[posila][0.17.59] Placing train shows power zones

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[posila][0.17.59] Placing train shows power zones

Post by AreYouScared »

Not sure how to word that title at all...


When attempting to place a train it shows where the power zones are, as if you're trying to place something that actually requires power like an inserter, miner etc.

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Re: [0.17.59] Placing train shows power zones

Post by EnigmaticAussie »

Possible *not-a-bug*.
Seeing trains are now blueprintable.

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Re: [0.17.59] Placing train shows power zones

Post by boskid »

I think it may be related to train prototype defined with

Code: Select all

max_power = "600kW",
and not checking for energy-source.type == "electric". This way things that consume energy from any source will trigger electric coverage to draw

Locomotive: draws electric coverage (when should not?)
Cargo wagon: no
Fluid wagon: no
Electric furnace: draws electric coverage
Stone furnace: draws electric coverage (when should not?)
Boiler: draws electric coverage (when should not?)
Nuclear reactor: draws electric coverage (when should not?)

-- edit:
Car: draws electric coverage (when should not?)

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Re: [0.17.59] Placing train shows power zones

Post by mmmPI »

boskid wrote:
Mon Jul 29, 2019 5:34 am
I think it may be related to train prototype defined with

Code: Select all

max_power = "600kW",
and not checking for energy-source.type == "electric". This way things that consume energy from any source will trigger electric coverage to draw

Locomotive: draws electric coverage (when should not?)
Cargo wagon: no
Fluid wagon: no
Electric furnace: draws electric coverage
Stone furnace: draws electric coverage (when should not?)
Boiler: draws electric coverage (when should not?)
Nuclear reactor: draws electric coverage (when should not?)

-- edit:
Car: draws electric coverage (when should not?)

For train (loco) it may as well be the kind of bug that is a feature, not from lazyness but thanks to its usefulness, this allow you to see in advance if you have power for inserters at the train station, it sure is useless when you are adding trains and not doing a station related thing.

For car it is less usefull as you don't plan around inserters ( but some people do and it looks great ).

Stone furnace/Boiler/Nuclear reactor, should IMO draw the electric coverage, even if those don't directly need to be connected to the grid, you still build them with electricity in mind.

the 2 drawback I see is 1) potential perfomance issue (can't tell don't know), 2) too many useless information displayed( seems the opposite).

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Re: [0.17.59] Placing train shows power zones

Post by boskid »

mmmPI wrote:
Mon Jul 29, 2019 11:28 am
Stone furnace/Boiler/Nuclear reactor, should IMO draw the electric coverage, even if those don't directly need to be connected to the grid, you still build them with electricity in mind.
When doing initial smelting with burner mining drill and stone furnace, i don't have electricity in mind. In case of building smelter line, in building mode if electric network should be drawn when placing stone furnaces, then it should be also drawn when placing transport belts.
I will go with line that electric coverage should be only shown when entity you want to build requires electricity - this would show where you can build without need for extra power poles. If what you build does not require electricity, there should be no electric coverage shown to prevent player uncertainty as to "do i need to connect it to electricity?".

Case of not drawing electric coverage when placing cargo wagon or fluid wagon IMO shows that devs did not intend to draw electric coverage when placing rolling stocks.

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Re: [0.17.59] Placing train shows power zones

Post by mmmPI »

boskid wrote:
Mon Jul 29, 2019 11:45 am
If what you build does not require electricity, there should be no electric coverage shown to prevent player uncertainty as to "do i need to connect it to electricity?".
this is not too many information, this is confusing information, didn't see that one.

boskid wrote:
Mon Jul 29, 2019 11:45 am
Case of not drawing electric coverage when placing cargo wagon or fluid wagon IMO shows that devs did not intend to draw electric coverage when placing rolling stocks.
IMO too, this is not intented, though i liked some side-effect of it, it is not much of a problem when you know the range of the pole with habits, it can be frustrating that the coverage disapear when you try to adjust with substation or modded poles because you could need inserter next to Stone furnace/Boiler/Nuclear reactor and it would be nice sometimes to see the eletric coverage ( same as roboport range ).

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Re: [0.17.59] Placing train shows power zones

Post by boskid »

More special cases that looks to be broken could be improved:
- burner inserter: draws electric coverage (does nothing with electricity, so should not?)
- burner mining drill: draws electric coverage (when should not?)
- constant combinator: no electric coverage. Here it would be helpful to quickly show if constant combinator is somehow in range of poles to use with red/green wires.
- power switch: no electric coverage. Here it would also be helpful to show if there are poles nearby to use with copper wire for manual wiring

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Re: [0.17.59] Placing train shows power zones

Post by invisus »

FWIW I remember seeing viewtopic.php?f=23&t=73140 a while ago, and it was stated that electrical coverage and the "wire distance" weren't actually correlated.

*shrug*

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Re: [0.17.59] Placing train shows power zones

Post by Rseding91 »

This is one of those things where... sure - it could be changed to only show when the thing uses electricity - but why change it? Will it make the game better by not showing it in the cases where it is now? I don't know.
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Re: [0.17.59] Placing train shows power zones

Post by AreYouScared »

I mean I just found it odd, that's all guess this can be added the the not a bug section or won't fix?
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Re: [0.17.59] Placing train shows power zones

Post by _Attila_ »

Why should an entity that does not require electricity highlight the electrical grid?
Don't be lazy, fix it. :)
Attila's QuickBar Mod - Auto-links hand crafted item to first free quickbar slot if not already linked.
Attila's Signals Mod - Alternate signals to use in same circuit as standard signals.
Attila's Zoom Mod - Modifies zoom functionality.

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Re: [0.17.59] Placing train shows power zones

Post by kbk »

Rseding91 wrote:
Mon Jul 29, 2019 7:38 pm
This is one of those things where... sure - it could be changed to only show when the thing uses electricity - but why change it? Will it make the game better by not showing it in the cases where it is now? I don't know.
As for me, while this is 100% a low priority thing it is still a thing because it does show some irrelevant info at some cases but it does not break the game. Changing this will somewhat improve consistency of entity placement as a user interface and most likely would not become a nail in a boot to players and modders, which is good, and leaving this as is does a really negligible amount of good deed except saving time and effort.
boskid wrote:
Mon Jul 29, 2019 4:18 pm
- constant combinator: no electric coverage. Here it would be helpful to quickly show if constant combinator is somehow in range of poles to use with red/green wires.
- power switch: no electric coverage. Here it would also be helpful to show if there are poles nearby to use with copper wire for manual wiring
I feel like this is what definitely needs improvements (although it feels like a wrong thread for this). In fact, any entity capable of being connected directly by Copper/Green/Red wire might higlight some candidate poles for that upon placement, if this is not too graphics-heavy. And by the way there could also be a significant QOL improvement in form of keyboard shortcuts to sneak peek/highlight circuit networks, electric coverage layer, logistic layer or weapon coverage layer on key pressed. Please, take some time to consider that.

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Re: [posila][0.17.59] Placing train shows power zones

Post by posila »

Thanks for the report.

Fixed for 0.17.61

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