[0.18] Sea Block Pack 0.4.2

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ptx0
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Re: [0.18] Sea Block Pack 0.4.1

Post by ptx0 »

if deleting mod-settings.dat doesn't help then the only thing that worked for me was to download the actual seablock pack zip from this thread and extract it manually.
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Medium9
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Re: [0.18] Sea Block Pack 0.4.1

Post by Medium9 »

ptx0 wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:39 pm
if deleting mod-settings.dat doesn't help then the only thing that worked for me was to download the actual seablock pack zip from this thread and extract it manually.
Got the same recommendation on discord just now as well. I'll do it this way then. A bit of a shame that I can't really use the integrated manager for this, but I'll live :) Thank you!

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Re: [0.18] Sea Block Pack 0.4.1

Post by Trainwreck »

Bilka wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 1:03 pm
I hope you mean 2020, not 2018 :)
Yep, was a bit careless with the copy and pasta there.

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Re: [0.18] Sea Block Pack 0.4.1

Post by vjbone »

Medium9 wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 6:40 pm
I updated all mods I already had and disabled any that weren't compatible, and downloaded SB with all its dependencies via the ingame mod manager.
thats your problem. dont update mods, dont download they ingame, download Archive from Trainwreck post

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Re: [0.18] Sea Block Pack 0.4.1

Post by minno »


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Re: [0.18] Sea Block Pack 0.4.1

Post by Chapeau-Claque »

0.4 mod list changes as I can see:

Added: Bobs Ores
Removed: Nuclear Fuel

For Bobs Ores I have no comment but why was Nuclear Fuel removed?

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Re: [0.18] Sea Block Pack 0.4.1

Post by Trainwreck »

Chapeau-Claque wrote:
Sun Feb 16, 2020 7:22 am
0.4 mod list changes as I can see:

Added: Bobs Ores
Removed: Nuclear Fuel

For Bobs Ores I have no comment but why was Nuclear Fuel removed?
Bobpower now adds its own plutonium recipes, making Nuclear Fuel redundant.
Bobores was added for one item, thorium ore.

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Re: [0.18] Sea Block Pack 0.4.1

Post by Gentaei »

Is there any hope of adressing the nightmare of energy production in early game?

Algae 1 now gives 5 brown algae per craft as well . Since you do not need it in your powerplant it gets put in a chest and gets "voided" by shooting it...

Algae 2 is insanly energy inefficient. For 0.5 Charcoal you need more than 1.1MW while you only get 2MW from the Charcoal. Net gain for it is less than 900kW... Algae 1 can do it by only taking ~700kW and giving you about 1.2MW.

It would help algae 2 a lot to reduce the amount of mineral water that it needs. Otherwise its only a wasted tech....

Arboritums are also not very efficient. Yes you can set them up early and a tree should always be close to spawn. But same here. For 0.5 Charcoal (2MW) you also need way more than 700kW to do it. Also a lot of space compared to alge 1. In addition it takes Steel and a lot more components making it expensive.

Since there are no other options to produce energy early on you will run on alge 1 for a very very long time. Till you hit fuel oil and making it out of Binafran and mk1 Farms. Also Solid fuel from it seems viable. Everything else seems either horrible ineffiecient or takes more space than algae 1.

ptx0
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Re: [0.18] Sea Block Pack 0.4.1

Post by ptx0 »

Gentaei wrote:
Mon Feb 17, 2020 3:36 pm
Is there any hope of adressing the nightmare of energy production in early game?

Algae 1 now gives 5 brown algae per craft as well . Since you do not need it in your powerplant it gets put in a chest and gets "voided" by shooting it...

Algae 2 is insanly energy inefficient. For 0.5 Charcoal you need more than 1.1MW while you only get 2MW from the Charcoal. Net gain for it is less than 900kW... Algae 1 can do it by only taking ~700kW and giving you about 1.2MW.

It would help algae 2 a lot to reduce the amount of mineral water that it needs. Otherwise its only a wasted tech....

Arboritums are also not very efficient. Yes you can set them up early and a tree should always be close to spawn. But same here. For 0.5 Charcoal (2MW) you also need way more than 700kW to do it. Also a lot of space compared to alge 1. In addition it takes Steel and a lot more components making it expensive.

Since there are no other options to produce energy early on you will run on alge 1 for a very very long time. Till you hit fuel oil and making it out of Binafran and mk1 Farms. Also Solid fuel from it seems viable. Everything else seems either horrible ineffiecient or takes more space than algae 1.
i mean, to me, if you 'fix' this problem, is no longer Seablock. i could be wrong.
If you want to buy me a beer for my work on eduran's LTN Tracker, send me a private message.

ptx0
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Re: [0.18] Sea Block Pack 0.4.1

Post by ptx0 »

please remove the KS Power dependency, as the mod has seen better days and seemingly has no real maintenance/upkeep/bugfixes from its developer.
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Re: [0.18] Sea Block Pack 0.4.1

Post by 3ara3ik »

Image

What am I doing wrong)?

