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Re: [0.17] Remove military science from power armor Mk2 and portable fusion reactor research
Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 12:48 pm
by ikarikeiji
+1 to OP
I generally play without biters these days, this thread is why my previous 0.15 game didn't use personal roboport, I was hoping it would be possible without military science packs in 0.17 but was sad to see this isn't the case.
Re: [0.17] Remove military science from power armor Mk2 and portable fusion reactor research
Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:09 pm
by Ranakastrasz
avaspell wrote: Sun Mar 03, 2019 6:38 pm
Wouldn't a power suit be a weird amalgam? I could take a Power suite MK2 and throw a ton of shields in it and it might as well be armor anyways. And "fixing" that seems way too complicated. The only other non-military use of the armor is movement ( you have concrete and vehicles for that ) and night vision, which you can counter if you're a non-military with lights. The only argument that I could see is for construction robotics, but I think there may be a simple answer to this: Have some sort of upgrade that allows your inventory to be connected to the logistic network for the purpose of construction. Something like trash or logistic slots but allows the construction robots from elsewhere to grab your items. Of course, this is just an optimization to just throwing stuff in a chest. I think the only _real_ advantage to this ( which should be considered! ) Is to allow construction robots to use your stuff without having researched logistic system and building some logistic bots ( otherwise you could build a storage chest and literally trash the stuff you want to use to build with).
Nope. Shields inherit damage resistance from the armor, so if it just has zero resistances, it will just be extra HP, so you would get torn apart by even small biters. Note that light and heavy armor don't boost your health, they just give damage resistance. Remove that, and add extra HP instead, and it wouldn't be nearly as impressive, even with regeneration.
Could even give it damage amplification. I've done that before. Make behemoths take bonus damage from explosives.
Re: [0.17] Remove military science from power armor Mk2 and portable fusion reactor research
Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:15 pm
by BlueTemplar
Ranakastrasz wrote: Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:09 pm
Shields inherit damage resistance from the armor
Factorio : our engineers make the best shields !
Re: [0.17] Remove military science from power armor Mk2 and portable fusion reactor research
Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:34 pm
by Ranakastrasz
BlueTemplar wrote: Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:15 pm
Ranakastrasz wrote: Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:09 pm
Shields inherit damage resistance from the armor
Factorio : our engineers make the best shields !
Yep. Once you get shields, it helps a lot with turretcreeping, if only because you can take damage for them. Whether wasting power or wasting turrets is better while you rely on solar panels, I dunno though.
Re: [0.17] Remove military science from power armor Mk2 and portable fusion reactor research
Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:44 pm
by leadraven
In construction I heavily rely on personal roboports, also in peaceful playthroughs. I can't imagine base building without personal roboports, legs and reactors.
"Place stationary roboport when you need to build something" is like making "Lazy bastard" achievement: if you need to craft something just place an assembler - it is very annoying.
Re: [0.17] Remove military science from power armor Mk2 and portable fusion reactor research
Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:47 pm
by Ranakastrasz
leadraven wrote: Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:44 pm
In construction I heavily rely on personal roboports, also in peaceful playthroughs. I can't imagine base building without personal roboports, legs and reactors.
"Place stationary roboport when you need to build something" is like making "Lazy bastard" achievement: if you need to craft something just place an assembler - it is very annoying.
Eh, its more like, Cover your base with a roboport network. Leave no space uncovered. After all, that means you can always have robots delivering stuff to you, and repairing stuff, and building for you.
But I get what you are saying.
Re: [0.17] Remove military science from power armor Mk2 and portable fusion reactor research
Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 3:15 pm
by leadraven
I also get your point. And you are right, it is more correct (more professional) to use roboports network. But for casual players like me personal roboport is a very handy thing.
Also it requires time and resources to setup roboport network and fill it robots. It better fits to megabases. Personal roboport becomes available much earlier and helps greatly during main progression.
P.S. I would also like to see more options for modular armors, both combat and construction, to make both applications more attractive and versatile.
Re: [0.17] Remove military science from power armor Mk2 and portable fusion reactor research
Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 3:47 pm
by Serenity
You aren't always in your main base network. The personal roboport is also very useful in constructing mining outposts, walls and rail lines for example
Re: [0.17] Remove military science from power armor Mk2 and portable fusion reactor research
Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 4:31 pm
by Ranakastrasz
Serenity wrote: Tue Mar 05, 2019 3:47 pm
You aren't always in your main base network. The personal roboport is also very useful in constructing mining outposts, walls and rail lines for example
Ah, raillines. Right. Outposts don't count, since you should have those covered by a roboport for repairs if nothing else, but raillines are absolutely a situation where this matters.
That said, I do agree with op. Those are not pure military techs, or even close to it. Double utility cost or something instead.
Re: [0.17] Remove military science from power armor Mk2 and portable fusion reactor research
Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 4:35 pm
by Serenity
Ranakastrasz wrote: Tue Mar 05, 2019 4:31 pm
Outposts don't count, since you should have those covered by a roboport for repairs if nothing else
That depends. It's not always needed even if biters are on. For example with expansion turned off. Or if they're inside a perimeter wall
And again: this is also meant for when you may play with biters disabled
Re: [0.17] Remove military science from power armor Mk2 and portable fusion reactor research
Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 5:39 pm
by melichor
CDarklock wrote: Tue Mar 05, 2019 12:14 pm
melichor wrote: Tue Mar 05, 2019 9:26 am
But as you said, it has non-combat use, so it should be possible to get it in non-combat run without using Military science
Everything has a non-combat use. The question is whether it has a significant
combat use.
What non-combat uses has a normal armor? What non-combat uses has non-explosive weapons? Explosives are for clearing trees, although that becomes quite obsolete with bots. Oh yeah, you can trash some really early game items you don't want anymore by putting them in a chest and shooting them, but that's about it (And you would do it like once or twice in the entire game if ever and pistol works just fine for that)
Ranakastrasz wrote: Tue Mar 05, 2019 4:31 pm
Serenity wrote: Tue Mar 05, 2019 3:47 pm
You aren't always in your main base network. The personal roboport is also very useful in constructing mining outposts, walls and rail lines for example
Ah, raillines. Right. Outposts don't count, since you should have those covered by a roboport for repairs if nothing else, but raillines are absolutely a situation where this matters.
That said, I do agree with op. Those are not pure military techs, or even close to it. Double utility cost or something instead.
What repairs? There are no repairs if you're playing without biters unless you personally crash into something
Re: [0.17] Remove military science from power armor Mk2 and portable fusion reactor research
Posted: Tue Mar 05, 2019 5:46 pm
by CDarklock
melichor wrote: Tue Mar 05, 2019 5:39 pm
What non-combat uses has a normal armor?
Looking cool and feeling like a badass.
