Factorio Forums

I love the new beam effect. My only comment would be that the start and end of the shot is missing something, it feels a little too instantaneous. Maybe the start of the effect being instantaneous makes sense, but I think that the end could do with some persistence and decay. I'm thinking more on the lines of the traditional rail gun effect that you get for the primary beam after it has fired.

I think it looks fine, however, it could use a proper "charge-up" animation before it releases the energy, to give it more punch.

Does "must be made on Fulgora" mean that it needs holmium from Fulgora? or that the recipe can only be crafted on Fulgora?
I hope it's the later - as having the recipes only craft-able in certain locations seems really weird (and immersion breaking).

bnrom wrote: Fri Aug 02, 2024 9:02 pm Are there lifeless enemies on Fulgora? E.g., robotic ones?!

Or is just that you unlock the turret there, craft it there, but only use it on other planets, and in space?

Lord Bumbleton wrote: Fri Aug 02, 2024 3:19 pm Robots, perhaps?

If we get robot enemies, I hope we get to stick restraining bolts on them/make our own house-broken robots...our Spidertrons can use some smaller escorts.

For that matter, it'd be nice to hijack biters and other organic enemies too. Maybe a brain-harpoon that lobotomizes a biter, with a little blinkenlight and radio so they can be controlled by Spidertron remotes. Perhaps as a Gleba unlock, using a modified pseudo-cordysceps as an invasive brain-machine interface.

bnrom wrote: Sat Aug 03, 2024 4:15 pm I hope it's the later - as having the recipes only craft-able in certain locations seems really weird (and immersion breaking).

Same!

It looks great... I hate to be That Person but I feel like you all spent way too much time designing the effects for this when something "cheated" and semi-random would have been just fine.

In fact, the amount of time spent working on the graphics is affecting your design of it, too, IMO - lightning isn't a slow moving thing, and as you said in the post the "Tesla" turret is more of a beam accelerator and that's fine, but then why does it delay jumping between targets for the chain effect?

If the chain strikes were truly lightning it would be a BIG flash and happen all at once, which IMHO, would be way cooler, but would also give us less time to look at your lightning effects that you worked so hard on, though, and I can't imagine that feels great.

Consider a hybrid solution? Have the beam fire, instant zap the chain instead of doing the delayed jumping it's doing now, and just have the lightning linger for a second or two after it's dealt damaged?

morse wrote: Fri Aug 02, 2024 4:00 pm I see three problems with this turret.

1. The lighting effect is still too "lasery". Like the turret still didn't decide whether it shoots laser beam or an electric arc, and decided to do something in between.
2. The visual effects of primary beam and consecutive "chain beams" are drastically different, yet you say the damage is the same. This is strange and confusing, if the chain lighting has the same effect, shouldn't it look the same as well?
3. So basically this is "laser turret, only better". Yes, it's harder to craft, but in the end, it occupies the same niche. I thought that was what the quality system is for: "same thing, only better".

Did you read the entire post? They went through, in detail, how they wanted the main beam to appear it has a significant concentration of electrical energy and to also have the chains appear different on purpose; not only to distinguish them.

It needs a earth ground plate where the electricity is discharged. And no ground/dirt won't do. Magical Electricity, Magical pipes, Magical well transport belts..

Factorio? Or magical ... what ever.

Insert, change my mind meme.

JoneKone wrote: Sun Aug 04, 2024 4:18 am It needs a earth ground plate where the electricity is discharged. And no ground/dirt won't do. Magical Electricity, Magical pipes, Magical well transport belts..

Factorio? Or magical ... what ever.

Insert, change my mind meme.

Except it's not an electric arc, but a proton (or any other ion) beam, that ionises the air, creating a path for the electricity the way the meeting stepper and ladder create a path for the actual lightening strike.

This machine is not simply a tesla coil, technically it's more like a compact particle accelerator that fires a proton or ion beam. Once the primary beam hits a target they are strongly positively charged causing secondary arcs of lightning that can chain to other nearby targets.

Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.

cool! Now we need new wall from concrete and refined concrete

I'm not sure I like this "Sauron's Eye" design for the turret.

That eyeball doesn't convey "electric weapon" in any way, and when it fires, that idea of having a carrier bean and electricity on top isn't obvious.

