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Re: Friday Facts #361 - Train stop limit, Tips and tricks

Posted: Wed Oct 14, 2020 7:54 am
by BaggyK
An suggestion for an tip and trick. Pinning achievements.

Re: Friday Facts #361 - Train stop limit, Tips and tricks

Posted: Wed Oct 14, 2020 9:03 am
by wobbycarly
BaggyK wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 7:54 am
An suggestion for an tip and trick. Pinning achievements.
Pretty sure this is already a thing.

Re: Friday Facts #361 - Train stop limit, Tips and tricks

Posted: Wed Oct 14, 2020 12:46 pm
by Illiou
KatherineOfSky wrote:
Fri Oct 09, 2020 8:18 am
The Tips looks great, though I feel VERY STRONGLY that you do not hide tips from the user. If anything, add a little dot or animated icon next to the pertinent ones, or ones most recently related to progress in the game. However, I ask you most sincerely not to hide information from the player.
[...]
And while people wouldn't quit playing the game over it, I doubt they would ever open the Tips menu again, thinking that 5 topics is all they get for the whole game. (That's what I would do: there's no reason I would think that anything else is forthcoming. It would just look like a pitiful 5-point Tips sheet)
I very much agree with this. From a UX perspective it's not great and this view of a window with only a few tips will basically be the first impression of the tips & tricks and how people will remember it. Even if you write that there will be more tips as you play I expect most people to not remember this as they have already subconsciously decided that this window has nothing for them anymore.
The only way I think it could be justified to have some tips hidden would be if there are notifications in-game whenever you unlock a new tip. Which I expect would also be kinda annoying. But without that, people are just gonna forget about them.

I would show all the tips immediately and just somehow grey out the ones which are not yet relevant. I'm divided on if they should be openable from the start or not. Then you would show a modal dialog the first time tips & tricks are opened which explains that only the relevant tips are colored and it's best to come back and read them once they become relevant.

Re: Friday Facts #361 - Train stop limit, Tips and tricks

Posted: Wed Oct 14, 2020 4:04 pm
by eradicator
Illiou wrote:
Wed Oct 14, 2020 12:46 pm
I would show all the tips immediately and just somehow grey out the ones which are not yet relevant.
The monster "library" in typical JRPGs usually shows the full length list from the start, but all monsters that you haven't seen (unlocked) yet just show a [???] triple questionmark entry and selecting it shows an empty page. That way it is very clear that there are lots of pages, but there's no information overload.

Re: Friday Facts #361 - Train stop limit, Tips and tricks

Posted: Fri Oct 16, 2020 1:06 am
by Unknow0059
eradicator wrote:
Fri Oct 09, 2020 11:23 pm
Either you're looking at the wrong screen or you're misinterpreting or you've found an actual bug. It certainly shows "1" just fine for me. Factorio is one of the few games where i feel comfortable assuming the data is always 100% accurate.
I was looking at and describing the graph, not the list, which is shown in your screenshot.
Image: https://i.imgur.com/KPgp8mR.png
The wiki also describes this, although I came across it in my own testing.

Re: Friday Facts #361 - Train stop limit, Tips and tricks

Posted: Fri Oct 16, 2020 3:02 am
by eradicator
Unknow0059 wrote:
Fri Oct 16, 2020 1:06 am
eradicator wrote:
Fri Oct 09, 2020 11:23 pm
Either you're looking at the wrong screen or you're misinterpreting or you've found an actual bug. It certainly shows "1" just fine for me. Factorio is one of the few games where i feel comfortable assuming the data is always 100% accurate.
I was looking at and describing the graph, not the list, which is shown in your screenshot.
Image: https://i.imgur.com/KPgp8mR.png
The wiki also describes this, although I came across it in my own testing.
But the graph shows a rolling average and not "precise numbers" in the first place. The game doesn't measure how long it takes to produce an item. Do if you produce one item then there's a 1-tick spike of producing 1 item in a 5 second interval. So the average of that is gonna be weird. "23.8" is probably just the mathematically lowest number that such a 1 second spike produces, that doesn't mean the numbers are imprecise or uncorrect. It can definetly show lower values in the other time scales. If you made a factory that produces exactly 1 item per second forever than i'm guessing it would show correctly on the higher timescales.

