Is Storage useless?

[grizzlyatoms]

I'm like 3 days into my game, spent probably 20 hours at least learning the game ect, oh and yea i have bobs... Anyway, from my past experience, i tend to collect and dump everything into storage then from storage move mats along to get processed, crafted ect... Does it just not work like that in factorio? I'm finding it extremely difficult at this point to figure out how to get everything dumped into storage warehouses and be sorted correctly and then figure out how to get everything back out for processing and it just seems to be a pain in my freaking ass. I almost can't get get anything done because all i do now is deal with storage issues. So, do i just need to learn to use storage in line with my factory lines and just keep the line moving? from ore to plates to belts to poles to this and that and finally when i'm not sure what to build next the plates can sit in storage at the end of the line until the next build? Is that the basic premise of how factorio works? Thanks

[DaveMcW]

Yes, storage is useless.

[garath]

Many players create a "main bus" running either horizontally or vertically with multiple lines of the primary stuff like iron plates, copper plates, steel plates, green circuits, red circuits. In the early game, you might store a small amount of resources before you get a main bus going just so you don't waste the production of iron / copper. But after the very early game, you put everything on a sort of "artery" through your base with branches off from the main line to build stuff as needed. The only thing you would then store would be the end products.

Storing everything can be very, very bad when you get to oil. At one point, I had setup a nice big line making just one good--maybe batteries--that needed oil, and I was storing all the batteries. Then, I started producing another item needing oil. But by the time I setup this second product, my original oil resource was essentially depleted. Thus, I was sitting there with like 1,000 batteries but couldn't make, for example, red circuits because I was out of oil. So, even storing the intermediate product batteries in storage turned out to be a very bad idea.

There are some awesome folks doing YouTube videos on Factorio. Just search for Factorio, and you'll find a ton of great ones. Some of my favorite ones are:

NegativeRoot
MangledPork

[grizzlyatoms]

Many players create a "main bus" running either horizontally or vertically with multiple lines of the primary stuff like iron plates, copper plates, steel plates, green circuits, red circuits. In the early game, you might store a small amount of resources before you get a main bus going just so you don't waste the production of iron / copper. But after the very early game, you put everything on a sort of "artery" through your base with branches off from the main line to build stuff as needed. The only thing you would then store would be the end products.

Storing everything can be very, very bad when you get to oil. At one point, I had setup a nice big line making just one good--maybe batteries--that needed oil, and I was storing all the batteries. Then, I started producing another item needing oil. But by the time I setup this second product, my original oil resource was essentially depleted. Thus, I was sitting there with like 1,000 batteries but couldn't make, for example, red circuits because I was out of oil. So, even storing the intermediate product batteries in storage turned out to be a very bad idea.

There are some awesome folks doing YouTube videos on Factorio. Just search for Factorio, and you'll find a ton of great ones. Some of my favorite ones are:

NegativeRoot
MangledPork

Thanks, i just started watching Negetive roots videos however i'm totally on the on where to start out of his thousands of factorio videos. I'm seriously a freaking mess right now in game and i'm almost to the point of quitting because i can't figure out what to do. I've got so many freaking raw materials its not even funny. millions of shit just stored away now. Seeing how its my first game, i'm thinking of starting over but staying in the same game. I'm gonna pick a spot and start spawning small ore patches just big enough for a couple drills with billions of ore each and do that for everything. Cheat and block off my own little area or maybe even carve out my own island using bombs from landfill or just using reinforced walls, like 10 layers with thousands of laser turrets. I've got a ton of mods and for just starting, i know ive got too many mods and ive also got some very difficult mods bobs included which make things even harder. But now im at 78% evolution and i can hardly do anything because of how bad the enemies are so ive just finished taking all my drill outpost down and im fixing to "lockdown" my main complex so maybe i can finally stop worrying about biters.. Even with all the mods and tech ive got at this point, i die instantly to them. i need tanks or power armor.

Anyway.... Would you be able to recommend a good video on learning to use a "Bus" setup and what not? I've heard bus over and over again and at first i had no idea what it even meant. Now i think i see the extreme value in it and it might do wonders for me. Theres probably a milion videos for them as well. Thanks and cheers!

[Neotix]

Starage is useless because it give no profit and waste space. Only small buffers are good option in n spots where you don't have seamless distribution like train stations or sorter. Also in spots where you have high consumption picks (train station again) buffers are handy.

[Arch666Angel]

Not useless but you need to limit yourself in its use -> raw materials only

[Phillip_Lynx]

... i know ive got too many mods ... Would you be able to recommend a good video ...