My design would be an electric field (static lightning in a cage) in the centre and a small plasma turret head that rotates around it and shoots through it. The electric field would always be there on low intensity, then build up to full intensity when the turret charges up for a shot (while the turret rotates into position). Then the plasma turret would fire, the carrier beam expanding just slowly enough that you can perceive it as not being instant (half a second at max distance?), and when the tip connects, the lightning would pop into existence as there's now a connection from the electric field to the grounded target.

Koub wrote: Sun Aug 04, 2024 6:23 am

JoneKone wrote: Sun Aug 04, 2024 4:18 am It needs a earth ground plate where the electricity is discharged. And no ground/dirt won't do. Magical Electricity, Magical pipes, Magical well transport belts..

Factorio? Or magical ... what ever.

Insert, change my mind meme.

Except it's not an electric arc, but a proton (or any other ion) beam, that ionises the air, creating a path for the electricity the way the meeting stepper and ladder create a path for the actual lightening strike.

This machine is not simply a tesla coil, technically it's more like a compact particle accelerator that fires a proton or ion beam. Once the primary beam hits a target they are strongly positively charged causing secondary arcs of lightning that can chain to other nearby targets.

Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.

With this tiny whiny little exception just a micro a nano even, we know how electricity works and how pipes work, and how lightning works. xD The dev's don't know. They don't know how electricity works. They have no clue.. they just have 2 values. satisfaction and anti-satisfaction. And I have no idea how it can even lag with just 2 values. I mean it's impossible to get this electricity to lag.. It's not like it's a "Minecraft Industrial Craft 2 mod" now that I understand how/why it lags. But to get this to lag.. and even the fact that you somehow need to make it multi tread.. I mean.. No just NO. it's 2 values.. if satisfaction > anti-satisfaction then 100% process speed.

JoneKone wrote: Sun Aug 04, 2024 4:18 am It needs a earth ground plate where the electricity is discharged. And no ground/dirt won't do. Magical Electricity, Magical pipes, Magical well transport belts..

Lightning doesn't need a ground plate, dirt is just fine.

So in space age there is space also for "optional techs" that are not "mandatory" to finish the game. I hope that each planet has some non mandatory perk hidden within. It would make replayability more marked (that is play another game chosing another planet order would result in a more unique experience).

About the sound... shouldn't it be more like a thunder? Not a big deal, I'm sure there will be a mod for that. But this is how I imagine this piece of sci fi. Also the bouncing effect it's sort silly imho. I think the shooting effect should be shorter and more dramatic. Like everything done in 0.2 second, including bounces. But this just I.

Daneel_ wrote: Fri Aug 02, 2024 11:22 am I love this so much, but I'm in mourning over the first concept not becoming the final design - it's absolutely gorgeous and just conveys "punishing electrical canon" to me so much better than the final "sauron" design.

Agree. This looks much cooler!

Splitframe wrote: Fri Aug 02, 2024 11:38 am Okay so this is the first serious suggestion from me I think.
I like the Tesla Turret in terms of visual design.
But the actual "shot" is very uninspired in my opinion.

Please consider having the Tesla Turret fire like this:

1. It locks onto a target, like it does now.
2. It "shoots" the electricity, exactly like it does now, just very faint. As in 33% opacity.
3. Then, through this slight "connection" the actual damage lightning bolt is sent and propagates from enemy to enemy.
   This one should be slightly beefier and less "beamy" like the current one. (100% opacity, strong color)

In the FFF you say

On Fulgora you learn to control lightning, turning it from a threat into electricity. After learning to make more advanced electrical components and mastering the planet's Electromagnetic science pack you are ready for the next stages: Converting electricity back into lightning and unlocking the Tesla turret.

But the current "shot" is more like a blue Laser turret with some sparks and a chain effect.

For comparison: https://youtu.be/qQKhIK4pvYo?t=301
You can see how the electricity "seeks" the ground and at the moment the connection is made it's a BANG.
The randomness of the seeking is overcome technology wise by leading with the beam first.
That would, in my opinion, be a great way to show how lightning was tamed and turned into a weapon from studying it.

Edit: Thinking about it a little my guess is that you wanted something more "fizzly" and less "impact".
What I described might fit an eventual Lightning Turret? Or maybe the legendary version of the Tesla Turret?