Also the 12/m in your screenshot is what i'd call precise: If you produce 1 / 5s then you produce 12 / 60s. Aaand if you think the graph really is wrong then like i said - search the bug forum and if there's nothing similar file a precise bug report.
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Re: Friday Facts #361 - Train stop limit, Tips and tricks

Posted: Fri Oct 16, 2020 7:17 pm
by kizrak
SunBlade wrote:
Sat Oct 10, 2020 11:52 am
Configuration
  • Where to find the Three Pane Inventory Mode (Inv+Craft+Logistic)
This is awesome! 🍰
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factorio_rnux2VVH6N.png (239.04 KiB) Viewed 984 times
Thanks! 😀

Re: Friday Facts #361 - Train stop limit, Tips and tricks

Posted: Sun Oct 18, 2020 7:06 pm
by Nklinger
I just wanted to say that I really appreciate the continuation of Friday Facts, even if they are not weekly any longer. I enjoy reading about what's going on and what is planned for the future, and they sometimes remind me of corners of the game I haven't played with in a long time.

Re: Friday Facts #361 - Train stop limit, Tips and tricks

Posted: Mon Oct 19, 2020 5:11 pm
by valneq
Klonan wrote:
Fri Oct 09, 2020 8:34 am
TheEnemy42 wrote:
Fri Oct 09, 2020 8:32 am
Weee, new FFF and great changes too!

As a translator I urge you to find a way where we get the newly translated strings into the new release. 1.0 still has the spidertron and new crashed spaceship wreck texts in English in all localisations. Especially I expect the new tips and tricks to be new strings heavy and if all of the new help texts are not translated for new players it'll be a dent in quality IMHO.
Sure, the translations will be included as we start doing the deploys again, which automatically push and pull from crowdin.
There is no way to update the translations in 1.0 though.
Does that mean that you will release 1.1 as an experimental release first, so translators will have the chance to translate the new tips & tricks before they are pushed to all players (and maybe catch another bug or two)? Or does that just mean that you will incorporate the already existing translations for the spidertron text (which is still in English in 1.0) when 1.1 is released?

Re: Friday Facts #361 - Train stop limit, Tips and tricks

Posted: Mon Oct 19, 2020 5:16 pm
by boskid
valneq wrote:
Mon Oct 19, 2020 5:11 pm
Does that mean that you will release 1.1 as an experimental release first, so translators will have the chance to translate the new tips & tricks before they are pushed to all players (and maybe catch another bug or two)? Or does that just mean that you will incorporate the already existing translations for the spidertron text (which is still in English in 1.0) when 1.1 is released?
1.1 will be released as experimental release first, so there will be some opportunities for the translation upload/download before stable.

Re: Friday Facts #361 - Train stop limit, Tips and tricks

Posted: Mon Oct 19, 2020 6:47 pm
by valneq
That is good to know.

Although, judging by everyone's experience with (expectation of?) Wube quality, I kind of expect most people to just jump on the experimental 1.1 right when it comes out – leaving the tips and tricks essentially not translated. But then at least, people know what they are getting themselves into by opting for an experimental build ;-)

Re: Friday Facts #361 - Train stop limit, Tips and tricks

Posted: Tue Oct 20, 2020 8:18 am
by Freddie Chopin
boskid wrote:
Mon Oct 19, 2020 5:16 pm
1.1 will be released as experimental release first, ...
Any idea when could we expect that? (; I'm not asking for a precise deadline, but I would rather like to know whether this new release is expected "pretty soon" (say a few weeks) or "in distant future" (e.g. no earlier than 2021).

