Factorio Forums

TL;DR

When putting down a blueprint I can hold shift and the bots will knock out the trees. I'd like them to do this when manually laying out train rails.

What ?

When laying out train rails by hand and there is a tree in the way, or possibly a forest. I'd like to hold shift and my personal construction bots will fly out, chop the trees out as well as blow up the cliffs. Just like thy do when constructing a blueprint. I don't need them to lay the rails, I'm taking care of that. Just clear the way for me. (Clear out only where the green ghost rail is red.)

Why ?

Because, while doing manual rail layouts, your busy trying to link things up and that little dude can't chop trees very fast. Also its tough to hold the rails in one hand and control the dude with the other.

-jim lee

What happens if you hold shift as you place the rail (ghost placing) and there is a tree or cliff in the way? (I can't try it right now, not at computer)

My understanding is that it should place a ghost of the one piece of rail just like a blueprint would. So I would expect the bots behavior to be the same.

I think it does if you're ghost placing in smart track mode, but not if you're in direct placement mode.
Also, I do miss being able to just place curves directly.

bobingabout wrote: ↑Thu Apr 04, 2019 8:00 am I think it does if you're ghost placing in smart track mode, but not if you're in direct placement mode.
Also, I do miss being able to just place curves directly.

It does. Every time I'm laying tracks and hit a forest I have to switch to ghost placing in smart track mode. Placing curves in a forest is just painful without marking the offending trees with X first and only the smart track mode does that.

+1 for shift adding deconstruction marks when straight placing tracks.

mrvn wrote: ↑Thu Apr 04, 2019 9:31 am

bobingabout wrote: ↑Thu Apr 04, 2019 8:00 am I think it does if you're ghost placing in smart track mode, but not if you're in direct placement mode.
Also, I do miss being able to just place curves directly.

It does. Every time I'm laying tracks and hit a forest I have to switch to ghost placing in smart track mode. Placing curves in a forest is just painful without marking the offending trees with X first and only the smart track mode does that.

+1 for shift adding deconstruction marks when straight placing tracks.

With the copy-paste function its easy to work around.....

- switch to map view
- copy a similar trak-part from map
- plonk this temporary copy where you need this

nosports wrote: ↑Thu Apr 04, 2019 10:19 am

mrvn wrote: ↑Thu Apr 04, 2019 9:31 am

bobingabout wrote: ↑Thu Apr 04, 2019 8:00 am I think it does if you're ghost placing in smart track mode, but not if you're in direct placement mode.
Also, I do miss being able to just place curves directly.

It does. Every time I'm laying tracks and hit a forest I have to switch to ghost placing in smart track mode. Placing curves in a forest is just painful without marking the offending trees with X first and only the smart track mode does that.

+1 for shift adding deconstruction marks when straight placing tracks.

With the copy-paste function its easy to work around.....

- switch to map view
- copy a similar trak-part from map
- plonk this temporary copy where you need this

I do have a blueprint of a curved rail for that. Still sucks having to switch to that and back.

It sounds like what people want is the ability to hold shift while manually placing rails to place said rails (still using the manual methodology?) as ghosts with appropriate marking to remove trees, etc...?

Or possibly just the ability to switch between smart track mode and manual mode by pressing shift rather then having to back out of track placement? Trying to get a better handle on exactly what is wanted and how it should perform. Bots can't help unless you're placing ghosts.

Darinth wrote: ↑Thu Apr 04, 2019 1:28 pm It sounds like what people want is the ability to hold shift while manually placing rails to place said rails (still using the manual methodology?) as ghosts with appropriate marking to remove trees, etc...?

Or possibly just the ability to switch between smart track mode and manual mode by pressing shift rather then having to back out of track placement? Trying to get a better handle on exactly what is wanted and how it should perform. Bots can't help unless you're placing ghosts.

I think the difficulty of holding shift pressed down to do the regular laying of a ghost rail is that the particular action is already being used for the placement of a long rail segment.

So perhaps the idea of a toggle between regular and ghost rail is an easier and safer change. As a toggle for rail would likely be turned on and left that way for extended periods of time, it does not need to be conveniently placed and so it would not need to be <shift>... it could be an entirely different and currently unused key.

zOldBulldog wrote: ↑Thu Apr 04, 2019 1:48 pm I think the difficulty of holding shift pressed down to do the regular laying of a ghost rail is that the particular action is already being used for the placement of a long rail segment.

So perhaps the idea of a toggle between regular and ghost rail is an easier and safer change. As a toggle for rail would likely be turned on and left that way for extended periods of time, it does not need to be conveniently placed and so it would not need to be <shift>... it could be an entirely different and currently unused key.

Currently:
Normal-Clicking to start track placement does manual placement.
Shift-clicking to start track placement does smart placement.

Holding down shift after starting is irrelevant. If you start in manual mode, it stays in manual mode. If you start in smart mode it stays in smart mode. Shift could be implemented as a toggle, such that once you start and release shift, holding it down again would swap mode. It's technically functional, but I worry about it confusing people as it'd be inconsistent UI that would be regularly encountered.

Another key could be used as a toggle, but then we end up with low discoverability... I'm unsure which is worse in this case.

Darinth wrote: ↑Thu Apr 04, 2019 2:13 pm

zOldBulldog wrote: ↑Thu Apr 04, 2019 1:48 pm I think the difficulty of holding shift pressed down to do the regular laying of a ghost rail is that the particular action is already being used for the placement of a long rail segment.

So perhaps the idea of a toggle between regular and ghost rail is an easier and safer change. As a toggle for rail would likely be turned on and left that way for extended periods of time, it does not need to be conveniently placed and so it would not need to be <shift>... it could be an entirely different and currently unused key.

Currently:
Normal-Clicking to start track placement does manual placement.
Shift-clicking to start track placement does smart placement.

Holding down shift after starting is irrelevant. If you start in manual mode, it stays in manual mode. If you start in smart mode it stays in smart mode. Shift could be implemented as a toggle, such that once you start and release shift, holding it down again would swap mode. It's technically functional, but I worry about it confusing people as it'd be inconsistent UI that would be regularly encountered.

Another key could be used as a toggle, but then we end up with low discoverability... I'm unsure which is worse in this case.

I would even be fine if shift-click on manual placement would just mark the trees and stones for deconstruction and nothing else.

A good example of what I'm talking about would be how it works laying pipes by hand. Run into a tree? Hold shift and the bots take care of the problem.

-jim lee

hi,

+1

Edit : 0.17.29

Simplified rail building. Holding shift while rail building always activates the combination of ghost-rail-building + remove-obstacles, releasing shift returns back to normal manual mode. It doesn't matter anymore, whether the rail building started with shift or not. This removed the possibility to do ghost-rail-building without the remove-obstacles, but since it seems to be almost useless, we consider it to be worth the simplification.

looks like the feature has been added like i was hopping, thanks to the game staff