Gentaei
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Re: [0.18] Sea Block Pack 0.4.1

Post by Gentaei »

ptx0 wrote:
Mon Feb 17, 2020 6:07 pm
Gentaei wrote:
Mon Feb 17, 2020 3:36 pm
Is there any hope of adressing the nightmare of energy production in early game?

Algae 1 now gives 5 brown algae per craft as well . Since you do not need it in your powerplant it gets put in a chest and gets "voided" by shooting it...

Algae 2 is insanly energy inefficient. For 0.5 Charcoal you need more than 1.1MW while you only get 2MW from the Charcoal. Net gain for it is less than 900kW... Algae 1 can do it by only taking ~700kW and giving you about 1.2MW.

It would help algae 2 a lot to reduce the amount of mineral water that it needs. Otherwise its only a wasted tech....

Arboritums are also not very efficient. Yes you can set them up early and a tree should always be close to spawn. But same here. For 0.5 Charcoal (2MW) you also need way more than 700kW to do it. Also a lot of space compared to alge 1. In addition it takes Steel and a lot more components making it expensive.

Since there are no other options to produce energy early on you will run on alge 1 for a very very long time. Till you hit fuel oil and making it out of Binafran and mk1 Farms. Also Solid fuel from it seems viable. Everything else seems either horrible ineffiecient or takes more space than algae 1.
i mean, to me, if you 'fix' this problem, is no longer Seablock. i could be wrong.
Problem here ist simple. Tech that you reasearch is worse than that you start with. So why build it in the first place? The only reason to research them is to progress in the tech tree to get better ways to make landfill and plates.

ptx0
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Re: [0.18] Sea Block Pack 0.4.1

Post by ptx0 »

Gentaei wrote:
Mon Feb 17, 2020 8:14 pm
ptx0 wrote:
Mon Feb 17, 2020 6:07 pm
Gentaei wrote:
Mon Feb 17, 2020 3:36 pm
Is there any hope of adressing the nightmare of energy production in early game?

Algae 1 now gives 5 brown algae per craft as well . Since you do not need it in your powerplant it gets put in a chest and gets "voided" by shooting it...

Algae 2 is insanly energy inefficient. For 0.5 Charcoal you need more than 1.1MW while you only get 2MW from the Charcoal. Net gain for it is less than 900kW... Algae 1 can do it by only taking ~700kW and giving you about 1.2MW.

It would help algae 2 a lot to reduce the amount of mineral water that it needs. Otherwise its only a wasted tech....

Arboritums are also not very efficient. Yes you can set them up early and a tree should always be close to spawn. But same here. For 0.5 Charcoal (2MW) you also need way more than 700kW to do it. Also a lot of space compared to alge 1. In addition it takes Steel and a lot more components making it expensive.

Since there are no other options to produce energy early on you will run on alge 1 for a very very long time. Till you hit fuel oil and making it out of Binafran and mk1 Farms. Also Solid fuel from it seems viable. Everything else seems either horrible ineffiecient or takes more space than algae 1.
i mean, to me, if you 'fix' this problem, is no longer Seablock. i could be wrong.
Problem here ist simple. Tech that you reasearch is worse than that you start with. So why build it in the first place? The only reason to research them is to progress in the tech tree to get better ways to make landfill and plates.
i dunno really, i wondered the same thing. it was suggested to me that seablock is all about these options and going down paths that might not net anything positive in return. for example, puffery farming is pretty useless and that's not a trivial thing to set up. it was kind of fun though, for a few minutes.
If you want to buy me a beer for my work on eduran's LTN Tracker, send me a private message.

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Re: [0.18] Sea Block Pack 0.4.1

Post by kenlon »

The addition of brown algae to the basic algae farming recipe has utterly wrecked my power generation. If you are going to update to .18, be prepared for this!

Gentaei wrote:
Mon Feb 17, 2020 8:14 pm
Problem here ist simple. Tech that you reasearch is worse than that you start with. So why build it in the first place? The only reason to research them is to progress in the tech tree to get better ways to make landfill and plates.
The problem is that there was already a good tradeoff between Green Algae 1 and Green Algae 2 - 1 was much less building efficient, requiring much more real estate and resources to set up, with the advantage of not needing to have a mineralized water source running. Now that you cannot use Green Algae 1 in any long term way due to the inability to dispose of brown algae, early-to-mid game power production is much, much messier.

