Wall-related suggestions

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Coolthulhu
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Wall-related suggestions

Post by Coolthulhu » Sun Mar 30, 2014 4:08 pm

As anyone who has ever removed a damaged section of walls knows, they all become new items. This would be good if you wanted to repair each wall, but repairing walls costs more than making new ones. By allowing walls to stack like ammo, you'd only have a problem with the last wall in the inventory (which would be left with tiny hp).

Allow repairing walls with walls (or bricks?) instead of repair packs. 3.5 repair packs are worth more than a wall. Make bots do it automatically too.

Change HP indicator for walls. When walls are 2 tiles thick, you can't see if the upper wall is damaged. Maybe even give them separate graphics for damage states.

New graphics for thick walls, so that a thick line of walls looks like a thick line, not a cluster of 4-way connectors.

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Sedado77
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Re: Wall-related suggestions

Post by Sedado77 » Mon Mar 31, 2014 11:39 am

I agree.
I think that walls should change their color or background color to determine the HP they have. I know it will not be so pretty, but it will be functional...

The sprite of the wall needs also a change of face... it doesn't look AS good as the other new grafics! :)

I don't think when you repair that walls should take only 1 space in inv. I like that every wall is a separate entity depending the HP, but i think you should be able to "merge" 2 broken walls into 1 with their convined HP. But not automatically, maybe a crafting option of "Recycled wall" that makes walls with the broken walls you have in your inventory.

:)

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Re: Wall-related suggestions

Post by kovarex » Mon Mar 31, 2014 11:07 pm

I agree, that the walls repair should be cheaper. we plan to create something like "repair cost per hp" to make the wall repair cost smaller while keeping the repair cost for other things balanced. Repairing walls using stones/bricks might be more logical, but I'm afraid it is not worth the juggling with different types of repair packs.

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Re: Wall-related suggestions

Post by kovarex » Mon Mar 31, 2014 11:10 pm

Sedado77 wrote:I don't think when you repair that walls should take only 1 space in inv. I like that every wall is a separate entity depending the HP, but i think you should be able to "merge" 2 broken walls into 1 with their convined HP.
That would make sense for walls, but for some expensive buildings it might be dangerous, we will consider that anyway, maybe allow the "hp stacking" only for certain types of items.
Coolthulhu wrote:New graphics for thick walls, so that a thick line of walls looks like a thick line, not a cluster of 4-way connectors.
Good idea.

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Re: Wall-related suggestions

Post by slay_mithos » Mon Mar 31, 2014 11:55 pm

I personally like the fact that repairing walls is more expansive than replacing them once broken, because both the player and the robots can place new walls in place of the 'ghost' walls.

It lets you choose if you prefer to repair or replace, knowing that repairs costs more, but replacing can be a risk during big attacks.


I do like want the "with" thing for the walls too, because you en up having 2+ walls everywhere, and it does look a bit odd right now. But it's just a graphical thing, so not too high on what I want.

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Re: Wall-related suggestions

Post by Coolthulhu » Tue Apr 01, 2014 1:00 am

Another thing I forgot in first post:
Diagonal walls. It makes sense to make diagonal walls, but diagonal walls look rather ugly (series of disconnected pillars).

Due to the way pathing and collisions work, the most resource efficient way to build walls is making them diagonal. Diagonal walls add that small but important bit of extra distance between biters and turrets at no extra brick cost.
They also have an unintended effects of slightly confusing the biters: they take noticeably (but not significantly) longer to start attacking. They slide slowly against the wall, because their velocity vector is essentially projected on one of the axes (say, wall on left means they can only move up or down). They do this until they reach a corner, get blocked by other biters or just get "frustrated" enough to start attacking. The effect is not noticeable later on, but early on when biters attack in smaller groups and walls are more expensive it makes a difference. Biters also spend slightly more time circling diagonally walled turrets searching for shortest path.

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Re: Wall-related suggestions

Post by kovarex » Tue Apr 01, 2014 9:11 am

The fact, that player can't walk between diagonal walls even when there is a hole is considered a bug, and we will change the collision box logic in a way that it will be passable in the future.

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Sedado77
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Re: Wall-related suggestions

Post by Sedado77 » Tue Apr 01, 2014 12:32 pm

kovarex wrote:
Sedado77 wrote:I don't think when you repair that walls should take only 1 space in inv. I like that every wall is a separate entity depending the HP, but i think you should be able to "merge" 2 broken walls into 1 with their convined HP.
That would make sense for walls, but for some expensive buildings it might be dangerous, we will consider that anyway, maybe allow the "hp stacking" only for certain types of items.
Yeah, only WALLS should be benefited of this!!!!
NOT CARS ABOVE IT ALL. DON'T MAKE THIS FOR CARS!

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Re: Wall-related suggestions

Post by Coolthulhu » Tue Apr 01, 2014 5:41 pm

I only wanted the merging for walls, it wouldn't really make sense for anything that takes a lot of time and effort to craft.
Now that I think about it, simple constructions like furnaces and belts could also benefit from it. It doesn't really make sense to have 3+ inventory slots occupied by damaged buildings that cost less than a single repair pack each. Alternatively, cheap buildings could be repaired for free when picked up, like in older versions.

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Re: Wall-related suggestions

Post by Artman40 » Sun May 25, 2014 9:46 pm

I wish there was an option to automatically repair structures in your inventory so they wouldn't take up extra space for long when picking them up.

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Re: Wall-related suggestions

Post by krux02 » Mon May 26, 2014 1:55 pm

As I already mentioned in my suggestions. I am not happy with the inventory management at all. It feel's poorly engeneered and with all this stacking/non-stacking hassle it's just a pain in the ass like the minecraft inventory. For me the problem is in the inventory, not the walls.

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Re: Wall-related suggestions

Post by Coolthulhu » Tue May 27, 2014 7:22 am

That's an inherent part of slot based inventory. No way to really go around it.
Transition from slot-based inventory to weight-based one would be a rather major change.
Might be worth considering, though.

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Re: Wall-related suggestions

Post by Khyron » Sun Jun 01, 2014 12:07 am

Walls currently don't block light sources. Is that regarded as a bug? It seems a low priority thing but... I often put lights against the walls of my base, especially around rail/car entrances etc. The current light graphic makes it look as if the light is sitting at ground level rather than up on a pole shining down, so it feels like the wall should block it or at least cast a shadow.

But how about making a class of wall that also shines light out in a arc? Spotlights that sweep around and target biters might also be cool.

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