to the game. That's the price we pay for fluids having actual flow through pipes rather than the electric network style instant transfer.
maybe put this into wont fix.

Yoyobuae
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Re: Fluid throughput depends on building order

Post by Yoyobuae »

Xoriun wrote:
Thu Jan 28, 2021 10:38 pm
I'm willing to make a lot of compromises for the flow, but building order dependency is one of the things I really hate.
I'm really curious as to how the building order even effects the flow. Is there an easy explanation for that like the flow is calculated based on current flow for optimization or is it something deep in the code that just has this 'flaw' ?
As data suggests, first buildings are iterated in order they are built and then their joints are evaluated in order north, south, west, east.
From https://www.reddit.com/r/factorio/comme ... cts_myths/ (the first PDF link).

coppercoil
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Re: Fluid throughput depends on building order

Post by coppercoil »

Factorio fluids is a mystery. Don't think these are just pumps and pipes. This is kind of alien technology you need to explore and adapt for you.

You may need storage tanks (fluid sensors) and combinators to do controlled splitting.

Rseding91
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Re: Fluid throughput depends on building order

Post by Rseding91 »

coppercoil wrote:
Sun Jan 31, 2021 10:36 am
Factorio fluids is a mystery. Don't think these are just pumps and pipes. This is kind of alien technology you need to explore and adapt for you.

You may need storage tanks (fluid sensors) and combinators to do controlled splitting.
Splitting is not required. If you ever think you need to split fluid it means you don't have enough fluid.
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coppercoil
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Re: Fluid throughput depends on building order

Post by coppercoil »

Rseding91 wrote:
Sun Jan 31, 2021 4:33 pm
Splitting is not required. If you ever think you need to split fluid it means you don't have enough fluid.
Not enough fluid - not so rare situation.
There also is another case: long-distance fluid delivery by single pipeline, and latter distributing.
Splitting is required.

Loewchen
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Re: Fluid throughput depends on building order

Post by Loewchen »

If you want to discuss this further open a gameplay help topic.

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