Aricitic wrote: Sat Nov 30, 2024 2:36 am
Exactly. So... Um, I hate to ask, but is there a location where I can simply look up this information? I'm feeling slightly dumb constantly asking at the end of my posts.
No need to feel dumb, the way BBCode works does sometimes feel like it's able to break when you don't expect it. Other than IsaacOscar's link (& the generic forum BBCode info), I can only recommend trial and error with the preview I'm afraid. One thing that helped me figure stuff out is the "reply with quote" option - if I see someone's post using a thing I was looking for, I can quote it to see the proper BBCode for it.
11-30-2024, 10-33-14.png (4.74 KiB) Viewed 975 times
Aricitic wrote: Sat Nov 30, 2024 2:36 am
Also, yes, the tags were closed properly. I click the button that automatically adds it. The things you are seeing between the spoilers are there because no matter what I did I could not get space in between them.
Ah, I see. I've grown used to adding most of them manually, as the automatic placement didn't always work as expected. And it looks like neighbouring blocks of spoilers need three empty lines, that seems to be working for me:
: https://eng.libretexts.org/Bookshelves/ ... Statements
Heck, even the "smallest" language called "Brainf..." (self-censoring) (I would post a URL, but I'm fairly certain that it would be censored...) has the ability to do an "else" without programming an entirely new function (i.e. it's part of the "if-then" portion).
slight deep dive
AND I personally agree with vark111
Consider this
I get the feeling that
Re: Add 2 outputs to Decider Combinator
Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2024 8:55 pm
by Drundia
Aricitic wrote: Thu Nov 28, 2024 9:00 pm
That said, ASSEMBLY (and, therefore, MACHINE LANGUAGE) contains an "else" statement within the "if" statement. And, for those unaware, Assembly is the most basic "human readable" programming language in existence (only slightly more "advanced" than "machine language" -- but is literally a 1:1 ratio of code to computer-readable... uh... coding).
Example for MIPS Assembly If-then-else:
note
(there exist as many "Assembly" 'languages' as there are different processors, as "Assembly" is - as previously stated - a 1:1 code:binary representation, and therefore any different processor "architecture" requires its own Assembly language)
: https://eng.libretexts.org/Bookshelves/ ... Statements
Heck, even the "smallest" language called "Brainf..." (self-censoring) (I would post a URL, but I'm fairly certain that it would be censored...) has the ability to do an "else" without programming an entirely new function (i.e. it's part of the "if-then" portion).
Technically assembly languages have no branches at all because they aren't structured programming languages. BF is also limited to a simple "loop if" instruction.
Luckily Decider combinators have nothing to do with assembly and could easily fit an extra "else" output to simplify things. That is so we don't have to implement it in a way similar to assembly.
Aricitic wrote: Thu Nov 28, 2024 9:00 pm
That said, ASSEMBLY (and, therefore, MACHINE LANGUAGE) contains an "else" statement within the "if" statement. And, for those unaware, Assembly is the most basic "human readable" programming language in existence (only slightly more "advanced" than "machine language" -- but is literally a 1:1 ratio of code to computer-readable... uh... coding).
Example for MIPS Assembly If-then-else:
note
(there exist as many "Assembly" 'languages' as there are different processors, as "Assembly" is - as previously stated - a 1:1 code:binary representation, and therefore any different processor "architecture" requires its own Assembly language)
: https://eng.libretexts.org/Bookshelves/ ... Statements
Heck, even the "smallest" language called "Brainf..." (self-censoring) (I would post a URL, but I'm fairly certain that it would be censored...) has the ability to do an "else" without programming an entirely new function (i.e. it's part of the "if-then" portion).
Technically assembly languages have no branches at all because they aren't structured programming languages. BF is also limited to a simple "loop if" instruction.
Luckily Decider combinators have nothing to do with assembly and could easily fit an extra "else" output to simplify things. That is so we don't have to implement it in a way similar to assembly.
I would half agree and half disagree. Anything that has a "goto" has a branching or a looping capability.
Even if someone wanted to claim that Combinators and Circuits (in Factorio) are "pure logic" it STILL allows for branches, loops, etc.
If I need to provide links to more evidence I'm more than happy to find them, but most of the links I've provided show what I'm trying to say is true.
Re: Add 2 outputs to Decider Combinator
Posted: Sat Dec 07, 2024 3:29 pm
by Tinyboss
I don't think there's much to be gained by continuing the discussion of which (if not all) programming languages have if/else. It's enough that many do, and that it's useful, and that it could be implemented in combinators. From there, it's a matter of whether it makes Factorio a better game! (My opinion is yes.)
Re: Add 2 outputs to Decider Combinator
Posted: Mon Dec 09, 2024 5:10 pm
by Sheridan
I apologize for interjecting, but with the recent introduction of new combinators that support multiple conditions, the idea of adding an "else" output seems even more appealing now.
There are several advantages to this addition:
Reduction in the Number of Combinators: Implementing an "else" output would allow players to achieve more complex logic with fewer combinators, streamlining their setups.
Improved Readability of Schematics: With the ability to express conditional logic more clearly, players will find it easier to understand and maintain their circuit designs.
Familiarization with Standard Branching Logic: By incorporating an "else" statement, players will inadvertently learn about standard branching concepts found in traditional programming languages, enhancing their overall understanding of logic and automation.
I believe that these benefits would significantly enhance the gameplay experience and encourage more creative automation solutions.
Re: Add 2 outputs to Decider Combinator
Posted: Tue Dec 10, 2024 7:39 pm
by Aricitic
Sheridan wrote: Mon Dec 09, 2024 5:10 pm
I apologize for interjecting, but with the recent introduction of new combinators that support multiple conditions, the idea of adding an "else" output seems even more appealing now.
There are several advantages to this addition:
Reduction in the Number of Combinators: Implementing an "else" output would allow players to achieve more complex logic with fewer combinators, streamlining their setups.
Improved Readability of Schematics: With the ability to express conditional logic more clearly, players will find it easier to understand and maintain their circuit designs.
Familiarization with Standard Branching Logic: By incorporating an "else" statement, players will inadvertently learn about standard branching concepts found in traditional programming languages, enhancing their overall understanding of logic and automation.
I believe that these benefits would significantly enhance the gameplay experience and encourage more creative automation solutions.
You aren't interjecting... The "conversation" happening prior to your post had pretty much ended, so...
Additionally, I wish there was a "like" button (or a "this" button) as your post pretty much sums up my (multiple) post(s) more elegantly.
Post Script: I will NOT reply to everyone... I was mostly replying to the above to say the two points I wrote.
Re: Add 2 outputs to Decider Combinator
Posted: Tue Mar 25, 2025 1:26 pm
by Epb7304
here is my take on it, including choosing output wire type
Better Decider Combinator (else).png (44.92 KiB) Viewed 452 times
Re: Add 2 outputs to Decider Combinator
Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2025 9:22 pm
by Epb7304
bumping this post in light of potential combinator reworks in 2.1