Factorio Forums

Problem

Pickaxe tool is:

• Not very interesting.
• Basically mandatory.
• Easy to craft.
• Occasionally forgotten by new players, greatly slowing down their game from the very start.

Suggestion

Get rid of it entirely.

It could also be a built in tool that you don't have to craft (but can upgrade through tech to make it faster, emulating the Steel Pickaxe)

Something could be said about making it better/more fun, but seeing as that involves more work, simply removing it would be good enough for now. If anyone has suggestions to improve it, please share


Motivation

I don't see a benefit to having this tool.

For "experienced" players, the very existence of the Pickaxe only comes to your mind a couple of times: new game, reaching steel, whenever it breaks. Even then, you simply create another one in a second and forget it.

For new players, it can sometimes causes confusion as to why the game is so slow.

Basically it does not add fun, and can be very demotivating if you don't know you must have one (a quick forum search reveals a few posts where people didn't realize why their mine/deconstruct time was so slow)

I'm going to have to agree with this. The only reason it exists is to punish player for mining themselves, however until you get construction robots and the blueprint/demolitions tech, you are beholden to it for everything, including correcting manufacturing layouts and moving walls.

It can easily be replaced with a fatigue bar, where your mining speed drops to almost nothing when it drains, and it only drains when mining. No other situation needs to punish the player as you are refining how you play the game, not trying to cheat the system by getting resources without pollution.

Agreed. The current tool implementation is rather lacking.

Agreed. I never gave any thought to it, but gameplay wise, it's probably only an improvement. It's such a minor element to the game for anyone who knows the basics, yet can be a major hindrance to new players.

I'd make it be included in the recipe for the electric miner. Other than that yeah.

I also agree and propose fixing the problem by making the pickaxe just an upgrade that when researched improves mining speed rather than being a tool. May also want to look into calling the steel tools upgrade to explain why it speeds up all mining speeds.

Agree it serves no purpose other than to be a very minor nuisance

Also agreed, the focus of the game is not about mining by hand anyway. If Minecraft wouldn't be a thing I doubt it'd be there in the first place.

And yeah, this also slowed my first game down quite a bit. If the devs have any interest in making the early game get more interesting faster this would be a good place to start. Let's be honest, hoping that people skip the start of your game in a let's play is suboptimal. You want to grip people right from the start.

Hm. Wouldn't it make sense to join this pick axe thread into the early game thread here?

I Like the pickaxe tool and it's use. Later in the game it seems unimportant, but at early game is a cool feature (IMO)

ssilk wrote:Hm. Wouldn't it make sense to join this pick axe thread into the early game thread here?

I don't think so. while both threads deal with early game the other one concentrates on coal burning and a bit more controversial to boot.



This one, I believe, has a clear winner in form of upgrades instead of perishable tools.

+1 for removal.

The literally only good thing pickaxe adds to the game is the small buff when you upgrade from iron to steel.

I see it as a placeholder for more interesting things to come. Sure, the mechanic at the moment isn't interesting at all, but i don't think it is that bothersome, except maybe for new players who don't know better. Maybe tell them about it in a tool tip? I don't know if it's a good idea to remove the pickaxe now and add it again when the mechanic gets an upgrade (which is sure to come sooner or later). Don't forget there's always a bit of a "testing" aspect, if that mechanic is still working correctly with other changes in the game.

BTW, pickaxes stack. As soon as i get to steel, i just craft 5 of them and never ever have to look after them again; and even if, new stack of five.

Another solution would be simply not making the pickaxe or other future 'tools' degrade with use. This way, you can keep some kind of mining/chopping/pulling up buildings speed 'progression' while removing the slightly annoying mechanic of the tools falling apart.

ssilk wrote:Hm. Wouldn't it make sense to join this pick axe thread into the early game thread here?

You're the mod @ssilk, feel free to join it if you want.

I already got my point across, so I'm happy either way.

Yemala wrote:Another solution would be simply not making the pickaxe or other future 'tools' degrade with use. This way, you can keep some kind of mining/chopping/pulling up buildings speed 'progression' while removing the slightly annoying mechanic of the tools falling apart.

Yes. Instead of just removing the pick axe (which is a stupid name, why can I cut trees whith a pick axe? We had there already a discussion about renaming: https://forums.factorio.com/forum/vie ... f=6&t=1997 ) I would prefer that I can switch different game creation progress at start.

What might be unknown is, that till v0.6 or v0.7 (?) you had just two iron plates. No burner, no furnace in your rucksack.

So, before I start the game, I would like to choose some beginning items. Or even none.

I'm nearly sure we already had that, but couldn't find it.

Agreed. It is a slightly pointless object which may only serve to confuse new players. They may spend a while trying to chop down a tree or dig up some ore, not realizing that they can build a pick, and come to the conclusion that the game is tedious.

I would just make the basic iron pick the default. You start with it and it doesn't go away. You can still make steel picks etcetera to improve your speed, but the iron pick as an object which must be crafted, just kinda gets in the way.

I actually like the pick. I think it's a good transition from people familiar with minecraft/terraria etc so they can quickly see how to gather resources and use the crafting menu.
I do agree that there needs be more information shown when you try to mine without one though. Perhaps along with tooltips having the tool placeholder flash red would help as a reminder.

campos.ddc wrote:Problem

Pickaxe tool is:

• Not very interesting.
• Basically mandatory.
• Easy to craft.
• Occasionally forgotten by new players, greatly slowing down their game from the very start.

Let me strike down the "problems with the pickaxe"

• It's not supposed to be interesting, you're not going to use it much after the first five minutes of the game.
• So is the stone furnace, is it a bad thing? No.
• Why is that a problem, do you want to spend 20 minutes building something that isn't interesting?
• If only there was some type of tutorial that could teach players how to play the game, oh right THERE IS ONE IN THE CAMPAIGN TAB. If a new player knows nothing about how to play the game, it's their fault for not playing the tutorial.

Leave the pick alone, you don't even use after the first 5 minutes why is it such a big deal?

Bobdafilter wrote:

campos.ddc wrote:Problem

Pickaxe tool is:

• Not very interesting.
• Basically mandatory.
• Easy to craft.
• Occasionally forgotten by new players, greatly slowing down their game from the very start.

Let me strike down the "problems with the pickaxe"

• It's not supposed to be interesting, you're not going to use it much after the first five minutes of the game.
• So is the stone furnace, is it a bad thing? No.
• Why is that a problem, do you want to spend 20 minutes building something that isn't interesting?
• If only there was some type of tutorial that could teach players how to play the game, oh right THERE IS ONE IN THE CAMPAIGN TAB. If a new player knows nothing about how to play the game, it's their fault for not playing the tutorial.

Leave the pick alone, you don't even use after the first 5 minutes why is it such a big deal?

Agree