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Cliff explosives should undo placed landfill destroy ores
Posted: Mon Sep 03, 2018 10:16 am
by imTheSupremeOne
TL;DR
Change cliff explosion to something like a Terrain Explosion that will also destroy ore patches , remove dead corpses and spawners... and great potential use in future.
What ?
TL;DR probably is very self explainable... But if you wander:
- Somethimes you just need to destroy that little stone ore patch for aesthetic purposes of your base;
- If you are not planning to make corpses "rot" by itself, explosion can be a fun idea for this;
- can be somehow used in future. (For example changing look of terrain, biome...)
Re: From cliff explosives to removing ores and removing placed landfill
Posted: Fri Oct 25, 2019 1:51 am
by imTheSupremeOne
Upd from new year)): you can also make that it's removing placed landfill. Vanilla Factorio really lack this feature to at least correct your mistakes with placed landfill.
It's also would make single-purposed item much more interesting.
Re: From cliff explosives to removing ores and removing placed landfill
Posted: Tue Nov 12, 2019 9:25 am
by Kirk
Came here to suggest allowing the use of Cliff Explosives (possibly renamed to something like Explosive Charge) to destroy my mortal enemies,
the rocks 
Re: From cliff explosives to removing ores and removing placed landfill
Posted: Tue Nov 12, 2019 8:05 pm
by ssilk
In a multiplyer-game a reason for abuse.
PS: wander => wonder
Re: From cliff explosives to removing ores and removing placed landfill
Posted: Wed Nov 13, 2019 10:16 pm
by Kirk
I guess for ore, yeah... but I personally only care about quickly ending the presence of my mortal enemies.
- rock.jpg (94.13 KiB) Viewed 5725 times
PS: Multiplyer => Multiplayer
Re: Cliff explosives should undo placed landfill destroy ores
Posted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 5:24 am
by imTheSupremeOne
Re: Cliff explosives should undo placed landfill destroy ores
Posted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 8:01 am
by planetmaker
Removing land in general is an incredibly powerful defencive tool.
Removing landfill, thus land which has been player-placed, falls in the same category, even when it is not as dramatic. Still it opens easy-peasy defence build-up around a lake: build a street to the other side, build poles, maybe underground belts and roboports, and setup a defence + arty outpost at the other side. Then remove the landbridge again and leave the outpost robo-supplied. You'd never have been able to get such advanced outpost without hacking through loads of biters when going around.
While I also wish sometimes there to be a way to correct mistakes with landfill, I do believe that adding that option is a serious balancing issue and would reduce difficulty a lot. As such... use /editor in console and re-add water where you need, then switch back to normal play by /editor again. You loose the possibility to gain further achievements on that map... but I only need that when I got all achievements I want
I totally don't get the need to remove ores via explosvives in normal game... that's an editor option, too, though.
Re: Cliff explosives should undo placed landfill destroy ores
Posted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 11:05 am
by fiery_salmon
This would get more people unhappy (about lost resources) than happy (that you can get rid of ore patch).
If you dislike resource patches you may fairly easy to mine them out.
Re: Cliff explosives should undo placed landfill destroy ores
Posted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 11:58 am
by Nemo4809
planetmaker wrote: ↑Sun Feb 16, 2020 8:01 am
Removing landfill, thus land which has been player-placed, falls in the same category, even when it is not as dramatic. Still it opens easy-peasy defence build-up around a lake: build a street to the other side, build poles, maybe underground belts and roboports, and setup a defence + arty outpost at the other side. Then remove the landbridge again and leave the outpost robo-supplied. You'd never have been able to get such advanced outpost without hacking through loads of biters when going around.
You can already do that though. You can have bots place landfill in water with no connection to land.
You are only limited by roboport range. If you have 9 personal roboports equipped, the range is 120x120 - although that's probably overkill when the 110x110 of a regular roboport (about 53 tile reach) should be more than sufficient - and you can always extend that range if you build a roboport at exactly 50 tiles away.
Re: Cliff explosives should undo placed landfill destroy ores
Posted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 2:49 pm
by imTheSupremeOne
planetmaker wrote: ↑Sun Feb 16, 2020 8:01 am
Removing land in general is an incredibly powerful defencive tool.
Removing landfill, thus land which has been player-placed, falls in the same category, even when it is not as dramatic. Still it opens easy-peasy defence build-up around a lake: build a street to the other side, build poles, maybe underground belts and roboports, and setup a defence + arty outpost at the other side. Then remove the landbridge again and leave the outpost robo-supplied. You'd never have been able to get such advanced outpost without hacking through loads of biters when going around.
While I also wish sometimes there to be a way to correct mistakes with landfill, I do believe that adding that option is a serious balancing issue and would reduce difficulty a lot. As such... use /editor in console and re-add water where you need, then switch back to normal play by /editor again. You loose the possibility to gain further achievements on that map... but I only need that when I got all achievements I want
I totally don't get the need to remove ores via explosvives in normal game... that's an editor option, too, though.