First to the mods. I strongly recomend every new player to learn the basics without mods. Make your first 3 to 5 factories without them. You do not need to finish the game to start a new factory. Play one a while and then start over with the experience you made in the old one. When you got the basics (and maybe started a rocket or two) then try some mods.

Second to the videos. Negative root is an excellent source. But I would recomend the early playlists. even if they are out of date (old version of factorio) the basics there are more clear. If a YTer does his 6 season, then he/she uses many things he/she learned through the older seasons and may be not so beginner friendly. I do not know, which languages you are capable of understanding, but if german is on this list, then there are also some good YTers (In my mind I have Tondinel and gerugon and maybe my self ).

[5thHorseman]

Early game I like to make one little mini factory for each type of thing I'm likely to use, and put them into a chest limited to 1-6 slots depending on how much of the thing I'm likely to need. Long arms get 1-2 slots, conveyor belts get a whole chest. Then whenever I need 50 mining drills to set up a new outpost, or a few hundred conveyor belts, or ammo for a dozen or so turrets, it's all sitting there already made. But with the chests limited I don't dump tons of raw materials into making the stuff I'll never need more than 10-50 of at any given time. Frequently those little boxes last me most of the game, getting converted into passive providers so bots can go get the stuff for me when I'm running low.

So really, storage is far from useless. It's an integral part of my game... but only if carefully managed from the very start.

[BlakeMW]

Another useful resource is AntiElitz speed runs. Unlike with some game's speedruns which are mainly about exploits, in the case of Factorio it's pure high quality efficient factory design and execution. And because he goes from zero to launch in under 2 hours you learn a lot in a short time .

[huwp]

Storage is good. But use the stack limit filter or you'll end up with mountains of junk you can't use

[DerivePi]

Storage is useful for:
- keeping your factory going when you have mined out a resource.
- Providing a buffer for transient resources (like intermittent train deliveries)
- Deferring what to make with resources until you have a need (ex. you've got 1,000 batteries but no copper for circuits now)
- Keeping the Ozymandius inside you pleased viewtopic.php?f=8&t=8238&p=65695&hilit= ... age#p65695

[Frightning]

I'm like 3 days into my game, spent probably 20 hours at least learning the game ect, oh and yea i have bobs... Anyway, from my past experience, i tend to collect and dump everything into storage then from storage move mats along to get processed, crafted ect... Does it just not work like that in factorio? I'm finding it extremely difficult at this point to figure out how to get everything dumped into storage warehouses and be sorted correctly and then figure out how to get everything back out for processing and it just seems to be a pain in my freaking ass. I almost can't get get anything done because all i do now is deal with storage issues. So, do i just need to learn to use storage in line with my factory lines and just keep the line moving? from ore to plates to belts to poles to this and that and finally when i'm not sure what to build next the plates can sit in storage at the end of the line until the next build? Is that the basic premise of how factorio works? Thanks

How is your bases infrastructure setup, how do you move things around from place to place? I assume mainly belts at this point. If so, you will want to think what items are needed where and route your belts accordingly (newer players usually end up with quite the belt spaghetti by midgame; I was no exception on that count, and I am still bad at any sort of pre-planning of my base layout). Factorio is very much a game about automation, you want as much stuff happening without you needing to do anything as is practical because that frees you (the player character) up to do other things, like clear biter nests, expand your factory, establish a new mine, etc.

Storage is useful for only certain things, as others pointed out:
-Buffer: So you can keep stable output even with unstable input, so long as the average input exceeds output demand.
-Storing surplus: You generally only want surplus of raw resources or materials that you know you will turn said resources into on their way to whatever final products you wish to make (e.g. no reason not to smelt Copper Ore into Copper Plates in the base game, since that's the only use for Copper Ore).
-Storing finished products: Use the red X to limit how many stacks are allowed to be filled by machines, so you don't end up with excessive amounts of items that you won't use anytime soon (or at all).
-Exploiting inserter stack size bonuses: This is mainly useful for train stations, but also for bot-fed requester chest->inserter->factory setups that need high throughput (e.g. because of Speed Beacons speeding up the assembly machine to ridiculous crafting speeds).

