Factorio Forums

This looks fun, and an interesting change that polution shifts from one building type to the other. I assume, gleba and the alien eggs are the precursors to the spidertron, since they move and feel very similar?

The Phoenixian wrote: Fri Aug 16, 2024 12:02 pmFrom the writeup, it sounds like this time there should be ways to sustainably farm the aliens in a single area this time with a mix of intentionally letting eggs spoil/hatch and what I'd assume are deconstruction orders via roboport or spidertron instead of the expansionist looting for alien-artifact-era biters on Nauvis.

So in that sense we've moved from the ignore/exterminate dichotomy to... colonial exploitation? (We continue to be The Worst, and the way that typically prosocial mechanics and ideas like green technology and sustainability are used to fuel that excess is a fascinating approach to character building through mechanics alone.)

From how they wrote it I assumed similar, that one kinda could make something like a "Pentapod nature reserve", and occasionally culling them when you need more.

That said, they have not written anything whether the egg rafts respawn somehow (and if then I overlooked it). But I assume they would have to respawn for it to work, otherwise you would again have to expand deeper into Pentapod territory to get more.

But I would still not know how to exactly automate the process; because since they only drop from the egg rafts and not from the pentapods, you would have to destroy the egg rafts. And with the current methods I can only imagine doing that by simply waiting until by chance the pentapods expand with a new egg raft too close to one of your existing turrets which then blasts it away. And then a bunch of logistic bots picking the eggs up and getting it to where it belongs.



But anyway, my flamethrowers will be ready for them.

I like the Gleba fauna's disturbing alienness. Also the mechanics, strengths and weaknesses of each creature make a lot of sense, even if I will miss the walls' absolute protection (I'm something of a turtle myself).

Just one thing seems off : the Wrigglers' feet seem to glide on the ground. Normally, when a creature has legs and feet, the feet don't glide on the ground while they wander around. The way they move on the ground makes them look like some kind of ice skating creatures. Especially visible on the dedicated Wrigglers video.

Super Cool!
Actually, after about 10 years of playing Factorio for thousands of hours and playing most of the mods, it's very hard for me to be motivated to play more. But with upgrades like this, I think after a few years I'll be able to play it like some years ago when I used to play it in holidays easily from 7 am to 1 or 2 am and enjoy it, I want to play it again for hours.

MeduSalem wrote: Fri Aug 16, 2024 12:15 pm From how they wrote it I assumed similar, that one kinda could make something like a "Pentapod nature reserve", and occasionally culling them when you need more.

That said, they have not written anything whether the egg rafts respawn somehow (and if then I overlooked it). But I assume they would have to respawn for it to work, otherwise you would again have to expand deeper into Pentapod territory to get more.

But I would still not know how to exactly automate the process; because since they only drop from the egg rafts and not from the pentapods, you would have to destroy the egg rafts. And with the current methods I can only imagine doing that by simply waiting until by chance the pentapods expand with a new egg raft too close to one of your existing turrets which then blasts it away. And then a bunch of logistic bots picking the eggs up and getting it to where it belongs.



But anyway, my flamethrowers will be ready for them.

Maybe the agriculture tower could be repurposed to "plant" and "harvest" egg rafts?

Koub wrote: Fri Aug 16, 2024 12:18 pm Just one thing seems off : the Wrigglers' feet seem to glide on the ground. Normally, when a creature has legs and feet, the feet don't glide on the ground while they wander around. The way they move on the ground makes them look like some kind of ice skating creatures. Especially visible on the dedicated Wrigglers video.

I think it works when they're moving quicky (e.g. when attacking) as it has a "limbs wildly flailing" vibe to it but I agree it looks odd when they're just pottering about slowly. It may not be much of an issue in practice as you'll likely mostly see them when they've got a narc on anyway...

Very cool and interesting design, as well as mechanics!

Now add a super long centipede enemy that blocks player movement like a wall and can crawl over the defences for maximum panic factor

I also agree with Koub: there is something in the little wrigglers movement that makes it look "icy" and less like something moving, more like something uncontrollably flopping around.

It would be also very cool to see some galloping animations for pentapods.