Re: Friday Facts #361 - Train stop limit, Tips and tricks

Posted: Tue Oct 20, 2020 8:32 am
by boskid
Freddie Chopin wrote:
Tue Oct 20, 2020 8:18 am
Any idea when could we expect that? (; I'm not asking for a precise deadline, but I would rather like to know whether this new release is expected "pretty soon" (say a few weeks) or "in distant future" (e.g. no earlier than 2021).
FFF-361 already contains an answer to your question. I will not give you more details.

Re: Friday Facts #361 - Train stop limit, Tips and tricks

Posted: Tue Oct 20, 2020 12:14 pm
by Dev-iL
If you want a rough estimate, you can try to extrapolate it!

1.0 was released on 2020-08-14 and the FFF was posted on 2020-10-09 -> which means 56 days. If they were ~50% done at the time of the FFF and assuming they're working with the same rate, it means an additional 56 days, which brings us roughly to .......... [drum roll ] ............ Dec 4, 2020, Friday.

Re: Friday Facts #361 - Train stop limit, Tips and tricks

Posted: Tue Oct 20, 2020 2:54 pm
by eradicator
Dev-iL wrote:
Tue Oct 20, 2020 12:14 pm
If you want a rough estimate, you can try to extrapolate it!

1.0 was released on 2020-08-14 and the FFF was posted on 2020-10-09 -> which means 56 days. If they were ~50% done at the time of the FFF and assuming they're working with the same rate, it means an additional 56 days, which brings us roughly to .......... [drum roll ] ............ Dec 4, 2020, Friday.
You forgot to apply the 90-90 Rule, which results in Friday, March 26, 2021 :twisted:.

With the new consoles out soon i'm not so sure if a "Christmas Release" would be a good strategy.

Re: Friday Facts #361 - Train stop limit, Tips and tricks

Posted: Tue Oct 20, 2020 8:05 pm
by orzelek
eradicator wrote:
Tue Oct 20, 2020 2:54 pm
Dev-iL wrote:
Tue Oct 20, 2020 12:14 pm
If you want a rough estimate, you can try to extrapolate it!

1.0 was released on 2020-08-14 and the FFF was posted on 2020-10-09 -> which means 56 days. If they were ~50% done at the time of the FFF and assuming they're working with the same rate, it means an additional 56 days, which brings us roughly to .......... [drum roll ] ............ Dec 4, 2020, Friday.
You forgot to apply the 90-90 Rule, which results in Friday, March 26, 2021 :twisted:.

With the new consoles out soon i'm not so sure if a "Christmas Release" would be a good strategy.
Don't forget Cyberpunk 2077 :D
1.0 release was moved because of it but it moved faster.

Re: Friday Facts #361 - Train stop limit, Tips and tricks

Posted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 8:33 pm
by alarig
I think that basic shortcuts for “monitoring” GUIs would be nice to have in the tips, like l gives logistic status, p the balance between consumption and production, clicking on a pole give power graphs, etc.

Re: Friday Facts #361 - Train stop limit, Tips and tricks

Posted: Wed Oct 21, 2020 9:52 pm
by leoch
Amusing how no one mentioned the mod that does exactly this train limit thing: Concurrent Train Restriction.

Re: Friday Facts #361 - Train stop limit, Tips and tricks

Posted: Thu Oct 22, 2020 6:38 pm
by kitters
I don't get it, is train limit added already in experemental versions?

Re: Friday Facts #361 - Train stop limit, Tips and tricks

Posted: Thu Oct 22, 2020 6:59 pm
by alarig
imTheSupremeOne wrote:
Fri Oct 09, 2020 8:51 am
Idea for a tip:

This is a problem that I had, and saw it in a few streamers that were new to the game — new players don't even consider that it's possible to put productivity modules into labs, or even science packs recipe; even if they are already using them for blue circuits.
Indeed, I never though about that, thanks a lot for the tip!