In vanilla, either default or deathworld standart preset biters are actually not that big of a thread... And even if you do that now, without removing landfill you still could place an unpenetrable defence since you could build a defence all around that small path the range 16-24 (more than Behemoth spitter can spit), and more than 180* defence of turrets firing all at once in the entering point of your your part. This should melt anything.
Re: Cliff explosives should undo placed landfill destroy ores
Posted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 2:58 pm
by imTheSupremeOne
fiery_salmon wrote: ↑Sun Feb 16, 2020 11:05 am
This would get more people unhappy (about lost resources) than happy (that you can get rid of ore patch).
If you dislike resource patches you may fairly easy to mine them out.
The lost of resources in for the most things kinda ok, if there will be situation where cliff is over ore patch, but you can just find more...
And I dislike ore patches on my road to walk to remove ore patch with miners you would need to setup mining on your base which is likely to interfere with already built factories and factories that you want to build for quite some time, even if you are doing it in quick way by chesting ore and destroying chests.
Re: Cliff explosives should undo placed landfill destroy ores
Posted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 3:20 pm
by planetmaker
imTheSupremeOne wrote: ↑Sun Feb 16, 2020 2:58 pm
fiery_salmon wrote: ↑Sun Feb 16, 2020 11:05 am
This would get more people unhappy (about lost resources) than happy (that you can get rid of ore patch).
If you dislike resource patches you may fairly easy to mine them out.
The lost of resources in for the most things kinda ok, if there will be situation where cliff is over ore patch, but you can just find more...
And I dislike ore patches on my road to walk to remove ore patch with miners you would need to setup mining on your base which is likely to interfere with already built factories and factories that you want to build for quite some time, even if you are doing it in quick way by chesting ore and destroying chests.
But there is a solution: just mine it to chests and destroy those. Exploding them by means of cliff explosives would be very very bad and cause for much grief, both in single-player and multi-player. People would constantly destroy ore by accident, trying to mine the complete patch. Then they make space for miners - and the patch is gone. "You can simply find new ones" is also a very relative term... maybe if you play on easy settings with a rich world, it's no issue. It definitely takes time to make new patches usable.
An OCD can be satisfied by a simple mod which modifies cliff explosives or by using the map editor. For general gameplay it'd be a bad solution, causing harm and solving no problem.
Re: Cliff explosives should undo placed landfill destroy ores
Posted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 5:29 pm
by imTheSupremeOne
planetmaker wrote: ↑Sun Feb 16, 2020 3:20 pm
imTheSupremeOne wrote: ↑Sun Feb 16, 2020 2:58 pm
fiery_salmon wrote: ↑Sun Feb 16, 2020 11:05 am
This would get more people unhappy (about lost resources) than happy (that you can get rid of ore patch).
If you dislike resource patches you may fairly easy to mine them out.
The lost of resources in for the most things kinda ok, if there will be situation where cliff is over ore patch, but you can just find more...
And I dislike ore patches on my road to walk to remove ore patch with miners you would need to setup mining on your base which is likely to interfere with already built factories and factories that you want to build for quite some time, even if you are doing it in quick way by chesting ore and destroying chests.
But there is a solution: just mine it to chests and destroy those. Exploding them by means of cliff explosives would be very very bad and cause for much grief, both in single-player and multi-player. People would constantly destroy ore by accident, trying to mine the complete patch. Then they make space for miners - and the patch is gone. "You can simply find new ones" is also a very relative term... maybe if you play on easy settings with a rich world, it's no issue. It definitely takes time to make new patches usable.
An OCD can be satisfied by a simple mod which modifies cliff explosives or by using the map editor. For general gameplay it'd be a bad solution, causing harm and solving no problem.
I see this as an opportunity for griefing for mulitplayer, but it can probably be fixed with some flags... As for singleplayer, I don't think that there will be that great of a loss... I mean, one explosive shouldn't destroy all path, just a small radius... For ores it even can be smaller than the range that explosive clear cliffs.
Re: Cliff explosives should undo placed landfill destroy ores
Posted: Mon Feb 17, 2020 4:16 pm
by winkbrace
I like this idea!
It doesn't require a new item or new recipe and makes a very niche item more useful.
We've all had to build over an ore patch one time while our heart bled. And undoing a misplaced landfill would be an awesome feature too.
Re: Cliff explosives should undo placed landfill destroy ores
Posted: Mon Feb 17, 2020 4:47 pm
by netmand
No thank you.
Clearing corpses I like, but I use cliffs a lot in positioning defense, which means corpses tend to pile up on cliffs. I don't want to destroy cliffs when I go to clear corpses.
And what do you all play with rich resources? With these newest versions of the game I never have patches of any resource I didn't want to mine.