And when it comes to "difficulty": I think an approach with "area difficulty" could work, where some easier to access areas have weaker enemies while some other, late-game areas have more high-level enemies (more and higher evolved stompers). It would introduce natural progression where harder to get items and late game content is placed in a harder to access and more dangerous area, just like in MMOs!

gnutrino wrote: Fri Aug 16, 2024 12:26 pm

MeduSalem wrote: Fri Aug 16, 2024 12:15 pm From how they wrote it I assumed similar, that one kinda could make something like a "Pentapod nature reserve", and occasionally culling them when you need more.

That said, they have not written anything whether the egg rafts respawn somehow (and if then I overlooked it). But I assume they would have to respawn for it to work, otherwise you would again have to expand deeper into Pentapod territory to get more.

But I would still not know how to exactly automate the process; because since they only drop from the egg rafts and not from the pentapods, you would have to destroy the egg rafts. And with the current methods I can only imagine doing that by simply waiting until by chance the pentapods expand with a new egg raft too close to one of your existing turrets which then blasts it away. And then a bunch of logistic bots picking the eggs up and getting it to where it belongs.



But anyway, my flamethrowers will be ready for them.

Maybe the agriculture tower could be repurposed to "plant" and "harvest" egg rafts?

yeeeeeeeeee

but genetically modified egg rafts so that you dont get wrigglers or whatever they are all over your base

The Phoenixian wrote: Fri Aug 16, 2024 11:14 am Just one look and I immediately find myself thinking "hunh, are these things inspiration for Spidertron and the rocket turret in the expansion?"

If communicating that the spidertron is moving to Gleba was an intended part of their design, it works.

The pollution and aggression changes also sound neat. It makes sense that enemies that evolved on different worlds would react to different stiumi. Not sure if you'll have enemies on other worlds with their own reactions, but if you do, I look forward to seeing what you came up with.

They mentioned that the rocket turret is from Gleba and (in the FFF introducing the rocket turret) that it's probably required for/related to the spidertron in the expansion, so that seems like a pretty safe bet. It makes sense, both thematically and in terms of being especially useful on Gleba in case you need to rustle up some more eggs while you're off-planet.

As for pollution, I think it's a pretty safe bet that at least the other two revealed worlds will have unique mechanics, because they both have the same "would you even notice pollution in this environment?" vibe - Fulgora being an arid wasteland full of trash and seas of oil, Vulcanus having an atmosphere that seems to be mainly composed of sulfuric acid vents. My guess is that Fulgora's wildlife will be electroreceptive, since it plays to the theme (maybe you can use lightning towers or power lines to bait them into concentrating on certain areas?) and Vulcanus might be motion-sensitive?

gnutrino wrote: Fri Aug 16, 2024 12:26 pm Maybe the agriculture tower could be repurposed to "plant" and "harvest" egg rafts?

I think eggs will be produced in the biochamber... so in theory you have to harves one manually to craft a biochamber and then with that chamber you can produe more. The issue is that if you don't process them fast enough they will hatch on your belts and thus cause damage. That part of factory production line will need to include turrets in the design in case any enemy spawns as a byproduct. Not a big deal, taken individually those are not a big threat.

Imagine PvP scenarios but instead of trying to attack directly you just sneak eggs into the enemy trains to hatch later.

I love it! Interesting design and I like the addition of swarm spawns when killing a larger enemy.
One thing that put me off immediately on sight was the animation of the heads though. They look so mechanical, which is fine for the spidertron, but for the spidery look its too.. I don't know, too much a reminder that internally this is a spidertron with pentapod-armor on top.

But keep up the good work, Awesome stuff.

If it's required to manually kill pentapods to set foot on the land and bootstrap automatic farming, you did the right thing to make them passive in the first place and very weak at arrival.

I'm not the guy who enjoys battles, so when I started with Factorio, I did turn off enemies completely to be able to focus on game mechanics. For some reason, I realized there's something missing with deactivated enemies, so I reactivated them in later maps. Today, I'm fine with the occasional battle, but focus is 'occasional'.
Passive enemies can be attacked when I'm ready for it and feel like it, and can be left alone if I don't feel like it. I hope all new enemies don't force me to do fighting when I rather go building. I need control, I can't stand if enemies start to bite down my factory.

