Factorio Forums

it shows a yumako icon instead of a jellynut

Yumako makes ore bacteria + spoilage, spoilage make nutrients, nutrients are required in the recipe.

ilcavero wrote: Wed Nov 27, 2024 11:43 pm it shows a yumako icon instead of a jellynut

Umm, I don't see any yumako...

IsaacOscar wrote: Thu Nov 28, 2024 4:52 am

ilcavero wrote: Wed Nov 27, 2024 11:43 pm it shows a yumako icon instead of a jellynut

Umm, I don't see any yumako...

That last icon changes depending on what it decides to use for the nutrient base component.

MechBFP wrote: Thu Nov 28, 2024 12:13 pm That last icon changes depending on what it decides to use for the nutrient base component.

Ahh of course, thank you!
So this post contains no bugs, just confusion.

Oh, so because nutrients don't have a default recipe (= non-alternative recipe, recipe of the same name as the item), so it picks the latest researched or something ??

BlueTemplar wrote: Thu Nov 28, 2024 12:34 pm Oh, so because nutrients don't have a default recipe (= non-alternative recipe, recipe of the same name as the item), so it picks the latest researched or something ??

I was using the editor, so yes that seems exactly what it's doing.
If I unresearch bitter eggs, it then suggests I use raw fish.

And having yumako's in my inventory (without any fish or bitter eggs) does not make a difference.

IsaacOscar wrote: Thu Nov 28, 2024 12:39 pm

BlueTemplar wrote: Thu Nov 28, 2024 12:34 pm Oh, so because nutrients don't have a default recipe (= non-alternative recipe, recipe of the same name as the item), so it picks the latest researched or something ??

I was using the editor, so yes that seems exactly what it's doing.
If I unresearch bitter eggs, it then suggests I use raw fish.

And having yumako's in my inventory (without any fish or bitter eggs) does not make a difference.

Oh god, it's worse than that.
If you don't have bitter eggs or raw fish, it uses spoilage, unless you're on gleba, than it finally uses yumako!

Everything that requires nutrients requires that you've researched yumako's, i.e. the game will choose the first on this list that is applicable:

• Bitter eggs (if researched)
• Fish eggs (if researched)
• Yumako/yumako mash (if on gleba)
• Spoilage (if not on gleba)

Strangely it never uses bioflux.

I looked at this a little bit closer and it looks like this behavior happens because the recipe decomposition logic tries to find something that produces spoilage and finds two recipes: "iron-bacteria" (that gives iron bacteria + spoilage) and "copper-bacteria" (that gives copper bacteria + spoilage). There are also 6 other recipes but they are recycling recipes. Since both "iron-bacteria" and "copper-bacteria" give spoilage, this logic uses last recipe that was seen and so it proposes yumakos because they are needed to give yumako mash.

It is possible to solve this by taking both iron-bacteria and copper-bacteria recipes and setting the main_product in both of them which makes them ignored when looking for ways to get spoilage.

Given that yumakos can be used to produce spoilage, i am questioning if this should be even considered a bug, this logic tries to give some solution and if there are multiple ways to decompose a recipe it simply has to pick something. Fixing this would be effectively just making total raw not be a total raw because it is possible to directly obtain spoilage by crafting and this crafting involves yumakos (and other chain of recipes involves jellynuts)

Fixing this would be effectively just making total raw not be a total raw(...)

I mean, that's not really a new problem. For example, Processing Units are considered "raw" because they have a fluid ingredient.

Spoilage comes from many sources, and those bacteria recipes are some of the worst ones. You'd get more spoilage from just leaving the ingredients to rot. I don't see any reason a player would want to "craft" spoilage in this way.

Ok. For 2.0.43 i made the iron-bacteria and copper-bacteria recipes to consider the bacteria products to be the main product which takes those recipes out of deductions for spoilage. I am treating this specific item (spoilage) as an exception here just because way more often it is produced not by crafting but just by waiting and as such for me it makes almost no sense to suggest using some really inefficient recipe to obtain spoilage.