[NotABiter]

Not useless but you need to limit yourself in its use -> raw materials only

Playing a couple of your mods (ores and refining, without bob's) I buffer a fairly large amount of sulfur (and only vent floatation waste water if the sulfur buffer is full) to ensure I can always count on having plenty of that free sulfur available rather than having to ever spend any of my oil supply on sulfur. I also have some buffering between the 6 ores processing and the iron/copper processing because I want to keep everything running as much as possible (e.g. I don't want iron chunk processing stopped just because purified iron has backlogged all the way to the crotinnium chunk sorter, thereby shutting down the sorter and cutting off iron chunk production). If the incoming mix of 6 ores was absolutely constant, such internal buffering wouldn't make sense in the long term (because then I should just build everything in correct proportions so nothing is any more of a bottleneck than anything else), but that mix is constantly changing as old mining areas get depleted and new ones come on line.

(If my factory were super smart and a bit bigger, I might dynamically select the sort point between the 6 ores processing and iron/copper processing since by doing that you can adjust the iron/copper mix you get out, but for now I always sort the 6 ores before the leeching step in order to avoid as much as possible having to spend iron on acid production, and to provide a robust supply of free sulfur.)

[Dark_star]

Storage is good, but must be managed. Storage allows saving of items produced in the past.
Ratios are also about items produced over time. A slow production can be saved up for producing a single item in future while need research is finished.
Example: Steel for rocket silo Assembly and satellite, etc.

[frustin]

First to the mods. I strongly recomend every new player to learn the basics without mods. Make your first 3 to 5 factories without them. You do not need to finish the game to start a new factory. Play one a while and then start over with the experience you made in the old one. When you got the basics (and maybe started a rocket or two) then try some mods.

I only started my first 6 hours yesterday. I think these are good ideas.

Only mod i have is "squeak through", so i can walk between my objects.

Starting the intro again is exactly what i did to put into effect what i learnt from the original play through, as it was appalling.

Re:storage - i found that i still didnt get how storage worked after 6 hours. i couldnt get my feeders working properly. boxes didnt fill up despite putting them next to something (anyone know why that is?). So i'm going to start again and see how things fair this time.

[Serenity]

boxes didnt fill up despite putting them next to something (anyone know why that is?)

You need inserters to move stuff between assembling machines and boxes. Make sure to limit them either with the slots in the boxes or a circuit condition on the inserter. You usually don't want to fill entire boxes.

[foamy]

The only purpose of storage is to regulate surges in supply and demand: Train stations, rocket assembly (where a significant chunk of time is spent on the launch animation and the silo isn't accepting products), materials for expanding your factory or defending it, that sort of thing.

My silo is I think the only actual assembly module outside of my malls where I deliberately placed buffer in as part of the design, so that while it's doing the launch animation the chests can get loaded, and then I can use the superior speed of entity-entity inserter swings to drive the silo as fast as possible outside that. I also use chest buffering for gears in my belt plant for handling the draw of express belt and tunnel production, I guess.

Things I store substantial quantities of on a regular basis: Belts, tunnels, splitters, rail track, concrete, solar panels, accumulators, walls, landfill, miners, assemblers, furnaces, and modules. Most of them are reasonably quick to make (modules being a notable exception), but when you're using them you could be dropping thousands down at once.

Pretty much everything else, the buffer inherent in simply moving it around your factory is usually ample. Especially with trains, since a train station with buffer chests can hold extraordinary amounts of material unless tightly regulated (and the belts out of even a non-chest train stop can still hold a tremendous number of items).

The mods you see with giant warehouses? Those are traps.

[mergele]

Wheter you store the stuff in ore patches or in chests... *shrug*
If you mass bulk store products you'll probably end up having a significant amount of excess, but the map is infinite, resource scarcity is temporary, just get some more.

*Note: Does not necessarily apply to very hard or special map settings.

[Hannu]

I've got so many freaking raw materials its not even funny. millions of shit just stored away now.

It is mistake. You should not store materials if you do not specifically know why. At beginning there is no reason to store raw materials.

Seeing how its my first game, i'm thinking of starting over but staying in the same game.

In my opinion it would be better to begin a new game without mods.

Anyway.... Would you be able to recommend a good video on learning to use a "Bus" setup and what not? I've heard bus over and over again and at first i had no idea what it even meant. Now i think i see the extreme value in it and it might do wonders for me. Theres probably a milion videos for them as well. Thanks and cheers!

I like Nilaus and Kathrine of Sky. They are informative but both have tendency to build very large production from very beginning. It is easy if you know approximate ratios but you can start from small (one assembler) and increase when needed. You proceed slowly but have time to learn and try things and find your personal ways to play. I prefer to play first games by myself before watching videos. Copying of ready structures destroys joy of invention.