This machine is not simply a tesla coil, technically it's more like a compact particle accelerator that fires a proton or ion beam. Once the primary beam hits a target they are strongly positively charged causing secondary arcs of lightning that can chain to other nearby targets.

This is presented to us in the 3rd paragraph right at the top. This isn't a lightning gun. Not in the sense you are thinking. It is an energy beam primary component with a strong electrical secondary component. As such, the primary beam is fine. The firing sequence could be improved with the initial targeting beam benefiting from your suggestion of a lower opacity then ramping to full when the main beam fires, but that is it.

Given that this is not an actual Tesla Turret as described by its operation, I would put forth the the name is misleading. "Ion Cannon" or "Ion Turret" would be far more appropriate. Like the Ion Cannon the GDI used in C&C Original and Tiberian Sun.

RocketManChronicles wrote: Sat Aug 03, 2024 10:17 pm Did you read the entire post? They went through, in detail, how they wanted the main beam to appear it has a significant concentration of electrical energy and to also have the chains appear different on purpose; not only to distinguish them.

Yes, I've read the post, I know that what they did was intentional. But I still stand by my opinion.

yngndrw wrote: Sun Aug 04, 2024 11:02 am

JoneKone wrote: Sun Aug 04, 2024 4:18 am It needs a earth ground plate where the electricity is discharged. And no ground/dirt won't do. Magical Electricity, Magical pipes, Magical well transport belts..

Lightning doesn't need a ground plate, dirt is just fine.

Ok so you think it doesn't need a ground plate? ... You say dirt is fine? Well what happens if dirt is fine in your own opinion.. I know what will happen, the electricity will just ground with the shortest path. Next to the coil. And nothing happens...

Or are you suggesting it magically jumps to the enemy? Cause it knows.

JoneKone wrote: Mon Aug 05, 2024 5:15 pm

yngndrw wrote: Sun Aug 04, 2024 11:02 am

JoneKone wrote: Sun Aug 04, 2024 4:18 am It needs a earth ground plate where the electricity is discharged. And no ground/dirt won't do. Magical Electricity, Magical pipes, Magical well transport belts..

Lightning doesn't need a ground plate, dirt is just fine.

Ok so you think it doesn't need a ground plate? ... You say dirt is fine? Well what happens if dirt is fine in your own opinion.. I know what will happen, the electricity will just ground with the shortest path. Next to the coil. And nothing happens...

Or are you suggesting it magically jumps to the enemy? Cause it knows.

I know it doesn't need a grounding plate:

1) It's a game.
2) It's a particle beam which ironises the air, giving a path of charged particles towards the target. This is your path of least resistance. From there it jumps to the literal ground and the circuit is completed.
3) Magic is not required, this is how lightning works.

JoneKone wrote: Mon Aug 05, 2024 5:15 pm

yngndrw wrote: Sun Aug 04, 2024 11:02 am

JoneKone wrote: Sun Aug 04, 2024 4:18 am It needs a earth ground plate where the electricity is discharged. And no ground/dirt won't do. Magical Electricity, Magical pipes, Magical well transport belts..

Lightning doesn't need a ground plate, dirt is just fine.

Ok so you think it doesn't need a ground plate? ... You say dirt is fine? Well what happens if dirt is fine in your own opinion.. I know what will happen, the electricity will just ground with the shortest path. Next to the coil. And nothing happens...

Or are you suggesting it magically jumps to the enemy? Cause it knows.

Yeah, it is like what yngndrw said with point 2 above. They said it is a proton ray gun. It shoots a powerful beam of protons that creates a tunnel of charged ions to the target and on the target. This in turn draws in free elections, the "tesla" of the weapon, to the target and thus zapping it. This is actually akin to how real lightning creates a path to strike. You get two, mostly, invisible particle streamers going out. One is negatively charged elections and the other is positively charged ions. Once the two meet the full power of the bolt of lightning flashes as the two source charges transfer energy and cancel each other out.

The space sim/rts game, Outpost 2, by the ancient defunct studio Sierra Entertainment of the 90s, had a "Thor's Hammer" lightning tank that operated with nearly the exact same description as this one. Major difference there, however, was that that fired a much weaker proton beam that acted more as a charging beam and then released the electrical charge itself from a massive bank of onboard capacitors.