Have you already translated enemy names?
For German language, I propose this:
pentapod: Pentafüßer, Fünffüßer
wriggler: Zappler
strafer: Schreiter
Stomper: Stampfer

Right, I also noticed the Wrigglers sliding and the Stomper's legs sometimes intersecting with one another, but imo it's not that noticeable and other than that the enemies look great

malecord wrote: Fri Aug 16, 2024 12:53 pm I think eggs will be produced in the biochamber... so in theory you have to harves one manually to craft a biochamber and then with that chamber you can produe more. The issue is that if you don't process them fast enough they will hatch on your belts and thus cause damage. That part of factory production line will need to include turrets in the design in case any enemy spawns as a byproduct. Not a big deal, taken individually those are not a big threat.

Certainly seems like a possibility

MeduSalem wrote: Fri Aug 16, 2024 12:15 pm

The Phoenixian wrote: Fri Aug 16, 2024 12:02 pmFrom the writeup, it sounds like this time there should be ways to sustainably farm the aliens in a single area this time with a mix of intentionally letting eggs spoil/hatch and what I'd assume are deconstruction orders via roboport or spidertron instead of the expansionist looting for alien-artifact-era biters on Nauvis.

So in that sense we've moved from the ignore/exterminate dichotomy to... colonial exploitation? (We continue to be The Worst, and the way that typically prosocial mechanics and ideas like green technology and sustainability are used to fuel that excess is a fascinating approach to character building through mechanics alone.)

From how they wrote it I assumed similar, that one kinda could make something like a "Pentapod nature reserve", and occasionally culling them when you need more.

That said, they have not written anything whether the egg rafts respawn somehow (and if then I overlooked it). But I assume they would have to respawn for it to work, otherwise you would again have to expand deeper into Pentapod territory to get more.

But I would still not know how to exactly automate the process; because since they only drop from the egg rafts and not from the pentapods, you would have to destroy the egg rafts. And with the current methods I can only imagine doing that by simply waiting until by chance the pentapods expand with a new egg raft too close to one of your existing turrets which then blasts it away. And then a bunch of logistic bots picking the eggs up and getting it to where it belongs.



But anyway, my flamethrowers will be ready for them.

I feel like whatever harvesting method is available wouldn't be nearly so at the mercy of the outside factors. The simplest form I can imagine would be that some of the eggs that hatch reach whatever part of the pentapod life cycle capable of laying eggs, find a spot to lay eggs and do so, and then the new egg rafts can be harvested, with some of the early bioscience making it possible to persuade that to happen when and where you want. (pheromonal controls or somesuch)

I'm not sure whether the devs would put automated blueprint orders in vanilla, but if they do, I could see it being behind bioscience as a tool to make standing deconstruction orders for automated harvesting.

That said, whatever bioscience automation they're hinting at could easily be entirely different. Putting egg production as a multi step process inside the biochamber, and needing it to keep using up eggs before they "spoil" or risk hatchings would fit "automation but with some risk" for instance.

I expect the need for eggs will be handled similarly to creep in Krastorio 2. In K2, the biter nests spawn creep around them, and you need to harvest the creep in order to make military science. But after only 2-3 techs, you can research the ability to create creep automatically in your factory, using a little bit to grow more. Then you don't need to harvest it from the biters anymore. I expect we will get something similar here, with the added spiciness of dealing with the eggs that hatch before we can use them...

This is amazing and exactly what I've been waiting months to learn about! I especially love the idea that I have to "guard" one of my own conveyor belt lines in case the eggs hatch randomly!

I only hope that overall, combat was expanded just as much as the factory building aspects of the game. I really enjoy the fact that I have to build my own military supply chain, but in the base game I don't always have enough enemies to fight with them.

I really hope the final planet (there's still one more we haven't seen, right?) has the largest challenge, even upon landing, so you have to go in fully equipped. I even suggested on the forums a year or so ago about a "Raid" planet where its only a matter of time until you get overrun, so it's about how long you last, and how many vital resources you get off-world before then. Then you blast off and land on another part of the planet to try again. I understand that's a major departure from Factorio and can't imagine the team went with something of that nature, but at the very least I hope we get some form of higher level combat.

And I 100% agree that in order to keep new (and stronger) enemies uncontroversial in the game, 2.0 needs to work with enemies disabled (or at least peaceful mode). I never use it personally but I do think it is an essential component to the game for many.

Also, ALSO-- the pentapods shown were only the SMALLEST variant???

Really cool to see the new planet alive ! Sounds like an interesting an unique new enemy we will have to think of new ways to fight against !

LEGGY
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