If there was a way to dispose of the Brown Algae en-masse, even if it's just some sort of dedicated burn pit that would destroy it without producing anything, it would go a long way to making this change less terrible.


Trainwreck, is there any chance of getting an override to the green algae 1 recipe that will put it back to how it used to be? The change is fine in normal, terrestrial factorio, but in seablock this is awful. . .

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Re: [0.18] Sea Block Pack 0.4.1

Post by ptx0 »

kenlon wrote:
Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:54 pm
The addition of brown algae to the basic algae farming recipe has utterly wrecked my power generation. If you are going to update to .18, be prepared for this!

Gentaei wrote:
Mon Feb 17, 2020 8:14 pm
Problem here ist simple. Tech that you reasearch is worse than that you start with. So why build it in the first place? The only reason to research them is to progress in the tech tree to get better ways to make landfill and plates.
The problem is that there was already a good tradeoff between Green Algae 1 and Green Algae 2 - 1 was much less building efficient, requiring much more real estate and resources to set up, with the advantage of not needing to have a mineralized water source running. Now that you cannot use Green Algae 1 in any long term way due to the inability to dispose of brown algae, early-to-mid game power production is much, much messier.

If there was a way to dispose of the Brown Algae en-masse, even if it's just some sort of dedicated burn pit that would destroy it without producing anything, it would go a long way to making this change less terrible.
yeah actually he made it even worse by removing brown algae from the solder recipe list too.
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Re: [0.18] Sea Block Pack 0.4.1

Post by tpatm »

At least I now have all the wooden boards I‘ll ever need for this playthrough ... ;-)
if power from wood would be more efficient, the brown algae would make a good compost. I‘ve set it up this way now though just to automatically get rid of it but that’s an expensive way.

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Re: [0.18] Sea Block Pack 0.4.1

Post by 3ara3ik »

I looked at the drawings for the disposal of brown algae and I felt bad at 0.18, I’d better not update it) :cry:


Starting on this mod will be difficult, these algae have nowhere to process at the beginning of the game

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Re: [0.18] Sea Block Pack 0.4.1

Post by zoigo »

I am ok with the change. Algae 1 was too easy(and it used to be harder a while ago), I never did move to Algae 2 before, today i did.
Hope the author finds a use for browns (1/5 of recipe's yield) later. Maybe farming and paper will sink enough of that. For now (when i start a fresh playthrough) i guess i'll just box em up. After all, in real life we do have dumps of stuff not worth reprocessing.

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Re: [0.18] Sea Block Pack 0.4.1

Post by kenlon »

zoigo wrote:
Tue Feb 18, 2020 4:55 pm
I am ok with the change. Algae 1 was too easy(and it used to be harder a while ago), I never did move to Algae 2 before, today i did.
I made use of a mix of Algae 1 and Algae 2, with a setup where I had enough charcoal production from Algae 2 to consume my excess crushed stone (from things like geode washing->crystal dust) while having baseline power production provided by 100.8 MW self-contained power plants (28 boiler 2s and associated steam plants, fed from moderately ridiculous Algae 1 farms.)

Because green algae is one of the primary power sources for Seablock, this change to force the production of unusable amounts of Brown alongside the Green is a bad thing. For non-seablock angel's, it's perfectly reasonable.

@trainwreck: Another option to handle this would be to readd the old Green 1 recipe and rename the new one to something like "Mixed Algae", leaving both options available.

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Re: [0.18] Sea Block Pack 0.4.1

Post by mrvn »

kenlon wrote:
Tue Feb 18, 2020 6:06 pm
zoigo wrote:
Tue Feb 18, 2020 4:55 pm
I am ok with the change. Algae 1 was too easy(and it used to be harder a while ago), I never did move to Algae 2 before, today i did.
I made use of a mix of Algae 1 and Algae 2, with a setup where I had enough charcoal production from Algae 2 to consume my excess crushed stone (from things like geode washing->crystal dust) while having baseline power production provided by 100.8 MW self-contained power plants (28 boiler 2s and associated steam plants, fed from moderately ridiculous Algae 1 farms.)

Because green algae is one of the primary power sources for Seablock, this change to force the production of unusable amounts of Brown alongside the Green is a bad thing. For non-seablock angel's, it's perfectly reasonable.

@trainwreck: Another option to handle this would be to readd the old Green 1 recipe and rename the new one to something like "Mixed Algae", leaving both options available.
Option 2: dry the brown algae and burn it. It doesn't / shouldn't be efficient but it would allow adding a drain for the excess brown algae.

Option 3: user brown algae as a kind of fertilizer thing to produce more algae. Maybe just crushing it or drying + crushing could give algae feedstock or something.

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