More entities ought to have equipment grids.

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adamwong246
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More entities ought to have equipment grids.

Post by adamwong246 »

TL;DR
I wish individual entities, like turrets, were more customizable via an equipment grid.
What ?
More entities ought to implement equipment grids, specifically turrets. Rather than unlocking higher tiers of turrets, you should unlock higher tiers of equipment modules _for_ turrets. So instead of ExtendedRangeMark3RocketTurrets, you have plain old AmmoTurrets which you add to it's equipment grid 3 ExtendedRange modules and a Rocket Ammo module. This mod https://mods.factorio.com/mod/equipment-gantry shows it's possible to automate this process. This does not preclude the possibility of "mark2, mark3" entities, it simply allows another path forward.
Why ?
1) decluttering your recipe book
When adding new entities, either through modding or through research, you end up with a lot of very similar recipes. For instance, through mods you can add a million varieties of of turrets, each with their own range, efficiency, ammo, etc. (for instance https://mods.factorio.com/mod/scattergun_turret) It makes you recipe book very "busy".

2) flexibility and more opportunities for tech tree progression
Each of these turret equipment modules can be researched to higher tiers, so now you have many more technologies to research. You can put all your research into the areas that interest you. So if you want "sniper" turrets with long range and slow speed, all you need to do is research those techs and unlock those turret modules.

3) Increased complexity
Now you not only have to make the turret and the ammo, you need to make and install modules into individual turrets.

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Re: More entities ought to have equipment grids.

Post by ssilk »

I don’t think that it is a good idea yet, because you don’t mention how to automate the change of the EG.

Blueprints: currently EG is not part of it.
Smart copy via shift-left/right mouse: EG is not part of it.
Upgrade-planner: dito

I don’t want to change the EG of hundreds of turrets by hand. How?
Cool suggestion: Eatable MOUSE-pointers.
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Re: More entities ought to have equipment grids.

Post by Bilka »

ssilk wrote:
Fri Feb 19, 2021 7:28 am
Smart copy via shift-left/right mouse: EG is not part of it.
It is for the spidertron.
I'm an admin over at https://wiki.factorio.com. Feel free to contact me if there's anything wrong (or right) with it.

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Re: More entities ought to have equipment grids.

Post by Optera »

Even if you leave it up to mods to add grids to vehicles.
I'm all for making spidertron specific code available for the general vehicle prototypes.

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Re: More entities ought to have equipment grids.

Post by adamwong246 »

I don’t want to change the EG of hundreds of turrets by hand. How?
I was thinking of this last night I have a crazy-sounding idea that will sound more sane as I explain it.

For the most part, factorio doesn't really allow individualized items. AFAIK, you can
1) Add speed, prod or eff modules
2) You can customize it's equipment grid.

So, just for a moment, lets _imagine_ that we get rid of both modules AND equipment grids and replace them with _Surfaces_. Now, every entity has a Surface you can enter and acts like an idealized space "inside" the entity.

https://mods.factorio.com/mod/Spiderissmo
https://mods.factorio.com/mod/MobileFactorissimo
https://mods.factorio.com/mod/Factorissimo2

So instead of adding a speed module to an entity via a notch on the gui, now you "enter" the entity's surface and install it on a full-fledged factorio surface. If you want to install what-used-be-called-grid-equipment on the entity, you now do that on the entity's surface, rather than it's equipment grid.

These surfaces are of course blueprintable and should be upgradeable just as ordinary surfaces are.

I'm told having interlinked surfaces is bad for performance though.

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Re: More entities ought to have equipment grids.

Post by Xorimuth »

Optera wrote:
Fri Feb 19, 2021 12:03 pm
Even if you leave it up to mods to add grids to vehicles.
I'm all for making spidertron specific code available for the general vehicle prototypes.
You can do that already: https://mods.factorio.com/mod/Equipment ... sticModule
My mods
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Re: More entities ought to have equipment grids.

Post by Optera »

Xorimuth wrote:
Fri Feb 19, 2021 5:12 pm
Optera wrote:
Fri Feb 19, 2021 12:03 pm
Even if you leave it up to mods to add grids to vehicles.
I'm all for making spidertron specific code available for the general vehicle prototypes.
You can do that already: https://mods.factorio.com/mod/Equipment ... sticModule
You can do anything, by rewriting it in lua.
My point is the functionality already is implemented in base exclusively for spidertron.

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Re: More entities ought to have equipment grids.

Post by Xorimuth »

Optera wrote:
Fri Feb 19, 2021 7:18 pm
Xorimuth wrote:
Fri Feb 19, 2021 5:12 pm
Optera wrote:
Fri Feb 19, 2021 12:03 pm
Even if you leave it up to mods to add grids to vehicles.
I'm all for making spidertron specific code available for the general vehicle prototypes.
You can do that already: https://mods.factorio.com/mod/Equipment ... sticModule
You can do anything, by rewriting it in lua.
My point is the functionality already is implemented in base exclusively for spidertron.
Sorry, I got the wrong mod. I mixed up equipment grid and logistic tabs and meant to link the mod that adds equipment grids to all vehicles, which is what this thread is wanting. Had I found the correct mod, I’d have realised that you wrote it :D

Yes, support for all vehicles to have a proper logistics tab would be cool, but not what this thread is asking for because vehicle equipment grids are already supported by the engine.
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Content: Freight Forwarding | Spidertron Patrols | Spidertron Enhancements | Power Overload
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Re: More entities ought to have equipment grids.

Post by Optera »

Logistics are not the only spidertron exclusive. Other entities can't copy equipment grids between entities either.

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Re: More entities ought to have equipment grids.

Post by ssilk »

adamwong246 wrote:
Fri Feb 19, 2021 5:09 pm
So, just for a moment, lets _imagine_ that we get rid of both modules AND equipment grids and replace them with _Surfaces_. Now, every entity has a Surface you can enter and acts like an idealized space "inside" the entity.
That is a very good idea, but you’re not the first. :)
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=75618 Replace the equipment grid with a surface

Please continue discussion there if you like.

Bilka wrote:
Fri Feb 19, 2021 7:39 am
ssilk wrote:
Fri Feb 19, 2021 7:28 am
Smart copy via shift-left/right mouse: EG is not part of it.
It is for the spidertron.
Yes, but only for that. This is more about other entities, especially turrets.
Cool suggestion: Eatable MOUSE-pointers.
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Re: More entities ought to have equipment grids.

Post by adamwong246 »

Thank you for bringing this to my attention.

Last thing I will point out: you actually CAN make a turret with an equipment-grid, it just goes by another name: "Spidertron-consuming-ammo."

I am beginning to think that the Spidertron ought to be the base for all machines.
Spidertron with zero legs and a gun = turret.
Spidertron with zero legs and a recipe = assembling-machine
Spidertron with 1 leg and no gun = car

Maybe everything should just be variations of spidertrons :?:

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Re: More entities ought to have equipment grids.

Post by Optera »

adamwong246 wrote:
Sat Feb 20, 2021 5:14 pm
Thank you for bringing this to my attention.

Last thing I will point out: you actually CAN make a turret with an equipment-grid, it just goes by another name: "Spidertron-consuming-ammo."

I am beginning to think that the Spidertron ought to be the base for all machines.
Spidertron with zero legs and a gun = turret.
Spidertron with zero legs and a recipe = assembling-machine
Spidertron with 1 leg and no gun = car

Maybe everything should just be variations of spidertrons :?:
Abusing the crap out of prototypes is the way mods do things for years 8-)

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